9mm loads using IMR SR4756 vs PB

[danman00]

Hi all,

I'm new to this forum and fairly new to reloading. I can't begin to tell you how much I've enjoyed and learned from you guys and reading these forums. I have been reloading for a few months now and have loaded close to 2000 rds of 40.s&w and .45acp using a Lyman T-Mag II with great success. As of right now - I want to start loading for 9mm using 124 gr. Rainiers plated projectiles. I've relecieved my dies and shell plate. I have clean brass, small pistol primers, and 2 different powders I could use. As we all know, powder is tough to come by so I'm kinda stuck with using what I have. I have a good amount of both IMR PB and SR4756 and I've seen on Hogden's web site that there is load data for each caliber with both powders. What I would really like is to pick the brains of you super experienced guys to see if you've have loaded 9mm with either of these powders and whether you've prefered one or the other and/or why.

FYI,

I'm shooting a G35 and G23 with Lonewolf 9mm conversion barrels. I shoot IDPA using these same pistols with stock .40 cal barrels and ammo in order to stay in SSP so I'm not caring about PF nor am I competing in this 9mm caliber.

Thanks in advance for your advice.

Danman

[Steve RA]

Try 4.5gr of 4756, works well. No idea on PB, have never used it.

[danman00]

Thanks Steve - How about the OAL? The standard 1.15"

[Hi-Power Jack]

OAL is best determined for Your Gun/Mags and the bullets you've chosen -

it doesn't vary by powder type used.

If 1.15" is best for your gun, with those bullets, you're all set at 1.15".

I'm sure Steve also meant to start a little below 4.5 grains, and work

up slowly with a chrono.

Also, depends on what exactly you're planning on using the ammo for?

USPSA PF125? Hunting? Self defense? etc

[rtp]

OAL for plated Ranier 124gr RNs at 1.15" is probably fine, but why not check it for your specific gun to be sure? (and not wind up pulling a bunch of ammo later )

http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=34225.msg189131#msg189131

[tbrtt1]

IMR PB is the best kept secret out there IMHO. I love the stuff. I load exclusively 147 gr Bayou Bullets but I did some with 124/125 bullets with Bayous and Berry's. I am not at home and don't have my notes handy, but I know that the up to date data on the Hogdon/IMR website is a little light on the load data for the PB in my experience.

My 147 Bayou load is:

3.2 gr of PB

1.140 OAL

Mixed brass.

889 Av velocity

SD of 9

I will check my notes on the 125 gr loads I did and post tomorrow night.

You are welcome to send me the PB, ha!

[danman00]

OAL for plated Ranier 124gr RNs at 1.15" is probably fine, but why not check it for your specific gun to be sure? (and not wind up pulling a bunch of ammo later )

http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=34225.msg189131#msg189131

RTP - I will test with my chamber - (plunk test) - I was just looking for a starting point. Thanks.

IMR PB is the best kept secret out there IMHO. I love the stuff. I load exclusively 147 gr Bayou Bullets but I did some with 124/125 bullets with Bayous and Berry's. I am not at home and don't have my notes handy, but I know that the up to date data on the Hogdon/IMR website is a little light on the load data for the PB in my experience.

My 147 Bayou load is:

3.2 gr of PB

1.140 OAL

Mixed brass.

889 Av velocity

SD of 9

I will check my notes on the 125 gr loads I did and post tomorrow night.

You are welcome to send me the PB, ha!

I agree tbrtt1 - IMR PB works very well in 45 ACP too in case anyone is interested - (4.7gr under a 230gr LRN - Very accurate - very clean) . I also agree that the load data on hodgden's site is way low. Their starting loads fire and cycle - but they are complete bunny farts - at least for the .40 cal anyway and I understand why of course. But anyway, thanks for your input and I look forward to seeing your data.

[tbrtt1]

OAL for plated Ranier 124gr RNs at 1.15" is probably fine, but why not check it for your specific gun to be sure? (and not wind up pulling a bunch of ammo later )

http://www.czfirearms.us/index.php?topic=34225.msg189131#msg189131

RTP - I will test with my chamber - (plunk test) - I was just looking for a starting point. Thanks.

IMR PB is the best kept secret out there IMHO. I love the stuff. I load exclusively 147 gr Bayou Bullets but I did some with 124/125 bullets with Bayous and Berry's. I am not at home and don't have my notes handy, but I know that the up to date data on the Hogdon/IMR website is a little light on the load data for the PB in my experience.

My 147 Bayou load is:

3.2 gr of PB

1.140 OAL

Mixed brass.

889 Av velocity

SD of 9

I will check my notes on the 125 gr loads I did and post tomorrow night.

You are welcome to send me the PB, ha!

I agree tbrtt1 - IMR PB works very well in 45 ACP too in case anyone is interested - (4.7gr under a 230gr LRN - Very accurate - very clean) . I also agree that the load data on hodgden's site is way low. Their starting loads fire and cycle - but they are complete bunny farts - at least for the .40 cal anyway and I understand why of course. But anyway, thanks for your input and I look forward to seeing your data.

Danman,

Bayou 125 RN

PB 4.3 gr

OAL 1.145

Gave me 2 inch groups from a rest at 25 yards. (note, I am not a good group shooter even from a rest!)

I have load data ranging from 4.1 to 4.8 gr for 115 Berry's and 3.8-4.6125 gr Bayou bullets with PB. I did not chrono these so proceed at your own risk. I decided to go with 147s exclusively and eventually got a chrono to develop all my 147 load data.

I would start at just below 4.0 and see.

PB+147gr=bliss.

[danman00]

Thanks tbrtt1. I really appreciate you taking the time. I will load some 124 gr on top of some PB tonight. I won't be able to get to the range until sunday though. I just ordered some 147 gr from Midway. It seems this is the preffered bullit by alot of you guys. I'm anxious to try try them out.

[danman00]

Gave me 2 inch groups from a rest at 25 yards. (note, I am not a good group shooter even from a rest!)

Its funny you mention this - It seems I fall into the same catagory - My first 4 - 5 shots always seem to hit where I want them too. whether standing or a bench rest. Anymore and my groups start to open up. I'm not sure why, maybe I'm not concentrating enough or my grip or something, who knows. I've always had this issue when shooting at paper.

[tbrtt1]

Gave me 2 inch groups from a rest at 25 yards. (note, I am not a good group shooter even from a rest!)

Its funny you mention this - It seems I fall into the same catagory - My first 4 - 5 shots always seem to hit where I want them too. whether standing or a bench rest. Anymore and my groups start to open up. I'm not sure why, maybe I'm not concentrating enough or my grip or something, who knows. I've always had this issue when shooting at paper.

You could be getting some flyers in your reloads. Maybe buy a box or two of factory ammo and see what your groups look like. If your still getting oddballs then its you, if not them maybe its your loads.

That is what I did with several factory loads. Groups looked the same with factory loads and my loads. Of course, you may have already done this or are referring to your groups with factory loads.

[danman00]

Just in case anyone was interested in using IMR PB with thier 9mm loads. This load shot extremley well. Surprising to me actually and accurate up to about a 3" group at 25 yards free standing with a G35 with a LW 9mm conversion barrel. A little over 3" group with a G23 with a LW 9mm barrel. The recoil felt great, shells ejected 3-5 feet away and the PB was surprising clean. I shot about 200 rds acurately with no issues whatsoever. I do not have a chrono and i'm very curious as to how close to PF I am.

124gr Rainier Plated RN

4.3gr of IMR-PB

OAL 1.145

CCI spp

Tonight I will load some test rounds using IMR sr4756. I will post my results this weekend if I can get to the range. It's snowbird season here in south FL. The ranges in my area are packed frekin' packed this time of year.

[tbrtt1]

Just in case anyone was interested in using IMR PB with thier 9mm loads. This load shot extremley well. Surprising to me actually and accurate up to about a 3" group at 25 yards free standing with a G35 with a LW 9mm conversion barrel. A little over 3" group with a G23 with a LW 9mm barrel. The recoil felt great, shells ejected 3-5 feet away and the PB was surprising clean. I shot about 200 rds acurately with no issues whatsoever. I do not have a chrono and i'm very curious as to how close to PF I am.

124gr Rainier Plated RN

4.3gr of IMR-PB

OAL 1.145

CCI spp

Tonight I will load some test rounds using IMR sr4756. I will post my results this weekend if I can get to the range. It's snowbird season here in south FL. The ranges in my area are packed frekin' packed this time of year.

You are supposed to say the PB sucks. Do want everyone to figure this out!! Ha!

[Laughingdog]

Just in case anyone was interested in using IMR PB with thier 9mm loads. This load shot extremley well. Surprising to me actually and accurate up to about a 3" group at 25 yards free standing with a G35 with a LW 9mm conversion barrel. A little over 3" group with a G23 with a LW 9mm barrel. The recoil felt great, shells ejected 3-5 feet away and the PB was surprising clean. I shot about 200 rds acurately with no issues whatsoever. I do not have a chrono and i'm very curious as to how close to PF I am.

124gr Rainier Plated RN

4.3gr of IMR-PB

OAL 1.145

CCI spp

Tonight I will load some test rounds using IMR sr4756. I will post my results this weekend if I can get to the range. It's snowbird season here in south FL. The ranges in my area are packed frekin' packed this time of year.

I don't know how you managed such a short round with 4.3g of that in there. I just loaded some Bayou Bullets 125g RN and, with 4.1grains of powder, the round wouldn't go any shorter than 1.165" because there wasn't room for it to get shorter.

[tbrtt1]

Just in case anyone was interested in using IMR PB with thier 9mm loads. This load shot extremley well. Surprising to me actually and accurate up to about a 3" group at 25 yards free standing with a G35 with a LW 9mm conversion barrel. A little over 3" group with a G23 with a LW 9mm barrel. The recoil felt great, shells ejected 3-5 feet away and the PB was surprising clean. I shot about 200 rds acurately with no issues whatsoever. I do not have a chrono and i'm very curious as to how close to PF I am.

124gr Rainier Plated RN

4.3gr of IMR-PB

OAL 1.145

CCI spp

Tonight I will load some test rounds using IMR sr4756. I will post my results this weekend if I can get to the range. It's snowbird season here in south FL. The ranges in my area are packed frekin' packed this time of year.

I don't know how you managed such a short round with 4.3g of that in there. I just loaded some Bayou Bullets 125g RN and, with 4.1grains of powder, the round wouldn't go any shorter than 1.165" because there wasn't room for it to get shorter.

I don't recall having that problem with 115s and 125s with up to 4.8gr at 1.145-1.160.

[Laughingdog]

Just in case anyone was interested in using IMR PB with thier 9mm loads. This load shot extremley well. Surprising to me actually and accurate up to about a 3" group at 25 yards free standing with a G35 with a LW 9mm conversion barrel. A little over 3" group with a G23 with a LW 9mm barrel. The recoil felt great, shells ejected 3-5 feet away and the PB was surprising clean. I shot about 200 rds acurately with no issues whatsoever. I do not have a chrono and i'm very curious as to how close to PF I am.

124gr Rainier Plated RN

4.3gr of IMR-PB

OAL 1.145

CCI spp

Tonight I will load some test rounds using IMR sr4756. I will post my results this weekend if I can get to the range. It's snowbird season here in south FL. The ranges in my area are packed frekin' packed this time of year.

I don't know how you managed such a short round with 4.3g of that in there. I just loaded some Bayou Bullets 125g RN and, with 4.1grains of powder, the round wouldn't go any shorter than 1.165" because there wasn't room for it to get shorter.

I don't recall having that problem with 115s and 125s with up to 4.8gr at 1.145-1.160.

Well, my die is set to seat to a depth of 1.155". I haven't tried to mess with it yet to see if I can force it down a little shorter.

Chrono'd my load last night

IMR PB 4.1g

Bayou Bullet 125g 9mm

10 shots fired. Std Dev 11.6fps

Low Power Factor 127.6k

Avg Power Factor 129.6k

Based on my experience with chrono performance, a plated bullet would need a 4.2g charge for the same performance.

[yellowfin]

Just ordered some Extreme 147's myself to run with PB. I'm guessing my G34's barrel is going to make hitting required velocity a breeze for minor, right?

[CeeZer]

4756 - too much powder per load and still no 9mm Minor PF while getting too close to dangerous pressure - I'll pass; glad I got only 1lb for testing.

Never tried PB.

[Mahlsan]

I run 4gr of PB under a 125 blue bullet for open minor. That is with a comp. The only problem with PB is that it is shipped in 14 Oz containers not full pounds, robbing me of approximately 200 rounds. Didn't notice at first until I had less powder than I should gave for the number of bullets loaded.

[Guest]

If you aren't sure what to do with the SR4756 I'd bet there are a bunch of open shooters who would be willing to buy or trade for it.

There are better powders for the 9mm/40/45 than SR4756, and as others have said...PB is very good for the 9mm (and as you discovered for the .45 also).

[BHanks]

The load data I have for the SR4756 / 147gr cast is 3.0 to 3.6grns. At 3.0 it fires, but the slide doesn't budge.

4756 - too much powder per load and still no 9mm Minor PF while getting too close to dangerous pressure - I'll pass; glad I got only 1lb for testing.

Never tried PB.

Was this with a 147gr and what was your stopping point? Thanks. I am new to reloading and am fighting the same powder shortage as everyone else, so all I have to start with is 2lbs of 4756.