Scope for Varmint/Target Rifle

[STIGUY]

Need to scope .308 Target rifle. prfer magnification and there have looked at the Leup

Mark 4 8,5-25x50MM. Looking to Consistently make precision shots at 600 yards. This is also about my Price Range. Plan on using Laser Range Finder and therefore would prefer optic with Lines or Mil Dots. Have been thinking Vortex and Night Force. Night Force because of the Lines instead of dots. The Leup that uses the Horus type reticles are like $2-3K. Also like Steiner and swarovski reticles, but are out of my price range. Was thinking of Minox but it is kind of on the low end on magnification and has a 1" tube. Looking for atleast 6X mag on low end and one inch tube. Any other suggestions in this price range with side focus?

[1760yds]

Need to scope .308 Target rifle. prfer magnification and there have looked at the Leup

Mark 4 8,5-25x50MM. Looking to Consistently make precision shots at 600 yards. This is also about my Price Range. Plan on using Laser Range Finder and therefore would prefer optic with Lines or Mil Dots. Have been thinking Vortex and Night Force. Night Force because of the Lines instead of dots. The Leup that uses the Horus type reticles are like $2-3K. Also like Steiner and swarovski reticles, but are out of my price range. Was thinking of Minox but it is kind of on the low end on magnification and has a 1" tube. Looking for atleast 6X mag on low end and one inch tube. Any other suggestions in this price range with side focus?

You should look at a Sightron 6-24x50 SIII with either MOA reticle or MILS. I'm switching all my long range optics to Sightron SIII's. The glass is equal to Nightforce and they track perfectly. They also cost less than half of what a Nightforce costs. Also 24x should be more than enough needed to shoot 600 yards. When mirage is bad I turn power down to 16x at 1000 yard F-TR Matches. That being said I have a Nightforce 5.5-22x56 with NPR2 Illuminated reticle that I'd make you a deal on.

[Jaxshooter]

Nightforce with the MilDot reticle. Also look at U S Optics. You can't go wrong with either one.

[snowtop]

Nightforce 5.5-22x50 or 56mm, if your going to spend the money for the Leupold go ahead an get the nightforce. I love mine it has the MRL reticle.

[whistlepig]

I have both a Nightforce and several Leupolds...... Both are good for what you describe, but if you like the idea of lines, look at the TMR reticle in the Leupolds. The marks are in Mil form but in fine lines.

[whistlepig]

I thought more about what I just typed..... they aren't fine lines, but in between fine and heavy. If you are familiar with traditional Mil-dots, the marks are in the same locations, but in the thickness of regular cross hair wire.

[Graham Smith]

I thought more about what I just typed..... they aren't fine lines, but in between fine and heavy. If you are familiar with traditional Mil-dots, the marks are in the same locations, but in the thickness of regular cross hair wire.

The generic term is a MILRAD reticle and it may have dots (round or oval) or lines.

Since you are not using the reticle for ranging, you must be wanting to use it to make corrections. If so, then you will probably want a FFP scope with a MIL/MIL reticle/knob combination and either target or tactical turrets.

Nightforce is a great scopes but for 600yds there are a few better bargains available. For example, have a look at the Viper PST 6-24x .

You also might want to go here and review some of the rather lengthy discussions on optics choices.

[rrflyer]

What is your budget?

I've been lucky enough to play with some really nice optics...that being said I couldn't justify keeping one of them. I regularly shoot to 500 yards and a 8 or 10 times a year get to go to 1,000 or better.

I recently picked up a Vortex Viper PST 4-16 Mil/Mil. These can be had new for 750$ The higher magnification is nice but not really necessary. I think you'll find most people end up operating there scopes in the mid-teens anyhow.

The new "hotness" in Tactical scopes is First Focal Plane and Mil/Mil setups. These allow the easiest and most efficient way of applying your dope and corrections on the scope.

[Joe139]

My vote is a Burris 8 to 32 for the money if money isn't a issue check out a 10 to 60 March in my opinion the best scope made Kelblys sells them you can't have too much power

[elkboy]

You might consider less magnification than 8.5-25. Your field of view gets pretty small and target acquisition is more difficult. For $700 my vote is the Vortex Viper PST 2.5-10 with the mil rad reticle. http://www.vortexoptics.com/product/vortex-viper-pst-2-5-10x44-riflescope-with-ebr-1-mrad-reticle/reticle Here is a link to the reticle http://www.vortexoptics.com/uploads/sub_viper-pst_210s1-mrad_details.jpg If you are looking for the tightest groups on long range stationary targets then the high magnification is great. Just my 2 cents, your mileage may vary.

[427Cobra]

Mr Smith you sir are mistaken big time if you think a Viper PST is a better scope than a Nightforce, its a cheap scope, glass sucks big time compared to Nightforce, I have looked thru a far share of them and none came close to a Nightforce, Razor is a different story, as a matter of fact Razor, Nightforce and Bushnell Elite glass all come from the same building in Japan. My only advice is spend more than your scope than you did on your rifle, and buy a scope with matching reticle and knobs, MRAD\MRAD, MOA\MOA, I perfer MRADs, its a dead simple.

[Graham Smith]

Mr Smith you sir are mistaken big time if you think a Viper PST is a better scope than a Nightforce

Never said it was nor did I intend to imply it was. I said "Nightforce is a great scopes but for 600yds there are a few better bargains available". It all depends on what the shooter needs - what level of precision is required. Not everyone needs to spend $2000 plus on a scope. I've watched a couple people shoot 1/2 MOA at 600yds with a semi-custom Savage 10 with a mid-priced 4-14x scope and factory ammo. And I've watched people with custom rifles with Schmidt and Bender scopes who were having trouble keeping under 2 MOA at the same distance.

Edited November 14, 2011 by Graham Smith

[Mr.Kirk]

Nightforce and if it costs too much look at the nightforce benchrest scopes. If you are using a rangefinder why get the reticle all busied up? Nightforce has all of their reticles on their website.

You say that you want to make prescision shots at 600 Yds. Are you competing w/ it?

If so; go big on magnification, avoid the FFP, don't get all of the busy ranging stuff in the reticle.

A higher magnification will allow a tighter hold. The FFP will cover your target at high magnifications. The busy reticles will not help you figure out known distances and all you will probably need is a dot. Competition targets are sized per MOA (close enough) so the grid is on the target.

If you want it to pull double duty you have to look at compromising somewhere.

I shoot F-class and I won't put a competition rifle together w/out a side focus scope.

A used T-series Weaver is a good starter scope for competiton and varminting.

[whistlepig]

Mr Smith you sir are mistaken big time if you think a Viper PST is a better scope than a Nightforce

Never said it was nor did I intend to imply it was. I said "Nightforce is a great scopes but for 600yds there are a few better bargains available". It all depends on what the shooter needs - what level of precision is required. Not everyone needs to spend $2000 plus on a scope. I've watched a couple people shoot 1/2 MOA at 600yds with a semi-custom Savage 10 with a mid-priced 4-14x scope and factory ammo. And I've watched people with custom rifles with Schmidt and Bender scopes who were having trouble keeping under 2 MOA at the same distance.

This says it well

[Graham Smith]

FWIW, I'm fairly new to long distance shooting, but I have spent a lot of time reading reviews and opinions, forum posts, etc. One of the things I notice is that people often leave out a critical piece of information when they are asking/giving information. I see this a lot on another forum dedicated to long range shooting - people ask things like, "Is the Savage 10 better than the Remington 700?" Well, maybe, but knowing which model for what purpose would be helpful.

Rifles, scopes, ammunition, and gear, are all tools. Some tools are designed for general purpose use but some are intended for a very specific purpose. Take bullets for example, there are some really high BC bullets that are intended for long range target shooting, but they are nearly worthless for hunting and some won't work worth a darn in some rifles.

And when it comes to precision rifles, then distance, target, type of shooting, and degree of precision all come into play. How precise is precise? 1MOA or 1/4MOA or less?

Mr Kirk is correct when he commented that a ranging reticle may not be necessary. I erred from the start in assuming that because the person was asking about dots vs lines he intended to use the reticle for holdovers rather than ranging, in which case a FFP scope would be a better choice.

So, the best choice becomes really subject to requirements. Then there is the issue of cost - value for the dollar. If one scope is adequate to the task and costs $700 and another is way better but costs $1400, which is the "better" choice? A good example here: On another forum there are a lot of guys that shoot in sniper type competitions, often at distances no greater than 600yds (800yd max). They are rather fond of WOTAC and Falcon Menace scopes for new shooters. They are low cost, reasonably good optics for the money, and will get the shooter on target - if the shooter can't keep it under 2MOA then it's likely to be operator error rather than inferior equipment.

<off soapbox>

[STIGUY]

As a follow up, I was hoping to have " the limes" to basically use instead of holdiover. That us....to sight in for say in 200 yards and have subsequent limes umderneath for say 300, 400

etc. I would know the range via a rangefimder. The high

magnification would be nice as I just prefer high magnification optics.

However, if I had to choose, quality over quantity (magnification) everty time. I have a pair of EL 10x42 Binos that I just love. I wish they had the Swarobrite lenses, but I have used these for hunting, outdoor events etc. and don't leave home without them. I chose these over the 12x50 as it was a compromise (not price) decision.

THX

[JKSNIPER]

Said to me a long time ago so I'll repeat it here for your benefit STI...."Scopes don't help you shoot better ...they help you see better" and the gentleman saying this then illustrated his point by having another gentleman at the range get all slung up and fire a 10 round 300 yard group, using iron sights, tighter than anything shot until then by the guys using 10-22X magnification on their scopes.

However...it IS nice to see better:)

BUT having shot higher power magnification scopes ....they take some getting used to and some guys just CAN'T get used to the inherent "wobble" we all have but usually don't see.

Until we get behind a 22 or more power scope and get all worked up by how much movement we see in there.

Schmidt and Bender ....if you can afford it......if not then NightforceNXS 3.5-15 with the mildot reticle should suffice for your needs.

JK