Yet another grip question

[Rockclimbg]

I've been refining my grip a bit and am working toward the aggressive forward canted wrist that Matt Burkett describes in his videos. I feel like I get more trigger finger isolation and I feel that the over all grip is more solid. However, when canting the hand in this way, I get a little finger to finger contact with the trigger finger, meaning, the trigger finger touches the weak side index finger a bit. It isn't warm enough here to test it out and see if it interferes with my split times however, I know that dragging a finger on the trigger guard used to slow down my splits and I'm concerned this will as well. Does anyone else have this problem? I do not have overly large hands and I'm shooting a glock 35.

Should I take a chill pill or further refine my grip?

Rockclimbg.

P.S. I went through the N.P.A. routine and I do not seem to be getting any excessive tension from either hand.

Thanks for any responses.

[Flexmoney]

Do you also do that mark you hands with a majic marker trick that Matt shows? Where the palms meet?

And, do you do the pinch and roll when establishing the weak hand grip?

If you do all that, it would seem to be hard to get your weak hand index finger in contact with the trigger finger.

[Duane Thomas]

I also have the support hand index finger touch the underside of the trigger finger. It makes no difference because the part of the trigger finger it's touching doesn't move anyway. Really, we should only be moving the first two joints of the trigger finger, everything else on the hand, including from the base knuckle to the first joint, does not move thus any "drag" from support hand index finger contact is a non-issue.

[Pierruiggi]

I think it would be helpful if you can provide a picture showing your grip and where do your fingers touch. Apparently Duane interpreted yours touch near the knuckle, on the right side of the gun (the opposite side of where the slide stop is), and I interpreted the opposite, like if you were using too much trigger finger, and the tip of your finger protudes past the trigger guard and touches your finger on the left side of the frame (where the slide stop is).

[Rockclimbg]

I'll try to get a picture posted, however, Duane is right. My index fingers are touching as he described. I'm going to take it to the indoor range today and see how it works.

How do you post pictures?

[Pierruiggi]

First, you must upload the picture to some host, either your own, if you have one, or you can place it on a free host too, like Imageshack.

Once that's done, you'll notice that on top of the box where you write the text in this forum, there are several buttons; one of them entitled "IMG", click it and write down (or copy and paste) the link to where your picture is and it should appear in your post.

I believe there's a tutorial in the gallery section of the forum.

If you have any trouble doing this, you can mail me the pics at pierruiggi@gmail.com and I'll post them in this thread.

It would be optimum if you could provide a picture of your own hands, but until you can take those pictures, can we assume your "problem" looks like this?

That is a picture of Jeff Gonzales BTW.

[PaulW]

No worries.....

I have shoot this way for many, many years. Never slowed me down.

[Rockclimbg]

Pierruiggi,

Thanks for posting the pic, that is exactly what I'm talking about.

Am I right in assuming this is a pretty common? Is it "ideal" or just not a big deal. I don't see how I can change the contact between fingers without going to a larger frame.

Thanks for the replies

Rockclimbg

[JD45]

I know what you are talking about because when I try that grip the same happens to me. Unlike the photo above, my trigger finger touches my weak hand on the left-side of the gun. Usually it rubs the top of the weak-hand finger, but it will also touch the weak-thumb if it is pointed at the target (so I have to point the thumb somewhere else).

[Duane Thomas]

Looking at Pierruiggi's picture, my grip is a bit different. It looks to me like the shooter in that photo is riding his support hand fingers right on top of the master hand fingers. I don't like that because when you place the round (in cross-section) fingers right on top of other round fingers, they have a tendency to roll around on each other. I place the support hand fingers in the crevices between the master hand fingers, like a finger groove grip; there's no way they can move around.

[Pierruiggi]

Thanks for posting the pic, that is exactly what I'm talking about.

You welcome, glad to be of service.

I agree with most posters here that its not a problem as long as your non dominant hand's index finger doesn't block or bothers free movement of the trigger finger. I also "lock" my fingers together like Duane said, perhaps the picture I posted isn't a standard grip of Mr. Gonzales, but a "rushed" draw or reload resulting in a less than perfect grip.

[libertarian]

Thanks for posting the pic, that is exactly what I'm talking about.

You welcome, glad to be of service.

I agree with most posters here that its not a problem as long as your non dominant hand's index finger doesn't block or bothers free movement of the trigger finger. I also "lock" my fingers together like Duane said, perhaps the picture I posted isn't a standard grip of Mr. Gonzales, but a "rushed" draw or reload resulting in a less than perfect grip.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Okay, I'm just starting out at this IPSC game and I have the same issue as the original poster on this thread. I have long fingers. My grip looks something like the picture except the weak hand index finger extends all the way up to the base of my trigger finger. And I would have to say that is does indeed bother my trigger finger, since it gets up under my trigger finger a bit. So I'd sure like to change it, but if I move my weak hand fingers down, then they no longer contact the bottom of the trigger guard. This doesn't seem like it would produce much consistancy.

I'm wondering if a longer trigger might help since it seems like there's less contact on my trigger finger if that finger stretches out a little more. I'm shooting a 1911 by the way. Not sure if this problem is unique to 1911 shooters or not.

[Rockclimbg]

Thanks for posting the pic, that is exactly what I'm talking about.

You welcome, glad to be of service.

I agree with most posters here that its not a problem as long as your non dominant hand's index finger doesn't block or bothers free movement of the trigger finger. I also "lock" my fingers together like Duane said, perhaps the picture I posted isn't a standard grip of Mr. Gonzales, but a "rushed" draw or reload resulting in a less than perfect grip.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Okay, I'm just starting out at this IPSC game and I have the same issue as the original poster on this thread. I have long fingers. My grip looks something like the picture except the weak hand index finger extends all the way up to the base of my trigger finger. And I would have to say that is does indeed bother my trigger finger, since it gets up under my trigger finger a bit. So I'd sure like to change it, but if I move my weak hand fingers down, then they no longer contact the bottom of the trigger guard. This doesn't seem like it would produce much consistancy.

I'm wondering if a longer trigger might help since it seems like there's less contact on my trigger finger if that finger stretches out a little more. I'm shooting a 1911 by the way. Not sure if this problem is unique to 1911 shooters or not.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Wow...I thought this thread had died.

Just an update to the thread. I got past this problem by just moving the index finger on my support hand away from the trigger finger. Basically, it was not a drastic grip change just a subtle straightening of the tip of my weakhand index finger. It worked for me as my split times have gone up on close targets/bill drills slightly. (.20 to .17's, not earth shattering but it feels more controlled and easier.)

It's funny because I notice that when I have a calm consistent grip and isolate the trigger finger, the whole stage just seems easier and more in control...maybe it's just what I'm focusing on...rather than focusing on nothing. Hopefully with time and practice, I won't have to focus on it and it will just happen.

Thanks for all the replies.

Rockclimbg

[spook]

Rockclimbg, I have the same problem (large hands). Skateboard tape under the trigger guard helped me. Just try it and you will see why

[Rockclimbg]

Spook,

Thanks for the tip.

I tried the skateboard tape under the triggerguard and got some pretty fierce opened sores on my hand, did you have this problem? It was winter time and I always seem to get cracks and such during the winter months so maybe I'll give it another try during the summer.

Thanks again.

Rockclimbg

[spook]

LOL, yeah, sorry, I should have warned you. It hurts a bit in the beginning, but you can dull the tape a bit by sanding it just a tad. I got some marks on my left index finger as well. The cool thing about the tape is that you can really grip with that finger, but it's not in the way.