powder jumps out on station three on 650

[saster]

The ball bearing "fix" was installed directly when i got my 650 (the press is unusable for 9mm without it).

However another "snapping" issue has appeard instead. When the shell plate indexer resets, powder "jumps" out on station

Three. This is extremely annoying and forces me to put my finger on top of the case when raising the handle.

Down to under 300 rounds an hour because of this!

I pulled the press apart to see what could be causing it... index ring looked ok, spring ok, changed that spring loaded hammer looking indexarm. No effect.

Any ideas on hown to solve this?

[bbbean]

The ball bearing "fix" was installed directly when i got my 650 (the press is unusable for 9mm without it).

However another "snapping" issue has appeard instead. When the shell plate indexer resets, powder "jumps" out on station

Three. This is extremely annoying and forces me to put my finger on top of the case when raising the handle.

Down to under 300 rounds an hour because of this!

I pulled the press apart to see what could be causing it... index ring looked ok, spring ok, changed that spring loaded hammer looking indexarm. No effect.

Any ideas on hown to solve this?

Clip a coil off the spring under the ball. I also found that moving the powder hopper/bell to station three meant I only had one bounce to deal with. There's a certain amount of powder spillage you just have to deal with.

[Skydiver]

By "ball bearing fix", I assume you mean trimming a half a coil or full coil from the spring under the ball bearing.

A couple of things to check:

Got the right sized shell plate and pins?

Are the grooves in the shell plate that hold the brass clean?

Is the pocket that holds the spring and ball bearing clean?

Got the right adjustment for the shell plate: just loose enough so that it can spin?

When I was loading Silhouette, the "spilling" was getting annoying so I rigged some foam pads right before and at station 3 to provide contact with the brass all along and absorb any shock. I've used up/given away all my Silhouette, so I've removed and thrown away the padding otherwise I would have taken a picture to share.

Edited August 22, 2011 by Skydiver

[BMartens]

Definitely clip a coil off the ball detent spring and adjust the plate carefully with a very slight drag. I use Slide Glide on the bearings and just a very small amount under the plate. It is slick and stays where you put it. Touchy part is getting the plate adjustment just right.

And, if you are using Silhouette for major 9 you will still get a few grains knocked around. A shot of canned air every time you fill primers will keep it clean.

[lcs]

Definitely clip a coil off the ball detent spring and adjust the plate carefully with a very slight drag. I use Slide Glide on the bearings and just a very small amount under the plate. It is slick and stays where you put it. Touchy part is getting the plate adjustment just right.

And, if you are using Silhouette for major 9 you will still get a few grains knocked around. A shot of canned air every time you fill primers will keep it clean.

All good things. How "steady" is your entire 650? I have my table bolted to the wall studs. I can load pretty full cases with slopping powder, but there is always some on the shell plate. I use the air can also.

[Glockcomma]

I have my press bolted securely but do not have any of the other mods, I moved my seating die to the number 3 location years ago and am putting a bullet over the powder before it has a chance to bounce out. I'm using AutoComp now which is much more compact, but loaded many of thousands of rounds with Silhouette and lost nary a grain.

[Scott Steele]

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=584

Try this, it may have some information.

[bbbean]

I moved my seating die to the number 3 location years ago and am putting a bullet over the powder before it has a chance to bounce out.

When do you get a chance to confirm powder in the brass? I think you'd be safer to leave seating in 4 and move powder to three - that way you still get a good look into the shell before you place the bullet.

[saster]

Sorry, i ment the needle bearing fix discussed in another thread.

It's the right plate and buttons.

Does the powder bar reset allow for it to be put on station three?

The problem occurs when the plate has rotated into position, and the index ring resets.

A slight click is heard an the powder jumps out of the case at station three.

[bbbean]

Sorry, i ment the needle bearing fix discussed in another thread.

It's the right plate and buttons.

Does the powder bar reset allow for it to be put on station three?

Yes, the powder bar reset will work on station three, and that way you get a good look into the shell before you place the bullet.

[BMartens]

The problem occurs when the plate has rotated into position, and the index ring resets.

A slight click is heard an the powder jumps out of the case at station three.

What you describe can be resolved by clipping the detent Sprint and tightening the shell plate just a little bit. The Slide Glide helps the plate move smoother when it is snuffed down enough to remove that last bit of snap.

[Sarge]

I thought of trading up to a 650 this winter but since I started loading 9MAJOR I'll stick with my 550. It's very smooth at 400 an hour.

[Glockcomma]

I moved my seating die to the number 3 location years ago and am putting a bullet over the powder before it has a chance to bounce out.

When do you get a chance to confirm powder in the brass? I think you'd be safer to leave seating in 4 and move powder to three - that way you still get a good look into the shell before you place the bullet.

I load sitting and have a lamp that I swing over to the press when I load. I look in every single piece of brass before I put a bullet on it, you can easily do this right before the detent locates the shell plate. But moving the powder measurer would work as long as you cover the powder before the shell plate is located. It just takes a second to move your seating die give it a try you'll see it's not a problem. In 20 years of reloading I have never had a double charge or a squib I'm pretty careful when making ammo.

Edited August 23, 2011 by Glockcomma

[Spanners]

I installed a bearing kit on 1 of my 650s and it is SUPER smooth witht he right amount of drag and no clicking into position.

Can outrun the casefeeder loading 9mm now and have no issues with spilling powder.

My biggest fix was strethcing the spring behind the detent ball in the primer system - fixed ALL my priming issues 100%

[saster]

I will test with cutting of a coil on the spring this weekend.

I doubt it will help as the plate has fully rotated into position, when the index ring resets.

But i'm getting desperate here ... need a couple of thousands 9mm asap

If that doesn't work I have to send an email to dillon.

[saster]

Well cutting coils of the spring did not work..

Got a bit worried when i couldn't find a replacement spring in the repair kit ... but found it after a while.

[UW Mitch]

I'm doing powder in 3 and seating in 4. On the upstroke powder is dropped in the case, on the downstroke before the shellplate is indexed to the next location I visually verify powder, place the bullet with the left hand, and continue the downstroke holding the bullet in place. This has eliminated the spilling for me, loading Major9 with Sil. It's no slower once in a rhythm, I just have to be attentive to what I'm doing (as we all should be while reloading). With 5 primer tubes loaded up I can do about 500 rounds in an hour.

[saster]

I had another look under the shell plate.

Not sure if the pictures will give you any new ideas?

A small piece is chipped off in the back, as you can see in one of the images.

I Doubt that is any problem though, as the plastic piece is seated deeper then that.

Also there is a clear mark on the "hammer looking index part" ... could that indicate too much spring tension?

Pretty sure this is the piece causing the snap when the index ring resets (as the plate has fully rotated and the ball is already in place).

I did move the powder to station three (thanks for the suggestion!).

It takes care of 90% of my problems, but I would still like to know why they occur in the first place.

[Skydiver]

This may be taken the wrong way, but it looks like your ball is sticking out too far. Are you sure you trimmed off a coil from the spring?

[saster]

Not on that spring ... did it on another spring a bit at a time until it was too short, just to see if it would help.

But again.. the ball is already in place when the ring resets.

[ItsanSKS]

I just recently started having the same problem, and attempted the needle bearing fix, in addition to clipping 1 full coil off of the index ball spring. No effect.

The powder jumps out as the indexer 'hammer' returns to its normal position.

Things I am going to try, in order:

Tighten the shell plate bolt 1/16 turn.

Re-grease the underside of the shell plate.

Re-grease the indexer ball and spring.

Re-grease the indexer return spring.

Stretch the indexer return spring.

After that, I'm out of ideas. Anything else I'm missing?

[saster]

Sacrifice something red to the blue gods, and pray

I gave up on finding the reason (for now).. moved powder to station three, and tightened the shell plate/catch the case when it comes into station four, with whatever finger not holding a bullet.

Not as fast as it was before the problems started, but probably around 85%.

[Skydiver]

Try taking the thrust bearing out. For me the thrust bearing made things better, but for a friend, it made it worse.

[Zartiblartfast]

You can stop the powder swashing without any of the above by simply placing the bullet into the case in between station 2 & 3 as the shell plate is rotating. Use you hand to brake the shell plate gently to a stop as it indexes. With a bit of practice it become very smooth and you dont think about it any longer !

[Sumtoc]

You can stop the powder swashing without any of the above by simply placing the bullet into the case in between station 2 & 3 as the shell plate is rotating. Use you hand to brake the shell plate gently to a stop as it indexes. With a bit of practice it become very smooth and you dont think about it any longer !

This is exactly what I have done with my 650 for the past 12 years. Unless you have a bullet feeder you have to get the bullet on top of the case anyway so why not slow down/control the snapping with your left hand?

FWIW, I installed the bearing and washers mod and it caused new problems with my large primer system so I took it back off. Your mileage may vary.....