what makes the M&P not want to run reliably w/ a lighter recoil sp

[want2race]

I have installed full kits in quite a few guns without light strikes. In the Pro I shoot, I have the trigger spring and sear spring installed. I don't feel like messing up the zero by taking off the rear to install the FPB safety spring. Kguns had already polished the stock FPB so I didn't bother. Installing the supplied FPB and spring that comes with the kit makes the biggest improvement other than the trigger spring.

No light strikes for me, even with a shortened Apex striker spring. It only took .25# off the trigger pull. Not nearly as big of a change as the Glock striker spring changes. I can still get under 3# triggers using the stock striker spring.

[G-ManBart]

If you need to run a really light spring to make a Pro or 9L shoot flat, you may consider looking at your grip

Thanks, I'll work on that.

My comment was actually for the OP

People get far too wound up about needing "light springs so the gun shoots flat" thinking it will help them shoot faster. Sure, there's some difference, but it takes quite a bit of skill to see it, much less take advantage of it. This is especially true when we're talking something like a Pro with Minor ammo....even with the factory spring, and fairly hot ammo, a good grip can keep the gun extremely flat.

Just before the weather really changed here, a buddy of mine and I were doing a little shooting after a day of instructing. One of our pieces of steel is a 3/4 silhouette (might be a touch smaller than that). At sometime like 10yds he was struggling to get his split times down below maybe .35 or .40...the muzzle was flipping high, pausing, then resetting. Many people try to fix that with springs. I showed him how simple grip tweaks could minimize the flip, and speed up the reset.....bingo...splits more like .25

Do you think your scores would be worse if the recoil spring was a pound or two heavier than it is now? R,

[DocMedic]

If you need to run a really light spring to make a Pro or 9L shoot flat, you may consider looking at your grip

Thanks, I'll work on that.

My comment was actually for the OP

Well "need" is a broad word, only thing I need are bullets . Today we had a small ICORE (or bring what you got) match so I decided to work on just grip. (using a different gun). What I notice during the match was I actually have a very strong grip BUT my wrist seem to be my weak link. The sights always tracked back on target but I could tell that my wrist were way to relax allowing the recoil to flex them to max angle. When I focused on stiffening my wrist up a little I notice the slide would just slide back with no upward movement of the gun and locking back forward with no barrel down wobble, making the second shot almost effortless and seemed faster on the split. So for the next couple weeks I'm gonna work on wrist strength and see how that works out.

[twodelta]

I put an 11# recoil spring, and the Apex kit in my 9 Pro. My wife decided she liked the gun, and has put about 4k rounds through it. The only issues she's had was with some lead bullets I reloaded. They fouled the throat up, and wouldn't feed after about 100 rounds. No issues with 124 FMJ minor reloads or factory ammo.

She just got me a 40 Pro. I put a 13# recoil spring, Apex spring kit(without the striker spring), and polished the sear. I've only put about 300 rounds through it so far. I did shoot one magazine through it while only holding it with just my middle finger and thumb, and couldn't get it to jam.

[Sarge]

If you need to run a really light spring to make a Pro or 9L shoot flat, you may consider looking at your grip

Thanks, I'll work on that. Here's some major PF shooting.

http://www.youtube.c.../16/rWxSfohHV6Q

Ooh snap!

[Mike Wood]

If you need to run a really light spring to make a Pro or 9L shoot flat, you may consider looking at your grip

Thanks, I'll work on that.

My comment was actually for the OP

People get far too wound up about needing "light springs so the gun shoots flat" thinking it will help them shoot faster.

As you probably already know Bart controlling flip isn't the only reason to go to lighter springs. It certainly bears mentioning that if you reload (and say run your PF around 130 for IDPA compliance) you more than likely are now much closer to having a malfunction if the gun will run at all because your stock spring is too heavy for your ammo. Factories usually set their guns up to run with factory ammo, however most competitors do not reload up where factory stuff usually is. The spring MUST be tuned to the ammo, and there should be a fair margin of error for weak hand limp wrists etc. Most stock guns are oversprung for all but fairly hot ammo and most pistolsmiths agree on this. There are issues when you go too light as well, I find with the Glock as soon as a 13 pound spring starts getting short I'll get light strikes. I usually run a 15 in my G34 because although I can notice the improvement in flip between the 13 vs 15 the 15 has an edge in long term reliability with my loads. M&P's are probably affected the same way.

MW

[DocMedic]

Well after not shooting my M&P pro for 3 weeks after doing the work on it outside of dry-firing I finally took it to the range and did some shooting. Biggest things I focus on was using all types of shooting grips, shooting at a plate rack at varied distances. I could not get it to screw up what so ever with the 13lbs spring, Thumbs on frame, thumbs off frame, death ninja grip, very loose grip, as long as I didn't let my wrist give in to recoil the sights tacked very cleanly to the rear and lock back up smooth during each transition between plates.

I did notice one thing though, I was getting more consistent hits from 40yards on the plate rack with a very relaxed no thumb frame grip then i was by choking it so to speak, but at closer range 15yards my transition, and muzzle flip were much better with a tight thumbs on frame grip then they were with a light grip.

Anyways I think that adjusting the ejector angle, sanding & polishing the chamber helped the most on getting the gun run, Polishing every contact point that the barrel made was probably a little overkill but so far so good. I'm gonna order a 11lbs spring and try that out. Oh I finally settle on a PF of 130-132, seems to run consistent for me.

[twodownzero]

If you need to run a really light spring to make a Pro or 9L shoot flat, you may consider looking at your grip

Thanks, I'll work on that. Here's some major PF shooting.

http://www.youtube.c.../16/rWxSfohHV6Q

Ooh snap!

Having seen Shaun shoot in person, my thoughts exactly.

Personally, I think all this spring discussion for minor PF guns is a complete waste of time. If you think recoil is slowing you down at 140 pf, what you need is a whole lot of ammo to practice, not some sort of gun modification.

The M&P doesn't like lighter springs because the slide is heavier than other striker fired guns, I suspect.

Edited January 31, 2011 by twodownzero

[want2race]

Actually, I think the slide is lighter than the XD. That would definitely be a correct statement about XD's. With a lighter FPB safety spring, lighter striker spring (Apex -4 for example), the M&P seems to do quite well with much lighter recoil springs. I just like the way it feels. I honestly forget I'm NOT shooting a 2011 or 1911. I worked over Fomeisters FS M&P. Same recipe, 11lb, Apex springs, my cut on the sear, 2.0lb trigger and it runs. I'm sure his will need some extractor work soon, but for now I like to watch peoples reaction when the dry fire it.