TARGETS WTF

[gm iprod]

We hear rumours, unfounded speculation and other bovine excrement that the NRA (in all their "wisdom") are looking to change the Targets. This we hear is due to the "huge" amount of people shooting 1920.

By my best calculation I know of the enourmous sum of 2 that have shot 1920 at Nationals, Bianchi Cup, Worlds since the beginning of the year.

Bianchi Cup 1920, Doug and Dickie (Aus)

World Shoot was won with a 1916?

Australian Nationals won with a 1918, (by a Kiwi)

NZ Nationals won with a 1918 (bloody Australian)

So we clearly have a serious problem that needs immediate attention. I think any change will be counter productive, be implemented regardless of shooter opinion, without proper testing and regard to the actual problem with the target, and only made because of 5 or 6 guys World Wide who may have in the past shot a 1920 with a decent X Count. SO WHAT?

If I am wrong that would be nice. So any useful information that is available would be nice to see.

Thank you.

Edited November 1, 2012 by gm iprod

[mwx40x40]

We hear rumours, unfounded speculation and other bovine excrement that the NRA (in all their "wisdom") are looking to change the Targets. This we hear is due to the "huge" amount of people shooting 1920.

By my best calculation I know of the enourmous sum of 2 that have shot 1920 at Nationals, Bianchi Cup, Worlds since the beginning of the year.

Bianchi Cup 1920, Doug and Dickie (Aus)

World Shoot was won with a 1916?

Australian Nationals won with a 1918, (by a Kiwi)

NZ Nationals won with a 1918 (bloody Australian)

So we clearly have a serious problem that needs immediate attention. I think any change will be counter productive, be implemented regardless of shooter opinion, without proper testing and regard to the actual problem with the target, and only made because of 5 or 6 guys World Wide who may have in the past shot a 1920 with a decent X Count. SO WHAT?

If I am wrong that would be nice. So any useful information that is available would be nice to see.

Thank you.

Why didn't they just leave the original alone? Black dot for x ring should have made for an easier target.

[toothguy]

We hear rumours, unfounded speculation and other bovine excrement that the NRA (in all their "wisdom") are looking to change the Targets. This we hear is due to the "huge" amount of people shooting 1920.

By my best calculation I know of the enourmous sum of 2 that have shot 1920 at Nationals, Bianchi Cup, Worlds since the beginning of the year.

Bianchi Cup 1920, Doug and Dickie (Aus)

World Shoot was won with a 1916?

Australian Nationals won with a 1918, (by a Kiwi)

NZ Nationals won with a 1918 (bloody Australian)

So we clearly have a serious problem that needs immediate attention. I think any change will be counter productive, be implemented regardless of shooter opinion, without proper testing and regard to the actual problem with the target, and only made because of 5 or 6 guys World Wide who may have in the past shot a 1920 with a decent X Count. SO WHAT?

If I am wrong that would be nice. So any useful information that is available would be nice to see.

Thank you.

Why didn't they just leave the original alone? Black dot for x ring should have made for an easier target.

I think what gm iprod is saying is that they want to change the target to make the match more difficult because so many are shooting a perfect score.

[toothguy]

I vote to make the target completely flat black, that should be interesting for the production and metalic shooters.

[Mr Unnatural]

Let's hope it stays with rumors and speculation and that they keep their fingers of the target design.

I'll be watching this topic.

[ffl]

There are 16 courses of fire in the NRA Action Pistol Rule Book. Lets see more of them at the Cup. It would certainly make for a better all around shooter, than one who only practices that match.

[gm iprod]

Toothguy,

No one has EVER shot a perfect 1920 192X at any match that is Regional or above as far as I know, because that would be a World Record and that is 1920 and 188X I believe, and I don't recall anyone doing it at a level below a Regional as that would not be a record in the US, but someone will know if they had.

The black dot was put in for the metallic guys as they were somewhat disadvantaged over a red dot sight (and we know who we can poke fun at over the black dot), the score went slightly backwards on average when it came in. I would go back to plain target with light lines for scoring (and that means not easily visible at 10Y). The old target some could see the rings at 50Y when the light was right. The top ten got to shoot the match when the light was right. So overall the black dot was a leveler.

Anything they do to make the target more difficult to score 1920 on will only affect those that are not regularly scoring above 1900, and much more to the advantage of those that do score 1920.

UNTIL we get 1920 and 192X regularly at Worlds and the Bianchi Cup and we need the second only shoot off to settle the match (which BTW the first shoot off 5 years ago was fascinating and the only shoot off that I was interesting unless I was shooting) then look carefully at what needs to be changed, come up with a plan and leave it alone for two years so we can get through all the targets that will have been made in bulk to keep the costs down, and see how the plan MIGHT work, pick it to pieces, complain loudly for a year or two, bitch to the NRA and start another bunch of unfounded rumours, speculation and bovine excrement.

Then, at the end of that two years, if we have had another shoot off or two from a 1920 192X, take another look at it and actually ask the guys who shot the 192X how it all went. Because, right there, they are in the best position to assess the likely success of any changes, no one else, especially no one on a committee that has not shot an AP match for ten years and will say "back in my day" it was a lot harder because we had to contend with this and that and we did not have all the fancy gear. Bollocks, back in your day you did everything in your power to find an advantage and take it, I did and I still do. Now we have guys that can actually shoot these "enormous" scores (not me by my record of late), mostly from practicing a shed load more than "back in my day"

A plain black target with light white scoring rings is available already. But the ten ring is 20% smaller in area than the current target (good) and has no X ring (bad), and the scoring area is bigger overall (bad), so not going to work, but I like your thinking.

[toothguy]

I was just kidding about the black targets. Another idea I had was flat black falling plates and keep the black rubber chunks for the background. The pings from the radar systems used instead of aimpoints might get distracting though.

Edited November 1, 2012 by toothguy

[Action Pistolero]

There are 16 courses of fire in the NRA Action Pistol Rule Book. Lets see more of them at the Cup. It would certainly make for a better all around shooter, than one who only practices that match.

You and I seem to be in the minority on that one.

Richard,

Where in the hell is this coming from? It's not NRA.

Back before we changed the target there were some who wanted to make the x a 10 and the 10 a 9. All that was put to rest.

[gm iprod]

Kevin,

That's the problem, we just hear shit all over the place. Someone came back from overseas and dropped a bomb that he had heard from ? that this was in the pipes. Murray emailed Damien, I dropped it here to watch the brown stuff fly around the room from outside.

Got a nice email from Tom, good bloke that, and put me in my place.

So as first posted, bovine excrement.

And I agree with FFL, we need more course of fire, especially the ones I am good at. Crawford Barricade and Speedload Challenge come to mind right off the bat.