Have you guys had this problem with OAL before??

[mellow]

Hi all. I'm just about to try out my first batch of reloads. Kinda nervous, you know. First of all here's my data:

230cmj .45acp montana gold bullets

WLP

S&B brass

vhit powder N340 - 5.5 grains (minimum in speer's 13th edition)

oal: 1.26 (as per speer 13th)

Lee carbide factory crimp (3/4 turn)

When measuring oal, I got anywhere from 1.255 to 1.265. This was driving me nuts. Is there something wrong with my seater die?? It's a redding competition. Prior to installing, I disassembled and cleaned with hoppes #9 likes the folks at redding suggested.

Variances in bullet lenth wouldn't have an effect would it? I measured the MG bullets and they did vary in lenth by a few thousands.

Should I be worrying about this variance? Thanks for your help.

[EricW]

First off, I'm glad you're going at reloading cautiously.  

I don't know about the Redding, but other makes of dies have two different seating stems - one for rounded, one for blunt nose.  You might want to check and see if you've got that option.  I accidentally used the wrong one on my 9mm once and couldn't figure out for the life of me why seating was going so poorly.  Bullet lengths do vary, but usually not by .010" in pistol bullets.  Things like hollowpoint rifle bullets *do* vary substantially in OAL (by the nature of how they're formed).  Also, make sure you're actuating the handle on your press fully downward.  It's easy to short stroke a bit and that will influence seating consistency a bit.

That said, .010 spread is no big deal at all.  45 ACP is a super forgiving round.  I wouldn't sweat it.  I usually see about a .003-.005 extreme spread in the OAL of my pistol rounds.  

Go shoot, don't worry, and have fun.  You'll get it figured out.  I just know it.

[BrianH]

(....lets get....) Mellow,

First check to make sure your primer isn't protruding just a tick.  Grab a round in your calipers (mic, or whatever) then hold it up to the light and look at the base.  If you see light around the primer, gotcha!

What's the nose profile of that bullet?  Sometimes when the seating punch doesn't exactly match the bullet nose and you start to seat the bullet cocked in the case it won't seat squarely.  That can throw the length off a little too.

Don't worry too much about ten thousanths.  Back when I shot .45, 1.255" was my fave....just go shoot it.  Or try this....measure all the rounds and separate them out by about .005" incriments.  Shoot each group, and see how they function.  If nothing bad happens, then your weapon doesn't care.  Good luck.

Eric posted while I was typing.  I don't mean to sound redundant.....

(Edited by BrianH at 8:30 pm on Jan. 8, 2003)

[George D]

mellow,

I get similar results to you. Don't worry about +/- .005. I think the cause may be a combination effect including those mentioned by EricW and BrianH. I've noticed that there is a bigger variation with less than the full number of stations occupied on progressive presses. I suspect that this may be because a variation in the pressure on the handle stroke and it may cause differences in flexing of the plate. I don't lube my cases and EricW does, so this may account for his acheiving a slight smaller variation.

[TheOtherErik]

Also if you are using mixed brass you could come up with  variations in OAL due to the thickness in the headstamp/rim area.

[mellow]

thanks so much guys for your input. It's very encouraging.

I'll check up on that seater plug. Right now I'm loading round nose.

I pretty much checked every primer depth as I reloaded. Overly cautious just because it was my first batch. I guess that's why it took an hour just to load 100. lol

I'm pretty sure I'm full stroking the handle (is that a term? =P) But I'll make sure to continue to pay attention to that.

I was using a homogeneous batch of brass. all S&B once fired. I wanted to stay as consistant as possible for my first batch. (and probably for my next several batches)

I just got back from the range a little while ago. I'm still here typing with all my fingers so everything went okay. The rounds shot pretty light compared to my factory loads, but I guess that's expected.

Time to bump the grains up a little.

Thanks again for all the input. Of course, anybody else who has something to contribute, please do. =)

[Flexmoney]

Grab the frame of your reloader and shake it like you were trying to mix a gallon of paint by hand.  If anything moves...your bench isn't sturdy enough.

OK...that is certainly over-kill...but, a sturdy bench helps.  Have somebody watch and see if how much the press moves when you reload.

[Patrick Sweeney]

And, if your bench is sturdy enough, then add all your bullets to the lower shelf.  My press is kept from floating away by 1000+ lbs of bullets on the bottom shelf.

[Carlos]

Had similar problems at first.  Are the die and seater stem tight enough? I bet they are - you sound cautious and that is the right way to start.

Measuring: I lower the caliper slowly onto the loaded round, apply a little pressure (see below) then I rotate the round in the caliper while holding the same pressure.  The OAL often changes - especially w/ RNs. I still get .003 to .005 variance.  As stated, .45 is a low pressure and very forgiving round - it has pressure not too much higher than a shotgun; around 19,000 PSI for the .45

As for calipers, they can be "tricked" by too much finger pressure.  What happens is too much pressure bends parts of the thin metal tool and can give you false readings. Try going light on the pressure.

VV N340 is a clean, consistent powder - good choice.  Once you are more comfortable reloading, you might want to try a faster powder like N-330, N-320 or even N310 in the .45.  One of the favorite antique US powders for .45 was the Bullseye powder (discontinued?) which was quite fast burning but very dirty to use. Makes a mess!! N-310 is supperior - except for price. As a general rule of thumb in .45, fast burn equals softer recoil for the same velocity.  

[warpspeed]

Mellow,

You never said what kind of press you are using.

I load on both a Dillon 1050 and 550 and I do notice that the ammo loaded on the 1050 seems to be a little more consistent. The load is done all on the same "stroke of the handle" on the 1050 and that makes the primer seating more consistent and the seating and crimp more consistent.

That said, I load 40 S&W only on the 550 and use a Redding seating die and those loads are always accurate. I did have some problems at first with the Redding die but I found if I did not flare the case mouth so much, the extra resistence on the spring inside the die was stonger and thus a more consistent seating depth.

[Steve Anderson]

Too much belling could cause sloppy oal.

Dillon told me to measure the mouth of a deprimed, resized case, then bell no more than .010-.012 over that.

Mine are actually less, .008 or so for supercomp, 9,  and .40.

the pictures of a belled case are more dramatic than what you really need.

Good luck,

SA

[Alan550]

The press could be the culprit,  like warpspeed said.  I use a 550 Dillon, but for match loads, I do a separate seating on a single-stage press, after they come out of the 550 for better consistency.  I just seat them a bit long to start, before going to the single-stage.  The 550 didn't vary a lot, but for pure match stuff, the plate flexes enough to make me want a bit tighter consistency on the OAL.