jkushner1 Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 I just read the string that was created in response to DOWN ZERO's .090 vs. .125 front fiber optic sight width question. It was very interesting. Being the kind of guy (which I think in general, hurts more than it helps) that is constantly tweaking his guns, I have a question for the Cybermasses of Shooting. I have switched my comeition guns (IPSC/IDPA) over to Fiber Optic Front sights - Limited and Production - both are Para's with EGW fronts and with Para Factory Bomar copy rears (I think the front is about .110/.120 wide and the rear para notch is about .130/.140 wide) but not exactly sure, BUT my question the regards HORIZONTAL ALIGNMENT of this configuration. I only have about 50-60 events under my belt so I'm kinda new to the sport but am loving every moment of it. Anyway: It seems that once the horn sounds, I am deviating between aligning the fiber optic dot itself with the top line of the rear sight and aligning the black steel above the fiber optic dot of the front blade with the top line of the rear sight - I 'm almost positive this what is occuring so my POI elevation is varying quite a bit. Am I correct to assume, that the proper alignment is the top line (black steel above the fiber optic dot) of front blade should be level with the top line of the rear sight, or do some people actually sight in there guns so that the gun zero's with fiber optic dot level with the top line of the rear sight. Any help greatly appreciated. Thanks, Jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Am I correct to assume, that the proper alignment is the top line (black steel above the fiber optic dot) of front blade should be level with the top line of the rear sight, or do some people actually sight in there guns so that the gun zero's with fiber optic dot level with the top line of the rear sight. Your assumption is correct. If you find yourself constantly trying to sight solely off the fiber, I'd ditch the fiber sights and go back to straight notch and post. The fiber is doing you more harm than good. Just a parting thought, but if you're instinctively cocking the muzzle up slightly to the fiber is at the top of the rear, you might have an indexing issue that's biomechanical. If your mainspring housing is arched, you might swap for a flat and bring down the muzzle. If you have a gigantic magwell, that can act to push up the muzzle too and might merit a little belt sander treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazos Custom Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 I use the fiber as a sighting device all the time. Imagine the notch in your rear sight as a box. Center the dot exactly in the center of this box and the top of the post will be very close to the top of the notch. Certainly close enough for anything inside 15 yds. If you need to be more precise then switch your focus to the top of the post for those tough shots. The fiber optic enables you to be fast when you need to be but precise when the shot calls for it. This type of sighting takes some discipline to develop and is not for everyone. Also, for those with older eyes who can't see the post the fiber optic offers an alternative if you can develop the skill to center the dot in the notch. If you are using this type of sight picture all the time then sight in with the dot centered in the notch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkushner1 Posted August 19, 2004 Author Share Posted August 19, 2004 Thanks Bob - I'm heading to the range, the box concepts mentally feels like it will work for me and in effect should produce the same alignment that Eric is referring to anyway. Also thanks to Eric. (I use his TruGrip for SVI/STI on all my Para's too -just little trim and snip) Take good care Gentlemen. Jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 I use the fiber as a sighting device all the time. Imagine the notch in your rear sight as a box. Center the dot exactly in the center of this box and the top of the post will be very close to the top of the notch. Certainly close enough for anything inside 15 yds. If you need to be more precise then switch your focus to the top of the post for those tough shots. The fiber optic enables you to be fast when you need to be but precise when the shot calls for it. This type of sighting takes some discipline to develop and is not for everyone. Also, for those with older eyes who can't see the post the fiber optic offers an alternative if you can develop the skill to center the dot in the notch. If you are using this type of sight picture all the time then sight in with the dot centered in the notch. Ditto what Bob said. On poppers and shots beyond 15, I make sure I see (try to anyways) the black on the top of the sight, closer I line the fiber in the center of the notch, it seems to be good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 I wouldn't have said this two or three years ago, but notch and post is the most reliable and accurate way to shoot a limited/production pistol, period. If you have good light yes, without a doubt for me, but if you shoot in area with shade/shadows and low light and lead bullets fiber optic can make a huge difference. I've been to ranges shooting a standard sight where you can't see the sight because of poor lighting, shadows and smoke. If I am shooting a match with good light I will generally take a black sharpie to the optic and black it out if I am serious about the match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 For me the temptation with a fiber front is to shoot it like a dot, which for me, is always a mistake. As soon as I use the fiber and ignore the front sight, I shift into "put the dot on and rip it" mode and the missing begins. Yes I agree that you can shoot off the fiber. I've done it a lot, but don't have the talent to switch gears like you guys obviously can. Sorry for the crap advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 As soon as I use the fiber and ignore the front sight, I shift into "put the dot on and rip it" mode and the missing begins. Isn't the fiber on the front sight of your gun? (smart ass mode off) That is a huge temptation, but you still have to maintain front sight to rear sight alignment and not dot color on target. ... and no it isn't always easy, but it isn't that hard either, it just takes focus. I serrate all my front sights, because I know when I'm shooting tight shots I need to see the serrations. It is helps me switch gears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazos Custom Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Eric, Try a different color fiber that is not so bright. Sometimes this will help because the fiber does not overwhelm the post. (That's also the idea behind the Microdot.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.Hayden Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 100% with Bob.. I have the MicroDot... it's excellent. Just switched from red to green when it came back from Tripp.. green, just helps you find the sight, but not too bright to draw your eye to it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Larry Cazes Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 I use a green microdot on my SV limited gun...Great sight. It is much more precise and causes much less glare/haloeing then the others ive tried (dawson and EGW). I started off with a stright black Bomar front and rear on this gun and since installing the microdot and shooting with it for a while I would never go back to the plain front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Eric, Try a different color fiber that is not so bright. Sometimes this will help because the fiber does not overwhelm the post. (That's also the idea behind the Microdot.) Thanks Bob. That's a great idea. The microdot is what I've got. I don't have diff colored fiber, but I'll take a magic marker to it tomorrow and see if toning it down helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brazos Custom Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Eric, Check your package you should have some yellow fiber. Every sight comes with red, green, and yellow fiber. Yellow is usually the least bright for most eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dead Buff Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 For the above reasons I designed my own front sight... I counter sunk the fibre into the serated post and the fibre is half "bedded" into the metal. Thus only the top half of the fibre gathers light and emits it in a deep, black hole - so its not too bright, still red, very visible in the sight and I still have a "conventional" post. The sight is designed in such a way that the 1mm fibre is dead centre in the rear Bo-Mar notch when the post is perfectly alligned (that was the difficult part.....) The fibre helps me see my sight, but I aim with the post.... My 0.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Dunn Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 I only have about 50-60 events under my belt so I'm kinda new to the sport but am loving every moment of it. Dude, that makes you an old school expert. You should be telling other folks what to do by now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loves2Shoot Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 I use Bob's microdot also, the big fiber optics are way too overwhelming for my eyes, I've tried 5 front posts and it seems to work the best for me in "all around." If I was shooting bright light all the time, no dawn/dusk/shadows, I would shoot a non-fiber sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 30, 2004 Share Posted August 30, 2004 I tried Dr. Londrigan's advice and used a dimmer fiber. So far, I like it. I'm using violet fiber - which is about as dim as it gets. Indoors, it practically looks clear. It may be a "Trick of the Day" but if it keeps me from fixating on the fiber, fine by me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbletap_ed Posted September 18, 2004 Share Posted September 18, 2004 I also just switched to a dot. I found that I like the MicroDot as well and at Bob's suggestion the yellow works best for me. The red was so bright that I could not see the top of the sight in our Florida sun. That is before all of the dang hurricanes started hitting us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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