1050 conversions or buy 650

[rjacobs]

Ive been contemplating spending the money to get a 223 and 45acp setup for a 1050. Ive got 2 1050's. Im looking at over a grand when its all said and done with tool heads, shell plates, dies, etc... One of my 1050's is setup and dedicated for brass prep(223 and 300BLK). My other 1050 is currently setup to load 9mm and I have a 300blk head, but I have to raid components(shell plate and case collator) off of my brass prep machine when I load 300BLK.

I think I have come to the conclusion that I can buy an XL650 setup for 223 and 45acp for about the same money. I dont load a TON of 223 or 45 so absolute speed wont really matter. I would probably ALSO move my 300BLK stuff to the 650XL and sell the extra 1050 tool head. I load A LOT of 9mm so I will be keeping the 1050 setup to load 9mm as I can crank 1800+ rounds per hour with the Mr. Bullet Feeder.

The 650 stuff to me is a little confusing as I am used to the 1050's which I have down to a science.

When I buy the machine setup for whatever caliber, does it include the case feed parts for said caliber? Say I buy the machine setup for 45, it will have all the case feeder parts for 45? Or do I have to buy those separate? All the dillon site says is "one caliber conversion kit-installed" and a caliber conversion kit APPEARS to come with all the case feed stuff.

My thought process is to buy the case feeder for large pistol so that I get a large pistol collator plate and I dont duplicate what I already have. I believe I can use my case collator plate from my 1050 for small rifle.

Then I would buy a 223 conversion kit which would come with: shell plate, powder activator funnel, all case feed parts and locator buttons. Is that correct? I would also need a tool head and a powder through die as well as my dies.

Thinking ill go with Dillon dies for 45 as I have had decent luck with their pistol stuff although the Redding Pro series carbide dies look interesting. 223 I will be running a Forster ultra seating die and a Lee FCD(dont need a size die as all my prep takes place on a 1050).

Anybody got any thoughts or advice for this? Or tell me I am an idiot and just spend the money on the setups for the 1050?

[RandyLahey]

well first off I'm jealous of your presses and dilemma. But my 2 cents would be; if you have the $ and space to setup a 650 in addition to your 2 x 1050's, I would indeed go that route. I think you will find yourself using the 650 quite a bit, and I think your rates will still be more than respectable. I have to claim ignorance on all of the extra parts you need, but just wanted to say get the 650 so I can live vicariously through your press whoring (650xl and casefeeder setup coming soon myself).

[BeerBaron]

Yep press comes with everything for the calibre except dies. Have a look at lee pistol dies too. I actually prefer them to dillon.

Yes buy the case feed plate for large pistol. Yes 1050 and 650 case feed plates interchange.

Yes ideally an extra toolhead and powder die is needed to swap cals.

I think it's s good idea.

[rjacobs]

Priced out the 2 conversions for the 1050:

2x tool heads

45 ACP caliber conversion

large primer conversion

223 shell plate(already have 223 powder funnel, #3 buttons, etc...)

45acp dies

223 seating and crimp die

2x powder through die's

large pistol case collator plate

I came to about $100 from buying a 650 with the 223 and 45acp setups.

I love the way the 1050 runs, but for $100 I can just have another machine with the resale value that goes with that. Damn. Tough decision.

[jmorris]

The 650 stuff to me is a little confusing as I am used to the 1050's which I have down to a science.

From this I would suggest you just get a few more 1050's and skip the learning curve.

[rjacobs]

The 650 stuff to me is a little confusing as I am used to the 1050's which I have down to a science.

From this I would suggest you just get a few more 1050's and skip the learning curve.

The thought has crossed my mind.

Not that running or setting up a 650 would be confusing, just the purchasing of small parts since I have never dealt with a 650. 1050's were confusing at first too and I missed buying several important parts like the body die for the swage backup or the lock ring for said swage backup. I love paying $10 in shipping on a 95 cent lock ring. I think they call that an idiot tax.

[Brassaholic13]

The 650 stuff to me is a little confusing as I am used to the 1050's which I have down to a science.

From this I would suggest you just get a few more 1050's and skip the learning curve.

The thought has crossed my mind.

Not that running or setting up a 650 would be confusing, just the purchasing of small parts since I have never dealt with a 650. 1050's were confusing at first too and I missed buying several important parts like the body die for the swage backup or the lock ring for said swage backup. I love paying $10 in shipping on a 95 cent lock ring. I think they call that an idiot tax.

No, I think it's called poor customer service and price gouging.

There's only a few parts that go bad on a 650, and they are warrantied for life. The index ring is the biggest issue. It's a weak part, and always breaks at the same point. You'd think a mechanical engineer could fix it, but apparently not. This part only breaks when primer pull back occurs and the shell plate tries to index. From there, the reversible plastic case slider activator (pistol/rifle) has some threaded inserts that tend to strip out. Those are really the only two issues with parts breakage. Keep springs in stock and you'll be ok. The case slide spring will be the most frequently replaced, followed by the spring that shuttles the case from the drop tube to the case slide.

However, before you spend your money on another press, you may want to consider an auto-drive for what you have.

[rjacobs]

No, I think it's called poor customer service and price gouging.

There's only a few parts that go bad on a 650, and they are warrantied for life. The index ring is the biggest issue. It's a weak part, and always breaks at the same point. You'd think a mechanical engineer could fix it, but apparently not. This part only breaks when primer pull back occurs and the shell plate tries to index. From there, the reversible plastic case slider activator (pistol/rifle) has some threaded inserts that tend to strip out. Those are really the only two issues with parts breakage. Keep springs in stock and you'll be ok. The case slide spring will be the most frequently replaced, followed by the spring that shuttles the case from the drop tube to the case slide.

However, before you spend your money on another press, you may want to consider an auto-drive for what you have.

I already have an auto drive on my brass prep 1050. I havent been able to bring myself to load on that press. I guess I like to feel(such that the feel is on a 1050) when loading and be able to stop if needed anywhere in the stroke.

Every piece of brass that hits my loading press is pre-processed on the auto drive 1050.

[RDA]

There's only a few parts that go bad on a 650, and they are warrantied for life. The index ring is the biggest issue. It's a weak part, and always breaks at the same point. You'd think a mechanical engineer could fix it, but apparently not. This part only breaks when primer pull back occurs and the shell plate tries to index. From there, the reversible plastic case slider activator (pistol/rifle) has some threaded inserts that tend to strip out. Those are really the only two issues with parts breakage. Keep springs in stock and you'll be ok. The case slide spring will be the most frequently replaced, followed by the spring that shuttles the case from the drop tube to the case slide.

I surely don't have nearly as many rounds through my 650 as Bill's experience, but the first item to break on my 650 was my indexing ring (for exactly the reason he stated) and I have replaced the case slide spring as it had gotten weak. I have also replaced the station one case locator when it got beaten up enough that too many cases were hanging up and not sliding easily.

I have lost a couple of small parts or broken them through my own mistakes so the parts kit is very handy to have around and waiting on replacement parts is fine when you are still up and running.

[jmorris]

I already have an auto drive on my brass prep 1050. I havent been able to bring myself to load on that press. I guess I like to feel(such that the feel is on a 1050) when loading and be able to stop if needed anywhere in the stroke.

With that attitude you won't be breaking the index ring on a 650, I never broke one on either of my 650's.

[TDA]

Is a XL650 broken index ring covered under the warranty?

[Guest]

yes, it is covered. If you get the spares kit there is one in there, so just remove and replace the broken one, call Dillon to replenish your spares kit and you are good to go. No cost.

I broke an index ring once, I believe it was due to me tightening the shell plate a little too much to try to reduce the slopping of powder (I was loading SR4756 powder in 38 super). A few hundred rounds into that session I started having case feed issues and found that it was due to the ring being broken and not pushing the case all the way into the shell plate. But, i am trainable and now am more careful about not over tightening the shell plate. Haven't had any issues with it since. That was part of my learning curve with the 650.

[rjacobs]

So is my parts list up top correct if I do order this thing?

[anm2_man]

A picture is worth 1k words.

Don't forget the powder measure for your .223 setup. Also I would recommend you purchase a complete small primer system for the 650. Your machine when ordered will come with a Large primer setup in .45. Its a pain to convert these, All you need to do is swap the primer system and swap the primer punch. But I can't remember if you need to purchase a small primer punch. It may come with the original setup but I can't remember. Maybe some body that just got a new machine.

Good Luck

[technetium-99m]

I don't really want to load on anything other than my 1050. I load a bunch or prep a ton of cases then change the press over. Getting ready to prep 3K 308 cases which should last a while.

[BeerBaron]

The 650 comes with both punches standard.

[Cowboy1629]

Your list looks complete. I've never owned or operated a 1050 so no words of wisdom for you there but I have loaded a lot on the 650 and 550. I agree with others, get the parts kit. Even though everything is covered under the warrantee, waiting for a replacement part to arrive is frustrating even though it is free.

I have broken two indexing rings, one was my fault for forcing it when I had a jam and the second one was just broken when I went to use the machine. Both times it was covered no questions asked. I don't believer I ever broke anything on my 550 but it doesn't get the use my 650 gets now.

As far as having both a small and large complete primer setup never felt the need for that because there really is only one more step involved when changing them out and the is the one screw on the bottom holding the primer disk, change disks and drop in the primer magazine and its converted. I do agree having a spare powder measure assembly is handy, saves you some time of getting your powder charge dialed back in however it's not necessary.

[chrishoesel]

Just my two cents:

Even with me being a newbie to Dillon, you can't beat the following setup in my opinion: (granted it costs more upfront, but you can do it in stages) It also seems you can make your operation a bit more efficient by doing the following:

Set up one 1050 for large primers

Leave the other one set for small primers

Buy the quick change toolhead for every caliber you wish to load (includes the toolhead and powder measure)

Buy the caliber conversion kit for each caliber (I think shellplates are interchangeable between .45acp and .308, and 9mm and .223 - don't quote me on that) The conversions come with a shell plate, locator pins, and I think the feed tube plug.

Buy one large primer conversion kit for one of the 1050's

Get the swage rod backup rods AND body dies for each tool head/caliber

Make sure you get the appropriate powder funnels for each.

Conversions for the MBF for Rifle and pistol calibers are a bit pricey, but they can be done later

Move your 9mm processing and loading over to the dedicated small primer machine

Do all your .45acp and .308 processing and loading on the dedicated large primer machine.

This works best doing large batches of operations, such as processing all that .308 first, then loading it. Then change heads (and possibly shellplates), collator plate and plug and do all your .45 ACP....I'm sure you've thought of this.

I suggest this due to you being familiar with the 1050's. This is how I'm doing it and I've only used them for 3 weeks so far. (work overseas) I processed a huge quantity of brass and reloaded as well. I did a lot of 300AAC conversions as well.

5-10 minute swap between each operation for me. I love the 1050. And I debated purchasing them for over 2 years before I made up my mind to just go "all-in"

If money is an issue, do it one caliber at a time. You already have 2 1050's, I don't think you need a third machine. Although the 650 looks very nice and would be great due to its simplicity. I believe keeping things consistent and standardized is more important, therefore stick with the 1050's, and use them to their full extent.

The 1 year warranty doesn't bother me at all. It's an issue for some and that's cool too. The parts that break are not that expensive given the volume that they're capable of. Unless you're a commercial reloader, I'm sure that Dillon would simply send you some parts if they do indeed break.

I am about to start doing .308, and will be sticking to a 1050 conversion for it as well. (conversion kit, processing head with RT1500, and quick-change toolhead) Pricey, but to me it's worth it due to how everything works so well, and it fits with the way I like to reload. (And I hate reloading).

However, if you're planning on swapping toolheads and calibers a lot, then the 650 is a better fit in all respects, except for swaging. You'd still have to handle each piece of brass for those that need it.

Edited August 20, 2015 by chrishoesel