bottomc Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 Any thoughts on 20 ga for 3 gun. I must reduce recoil due to medical issues. Any additional tips on models that would be good? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 Try a 12ga w/ 1oz or 7/8 oz loads before you resort to 20. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sargenv Posted November 29, 2004 Share Posted November 29, 2004 I find that 7/8 ounce loads in my 12 are softer than 7/8 ounce loads in my 20. The only issue you might have in shooting such a light load, is that it may be unreliable in a semi-auto. I know that the 7/8 ounce load will work in the Browning Gold and Beretta Semi's. It might work in an 11-87, but it may not function in a Benelli, Rem 1100, or other popular gun. Of course everything will generally feed in a pump. The problem with using a 20 gauge gun in something like open, is that you have to adapt the speed sticks to a smaller gauge. In limited it isn't as much of an issue. Vince Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry White Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 I shot a 20 for a while. 7/8oz loads just don't cut it on poppers or plates in 20 or 12. With 1 oz the 20 may be a little better than the 12 because of the longer shot string, but you really have to put it on em. With slugs the 5/8 remington is the real low recoil deal. If you have a 00 buck stage you are out of luck,#3 is as big as they get. The rem hvy dove loads with 2 1/2 dram and 1 0z of sixs in a mod choke just kills steel. The Browning Gold and the Rem 1100 LT are the guns. Very little in the way of 3 gun stuff around. 3gun gear has side saddles and arm bands, just about everthing else had to be home made. After all that the guns are lighter and you don't save a thing as far as recoil. A good 12 ga gas gun is about as good as it gets, If this sounds like a long winded way of saying don't do it, your right.----Larry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokshwn Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 Bottom C, Much like Larry just said, by the time you factor in the 20's lighter weight, my opinion is that similar loadings still give similar recoil gauge vs. gauge. I would say that adding weight or mercury type recoil reducers could help but I assume your medical condition also wont be helped by carrying extra weight. My suggestion is find a gas gun and tune it to work with some of the ultralight 12 loads out there. Don't forget with any gun, backboring and lengthening the forcing cone will also significantly reduce recoil. One option if you don't like all the gun tinkering is to opt for the Winchester SX2 and then purchase the factory sporting clays gas piston which is designed to run on much lighter loads. Mine feels great with light 1oz loads (haven't tried anything lighter). Take care, Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bottomc Posted November 30, 2004 Author Share Posted November 30, 2004 Thanks for the help. The issue of weight is not all that critical. The real issue is the recoil impact to the head that you get with a good cheek weld. I may get to try a 20 this weekend. I have been shooting clays with an O/U and side by side for many years and presently have a Mossberg 590(which I love). Slugs are REALLY a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 You really owe it to yourself to try a modern, gas-operated 12 ga. They've really taken the pain out of shooting. I shoot all kinds of 3" mags through my Beretta and never feel a thing. A stick-on foam cheekrest will also help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokshwn Posted November 30, 2004 Share Posted November 30, 2004 Bottom, You might also get a hold of a trapshooting or sporting clays publication ( Trap and Field, Sporting Clays). You can probably go to a near by trap club and find someone with a couple of back issues. Look through the mags as there are several recoil reduction products to be had. Gra-coil is one that comes to mind. In this respect trapshooters who shoot several hundred rds of 12 ga a day have developed tons of goodies to curb recoil. Again, Good luck, Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bottomc Posted November 30, 2004 Author Share Posted November 30, 2004 The stick on cheek pad is a very good idea. I'm wondering about the mercury recoil reducers and how effective they are. There are also some real neat devices out there but they are in the $150+ range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokshwn Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Bottom, In those same publications I listed above look for a gel comb pad which will reduce what you take to your face very well. Take care, Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Personally, I have my doubts, serious ones, about the effectiveness of mercury recoil reducers. In fact, I've got $20 waiting for the first person that can show me (as in I and others shoot the shotguns side by side) that a mercury recoil reducer is substantially (let's call the number 25%) more effective than an equivalent amount of lead fishing weights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillL223 Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 When my 130# wife and I began to shoot sporting clays, she was getting knocked around after the first shot of a true pair with her gas operated Browning Gold, basically the same gun as the Win SX2. I added a Mercury Recoil reducer purchased from Gamaliel Shooting Supply and changed to a 1 oz load @ 1200 fps. Problem solved. The Win AA Extra Lite load is the equivalent. Her Gold has the Sporting piston in it and it runs 100% with this combo. The reducer screws onto the magazine tube cap and is a do it yourself job. I don't know if its the mecury or just the extra weight but it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokshwn Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 EricW You're right, it's just weight, and the effectiveness may not be 25% more effective. However when you are trapshooting and you have 1200 targets over 4 days, 5% more effective looks pretty good. True their is probably an element of marketing there. In the begining someone tried mercury and it sold because it had a higher cool factor than lead, but more importantly you get a product that mounts/unmounts, can tailor balance, fits the intended application with little or no gunsmithing, is hidden or looks nice, etc. etc. The best recoil reduction device is actually a custom fit stock by someone who knows what they are doing. There are very few of those guys in the world. This means the cost is out of reach for most shooters. Some of the mechanical (pneumatic, spring operated etc.) work bette than the mercury but again they can be more expensive. So it leads us back to 100 bones for a mecury tube being fairly attractive to folks compared to the alternatives. It's the same reason guys use tungsten guiderods, magwells, brass basepads, recoilmasters etc. Why don't people just epoxy lead on there dustcover, or carry around a box of stick on tire weights, helluva lot cheaper than a Tungsten magwell. Just as a side note, since beginning shooting action shotgun I have heard ten times the amount of complaints about recoil than when I was trapshooting. Me thinks I need to set down and make a doodad for the benelli guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kellyn Posted December 1, 2004 Share Posted December 1, 2004 Lackadaisical trap shooters never felt the recoil of 25 rounds in 20 seconds either! As for the 20 gauge, I like shooting mine (1100) and with the right choke it will take any steel you need to take. But 20g slugs are snappier than 12g reduced recoil slugs. I think you can effectively compete with a 20 but I'm staying with my 12 for anything serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdmoore Posted December 3, 2004 Share Posted December 3, 2004 Knoxx industries makes a recoil absorbing stock for the Mossbergs (870's to, I think). Don't know how they work personally, but someone (thefiringline or thehighroad?) said they work pretty good. Having said that, work on a gas gun, that's the real ticket for this sport anyway. Dedicate it to light loads and you'll have a reliable solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bottomc Posted December 10, 2004 Author Share Posted December 10, 2004 Just insatlled a Knoxx Compstock and a Cheekeze pad on the 590. It seems to be measurably better but I do not know if the claimed 54% reduction has been realized. A friend of mine who is a Trap kinda guy recently gave a reload recipe for an extremely low preasure round. I have a shotshell loader that I haven't used in a year of Wednesdays. Will dust it off, buy some components and see what happens! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArturoJ Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 I think loading with the 20 would be the greatest advantage. The faster you load, the faster you go. I can get three 12 gauge shells in one grab, four 20 gauge shells fit in my hand better than three 12s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArturoJ Posted December 10, 2004 Share Posted December 10, 2004 And back to the main point. 20 gauge in an 1100 is very soft. For me the recoil of my Benelli is not an issue at this time, but less recoil is a always good thing. I think TGO once said that the 20 should be the best gauge for 3-gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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