Production trigger weight

[mas]

I have a Glock and was wondering about what trigger mod.'s can be made while remaining adherent to the production division rules...it seems a lot of people use 3.5# connectors (perhaps resulting in a 4.5# trigger pull), but I though I read that the trigger weight can not drop below 5#.....is the 3.5# connector illegal then?

[Flexmoney]

mas,

IPSC had the #5 first shot rule.

USPSA had no such rule.

[mas]

cool! good to hear. The 5# connector is no fun.

[Vince Pinto]

How low can you go? What is this - a limbo contest?

Mai, I think you have misunderstood Flexmoney. Under IPSC rules, the minimum trigger pull is 2.27kgs (5lbs) for the first double action shot. See Appendix D4 in the rulebook, and take special note of Points 19 & 20 concerning modifications. Also see Appendix F2 for the measuring protocol.

IPSC has no interest in which OFM connector/trigger spring/firing pin spring* combination you use in your Glock - we're only concerned with, and measure, the end result.

* Glock has 3 grades of connectors, 3 grades of trigger spring and 3 grades of firing pin spring, so there are 27 different permutations.

POSTSCRIPT: The text in green above is a foo-foo. See my corrective post below.

[mas]

yep, the limbo allusion was intentional.

I'm not at home right now to look at the book....will do so later.

5lbs for the "first double action shot." A glock only has one kind of trigger pull, so it must be 5lbs? Sorry if if I'm missing the point here....I'm trying to understand it so I don't do anything inadvertantly illegal at a match.

[Vince Pinto]

A glock only has one kind of trigger pull, so it must be 5lbs?

Yes.

POSTSCRIPT: Another foo-foo, dammit. See my corrective post below.

[mas]

hmm...well, that helped me to make up my mind about which division I'll be shooting....think I'll go Limited. Thanks for the clarification.

[Vince Pinto]

WHOAAAAAAAA NELLIE!

Being an old fart who's been inundated with rules questions in the last 72 hours, I misread the original poster's name as "Mai" (our friend from Thailand), but I just realised that the poster is "Mas" from Wheelin' West Virginia. My bad. Mea culpa.

Since I presume you'll be shooting in the USA, there is no minimum trigger pull, and you would be far more competitive in Production Division with a Glock. As far as modifications are concerned, see US Appendix D9.

My apologies.

[mas]

ah, thanks....I really appreciate the time you've and Flex have taken to help me with my question.

I just love that name.....FLEXMONEY!! You need a paisley Glock or something to go with that name.

[Vince Pinto]

I just love that name.....FLEXMONEY!! You need a paisley Glock or something to go with that name.

Oh my God. Now you've gone and done it ............

I N C O M I N G G G G G G G G

[Nik Habicht]

I just love that name.....FLEXMONEY!! You need a paisley Glock or something to go with that name.

I don't think that's too likely ---- because the paintjob might require financing.....

Perhaps a paisley cap to replace that crappy red baseball cap....

[spook]

Mas, back on the topic: I have a Glock 17 and it has a 5.2 lbs. pull with the 3.5 lbs conector installed. IPSC production legal and of course also legal in all other divisions, be it USPSA or IPSC

[mas]

Haha....I just hope that was funny and not offensive in any way.

Spook: I'll need to check my trigger weight, just out of curiosity. I was just using Glockmeister's trigger pull weight chart for an estimation of what the trigger pull of my gun is.

[Flexmoney]

You need a paisley Glock...

LOL.

I don't advertise this, but I have a name for the Glock 35 that I shoot in Limited/10/Production... I call it "The Fiddle" (As in The Devil Went Down To Georgia by the Charlie Daniels Band .)

Glock USA = based in Georgia

My G35...plain Jane, nothing fancy.

Now...the Open Glock is another story.

[mas]

If you get a chance, I'd love to see a picture of your open Glock.

[Vince Pinto]

Paisley? Is that anything like:

and by "Open", do you mean, like, "outdoors"?

[Steve Moneypenny]

you could just learn to manipulate the 3.5# connector on your gun... odd idea. but it IS your carry gun....

[Chuck Anderson]

How is the trigger weighed in IPSC? I tried weighing the triggers on both my Glocks with the 5 pound connectors. If measured from the center of the trigger the weight is around 6-7 pounds, easily legal. However on one of them if I weigh from the bottom of the trigger is comes in at 4.5 pounds. Just don't want to run into any problems. Looks like the first IPSC rules match I will be able to shoot will be Ecuador and I don't want to get kicked to a different division because my trigger weighs in low.

[Flexmoney]

I've always taken the trigger weights that people report for the Glock with a grain of alt...for the reason you mentioned.

Vince should be along with the official IPSC method soon. I think they use hanging weights. (I think he posted the method around here before..a search might bring it to the surface.)

[Flexmoney]

Vince posted this in April of 2003...not sure if it is current.

Currently we don't have an official trigger pull testing protocol, but the current Rules Committee have agreed on the following, subject to ratification at the next IPSC General Assembly:

(Rule number TBA): The trigger pull shall be measured as follows:

1. The unloaded gun will be cocked and all external safety levers will be disengaged;

2. The hook of the trigger weight or scale will be placed in the center of the trigger pad;

3. The gun with the muzzle pointed skywards must raise and hold a 2.25 kg (~5 lb) weight, or register this same weight on a scale;

4. The above test shall be conducted a maximum of three (3) times;

5. If the hammer or striker does not fall on any one (1) of the three (3) attempts, the gun has satisfied the requirements of this division.

6. If the hammer or striker falls on all three (3) attempts, the gun has failed to satisfy the requirements of the division and Rule 6.2.6 shall apply.

7. Guns with non-standard actions (e.g. "squeeze-cockers") shall be tested as directed by the officiating Range Master.

Obviously, in light of comments made earlier in this thread, we'll revise Point 1 of the testing protocol, as we don't need to cock the gun, and I'll recommend:

Alt 1. The unloaded gun will be prepared by disengaging any external safety levers and decocking;

[Yoda]

Flex,

try appendix F2 from the January 2004 IPSC rulebook

Trigger Pull Testing Procedure

When a minimum trigger pull is required by a Division, handguns will be tested as follows:

1. The unloaded handgun will be prepared as if the handgun is ready to fire a double action shot;

2. The trigger weight or scale will be attached as closely as possible to the center of the trigger face;

3. The trigger of the handgun, with the muzzle pointed vertically skywards, must either:

( a ) Raise and hold a 2.27 kg (5lbs) weight, or

( b ) Register not less than 2.27 kg (5lbs) on a scale;

4. One of the above tests will be conducted a maximum of 3 times;

5. If the hammer or striker does not fall on any 1 of the 3 attempts in 3( a ) above, or if the scale registers not less than 2.27 kg (5lbs) in 3( b ) above, the handgun has passed the test.

6. If the hammer or striker falls on all three (3) attempts in 3( a ) above, or if the scale registers less than 2.27 kg (5lbs) in 3( b ) above, the handgun has failed the test and Rule 6.2.5.1 will apply.

[Vince Pinto]

Lawman,

Yoda's reference to, and quoting of, Appendix F2 is spot-on, but my To-Do list includes the following proposed (but not yet official) amendments:

3. The trigger of the handgun, with the muzzle pointed vertically skywards, must either:

........ (a) Raise and hold a 2.27 kg (5lbs) weight when the muzzle of the handgun is pointed vertically skywards and the handgun is gently raised, or

........ ( Register not less than 2.27 kg (5lbs) on a scale using the procedure specified by the Range Master;

The reason for the proposed change is because some scales are more efficiently operated with the slide held parallel to the ground.

Hope this helps.