IPSC shotgun rule proposals

[bigbrowndog]

IPSC is proposing new rules for shotgun that will limit, loading techniques, not allow multiple ammo types in stages or even in your gun, they want to limit ammo carrying methods, and a host of other ill timed and not thought out rulings. Much of this will completely change the way we know practical shotgunning in overseas matches, I know a lot of you do not shoot IPSC matches, if these proposals take effect some of us that do will probably no longer take the time to do so. Please let our RD, Mike Voigt, know that we do not want to let ANY of these rule changes to take place. Here in the U.S. we benefit from having plenty of outlaw matches to choose from, our overseas brethren do not have that luxury. These new proposals severely limit innovation, and some of the people pushing the changes claim that they are needed to level the playing field, or that they are really relaxations of existing rules, in reality they are limiting shooter creativity, and the whole spirit of our game, practicality and the freedom for the shooter to solve the shooting challenges.

[Alaskapopo]

IPSC is proposing new rules for shotgun that will limit, loading techniques, not allow multiple ammo types in stages or even in your gun, they want to limit ammo carrying methods, and a host of other ill timed and not thought out rulings. Much of this will completely change the way we know practical shotgunning in overseas matches, I know a lot of you do not shoot IPSC matches, if these proposals take effect some of us that do will probably no longer take the time to do so. Please let our RD, Mike Voigt, know that we do not want to let ANY of these rule changes to take place. Here in the U.S. we benefit from having plenty of outlaw matches to choose from, our overseas brethren do not have that luxury. These new proposals severely limit innovation, and some of the people pushing the changes claim that they are needed to level the playing field, or that they are really relaxations of existing rules, in reality they are limiting shooter creativity, and the whole spirit of our game, practicality and the freedom for the shooter to solve the shooting challenges.

Sounds crappy what are they proposing exactly?

Pat

[cold]

IPSC is proposing new rules for shotgun that will limit, loading techniques, not allow multiple ammo types in stages or even in your gun, they want to limit ammo carrying methods, and a host of other ill timed and not thought out rulings. Much of this will completely change the way we know practical shotgunning in overseas matches, I know a lot of you do not shoot IPSC matches, if these proposals take effect some of us that do will probably no longer take the time to do so. Please let our RD, Mike Voigt, know that we do not want to let ANY of these rule changes to take place. Here in the U.S. we benefit from having plenty of outlaw matches to choose from, our overseas brethren do not have that luxury. These new proposals severely limit innovation, and some of the people pushing the changes claim that they are needed to level the playing field, or that they are really relaxations of existing rules, in reality they are limiting shooter creativity, and the whole spirit of our game, practicality and the freedom for the shooter to solve the shooting challenges.

Thanks for the heads up Trapr.

I think this is some of what he is talking about Pat

Link: http://ipsc.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=12860

and this link: http://ipsc.invisionzone.com/index.php?showtopic=12732&st=0

Some excerpts:

"2.1.12 Courses of fire must nominate a single permitted type of ammunition, i.e. birdshot, buckshot

or slugs.

This means that there will NOT be mixed ammo stages or stages which can be shot by buck/bird, buck/slug."

"Quote

5.2.3 Unless otherwise specified in the written stage briefing the competitor’s equipment belt

carrying cartridges (in caddies, loops, clips, bags or pouches) and/or detachable magazines

and/or speed loaders must be worn at waist level. “Chest rigs”, bandoliers and similar

carriers are expressly prohibited. Additional ammunition carriers mounted on forearms are

permitted provided that cartridges are carried individually in loops or clips

Quote

5.2.3.2 Only one equipment carrying belt is permitted. Cartridges held in loops or clips on

the belt are restricted to a maximum of 2 cartridges high. Caddies (often known as

“strippers”) must not exceed 6 rounds capacity.."

Edited May 27, 2011 by cold

[bigbrowndog]

thanks Jansen,

Pat it goes further to include that on the same ammo rule you cannot have #6's in your gun and #7.5 shot at the same time, or a 3 dram load and a 3.5 dram load, or a Remington and a Winchester etc. thats just part of the ridiculous stuff they want to implement.

trapr

[Charles Bond]

I am rather confident that our RD is opposed to all of these silly rules. But you have to appreciate how rules are drawn in IPSC.

IPSC will never leave anything alone. They change rules on a regular basis just to have something to do and those who time and time again propound new equipment rules are the same delegates who get mad because someone turned up at a match which a better mousetrap. In the case of chest rigs I expect that they will say something akin to it does not "look right" and say we need to change it to gain broader acceptance.

To this all I can say is that IPSC changed the targets yet no Olympics and no extra countries because of it. And if we are going to adopt equipment based on looks, in a couple of years all of us who are shooting a camo M-2 becasue it was on the sale rack will have to dip it or paint it as we are going to be led like sheep to the slaughter when something things a camo gun does not look right.

[bigbrowndog]

Holy crap, charles..........its getting scary, we agree on something!!!!

thanks for the support.

trapr

[Benelli Chick]

While I agree, sometimes it's just rules for the sake of rules...

I feel like some of these rules are coming from the "level the playing field" mindset. Now, while we've discussed this elsewhere and there's no such thing as a level playing field, it just seems that IPSC and sometimes USPSA rules are trying to make everything the same for everyone except speed on the trigger.

I really hope that brains and thought are one of the things we test with our shooting scenarios. I know "power,speed,accuracy", but brains seem to me to be important.

It feels to me like rules such as only use one kind of ammo on a stage, no loading from a vest etc, etc. are rules designed to eliminate all thought from a course of fire. I like to be able to think about my strengths and "game" it the best for me. But, I'm out of the IPSC loop, as I like to design AND shoot "choicey" stages. If someone wants to candycane spreader ammo and regular birdshot for clays then steel, why not let him. It may hurt him, it may help him, but why do we want to stop people from thinking and planning??

If you find a better way to load a shotgun, if it's better for someone else, then they can practice it and then they'll be faster, too. Why do we want to limit innovation?? That's what these new rules seem to say. "We want everyone to shoot each stage with the exact same things, in the same way, then faster trigger finger (with accuracy) wins!" I'd like to see shooters have choices. In a stage with flying birds and stationary steel (maybe a little heavy) shooters have to decide what choke and ammo they should use. Tighter choke, heavier for steel?? Spreader and spreaders for flying birds?? But, then the steel??? It's a decision! Why do we want to limit decisions and thought??

Anyway, my .37. Let shooters make choices. If the ammo isn't unsafe, let people use it. Innovation is good! If you don't like vests, design stages where the shooter goes prone. There are ways...without changing the rules for everyone all the time!

I know, most of you agree, but why limit choice??

It feels like someone's afraid that someone else will shoot smarter than them.

Denise

Edited May 31, 2011 by Benelli Chick

[DinosaurMikeGolf]

There is no "level playing field". If there was, no one would win. The game would always end in a tie for all participating.

[Benelli Chick]

There is no "level playing field". If there was, no one would win. The game would always end in a tie for all participating.

I agree! That's why I think we just give the same challenge and let people figure out how to solve it with their brains, and stop trying to make everyone the same!!

[technetium-99m]

Some of the rules seem to be an effort to make the sport more PC by eliminating chest rigs etc. and trying to eliminate evil looking firearms.

But this comes from a person who thinks iron sighted mag fed shotguns should be allowed in Limited/TacOptics, so take it for what it's worth.