Loading .223 on a 1050

[pjb45]

I have a RL1050 and I am getting ready to trim a bunch of brass with the 1200 electronic trimmer. BUT, I have some confusion.

Station 1 Redding Full Length

Station 5 1200 Trimmer

The instructions say Trim then size? What is best?

I have read that you should:

1. Only partial size and decap

2. Trim

3. Neck size only

Is there a problem with doing a full length size and decapping in the first station?

Do I need to neck size after I trim?

I have read about pushing the neck shoulder back too far, how do I determine this?

I am using the Dillon 600 swage so I plan on swaging after I trim.

Then with the second tool head:

I prime, powder, seat and crimp.

I am shooting a JP AR 15.

[RevolverJockey]

The trimmer only really works well if you have not sized the brass as it uses the friction of the over sized brass to hold while it trims. You could run a decapping die in station 1 and a trimmer in station 5 with a FL sizer in the last station to complete the sizing and sort of deburr the case mouth.

Lee

[DougCarden]

Lee, I don't mean to disagree with you, but I run a Redding bushing small base die in the 1st station and the 1200 Trimmer in station 5. It still works in my experience trimming the brass fine. The biggest thing that I have found is that you need to hold the toolhead down for about 2sec. for the cutter to clean up the cut. You can hear when the cutter is done with the cut and then do it all over again.

I may have just been lucky so far....I will try some both ways and compare sizing. The biggest problem I had with just running it through the trimmer sizing die was that it was pretty hard in and out of the die, kinda herky jerky.

DougC

[RiggerJJ]

Doesn't the RL1050 have a swager built in like the Super 1050? If it does, use it.

Dillon carbide full length size/decapper in station one

swager in station 2

trimmer where ever it fits, station 5 is fine

As Doug says, the full length sizing is done 1st then trim (don't size after triming, it will cause the trim length to vary), and holding the handle down for a 2 potato is helpful to get a good trim. The Dillon trimmer does such a good job you don't need to de-bur the necks. I've run thousands upon thousands of pieces of brass this way, with no problems. You don't need a neck sizer.

For your reloading head, a ever-so-slight neck expansion just prior to bullet seating is very helpful (the swager rod does this fine). And for AR-15s, a ever-so-slight crimp is necessary.

jj

[pjb45]

Hiya,

Thanks for all the good input. It really helps me alot. This is my first experience with rifle cases so I am at a loss most of the time.

I have a variety of .223 brass, the RL1050 swager in station 2 is ok but with different types of brass I have run into some issues with pockets not be as clean as possible. So I purchased the Super Swager. This tool is awesome. It does such a good job, I just end up swaging all my brass once. If I pick up any range brass, it goes into the swage process on the Super Swage. I have had a couple of mangled primers when I bypassed this step.

I am in the process of adjusting the trimming today. So my plan is to:

Redding Full Length Sizing Die in 1 - even with previously sized brass from Scharch hangs up a bit when sizing.

I am still at tad bit worried about the shoulder. Should I be able to see that the shoulder is being pushed too much.

I am using a JP Case Gauge that is tailored for the JP rifle I am shooting.

[pjb45]

Hello

I have added some pictures of brass that has been resized and trimmed.

From the left to right: Rounds 1 and 2 were resized and trimmed Round 3 is from Scharch, Rounds 4 and 5 resized and trimmed, Round 6 was commercial remanufactured

When I look at the angle from the body to the neck and the neck seem different for round 1, 2, 4 and 5 than rounds 4 and 6.

The all case gauge fine. Am I being too anal here or do you think I should buy a neck sizer to put into my last station.

Edited August 16, 2010 by pjb45

[RiggerJJ]

Don't see any photos...

If they fit the JP guage, then they will chamber in the JP.

I assume you are using LC or WCC nato brass, if so, good. If you are using FC you will have a problem sooner or later with spitting prmers after firing. the little buggers will end up down in the trigger group and really make things come to a gringing halt. I will not use FC brass in an AR for that reason. Using range 223 brass is just asking for troubles! Sooner or later you will have case seperations, and spit primers...I can't emphisize this enough...

If you have trubs with the swager on the 1050, then it isn't adjusted correctly. once its correct, you should have little to no problems, again, using LC or WCC brass. The occasional failure to seat a primer or crushing a primer is more a problem with the primer not lining up with the primer pocket. throw em aside, soak em in WD40 to kill the primer, deprime them, and put em back in the mix. running the extra step on the Super Swager is a waste of time, espcially if you have a 1050 with the swager built in.

jj

[pjb45]

Thanks for the reply.

I had to readjust the picture to get it to load. It is there now.

I use various brass head stamps. Is that little fc or large FC brass that is a problem?

[RiggerJJ]

Any fc/FC. it "acts" like it is crimped primers, maybe it is maybe it isn't. but the primer pockets are always "soft" after the first firing for some reason. I have had many problems (and others have too on this forum) with 223 and 308 fc/FC brass, so when I get some, I give it to my bolt gun buddys, it works fine in bolt guns.

Using mixed range rifle brass is just asking for trubs IMHO, and you are seeing some of those trubs with the 1050's swager. sort out all the crap (generally anything but LC or WCC is crap) and your loading problems will dimminish to almost nill... be careful with firings more than 3x, you will experience case seperations more often. They will usually leave the neck and about 1/2 of the body of the case in the chamber and the extractor will pull out the primer end, making for chambering another round pretty much impossible. unless you get lucky and the next round that tries to chamber pulls out the seperated part of the case when you pull on the charging handle to clear the jam, your stage will end right there. Having it happen right after the 1st round really suks!!!

My opinion is; buy once fired LC, shoot it twice, and leave it = minimal problems.

jj

[pjb45]

New Updates:

Thanks for the advice on the fc brass. I have a bunch of it. Some was pretty reasonable and some the primers broke a Lee deprimer rod. Seems like the stuff with green around the primer was extremely hard to decap.

Summary,

I purchased the Dillon Electronic Trimmer. What a great piece of equipment. It took me some time to get it set up properly. I had to do several iterations to get it to the right trim length. I did purchase a small Shop Vac and found some hose in the pluming section that extended the hose length. This worked out great.

I had a Redding Full Length Sizing and Decapping Die. I did break the pin and had to buy a new one. I ended up buying a Lee Universal Decapping Die. When the directions say a fair amount of torque is needed, they were understating the amount of torque needed.

My setup on my 1050 now has the Lee Universal Decap die in Station 1, Redding Full sizer in 2, and the Dillon Trimmer in 4. The trimmer blasts through the trimmer process. It is well worth the money if you are doing large amounts of brass.

I think I did 5,000 pieces. After trimming I swaged every piece with the Dillon Super Swage.

One out of every couple hundred pieces do not easily drop out of my JP case gauge which I used after I swaged the brass.

In the future I might not go to all this trouble. It might be simpler to just buy processed brass from Scharch in the future. I am glad I did it but it sure is time consuming to clean, size, trim and swage brass. Of course with 5k, I might not need to do anything for quite a while.

My next step is going to clean the lube off and sort out the crap brass. I am really disappointed in the fc brass. The PMC was ok but still not great.

[freakshow10mm]

FC brass is junk and it wreaked havoc on my 1050 several months ago. Now I trash it.

[jmurch]

+1 on FC (fake city) being junk.

You can usually find once fired Lake City (LC) for $70 or thereabouts per 1k.

I stopped using the Dillon Super Swage. When I get once fired LC that needs swaging I use a primer pocket uniformer. I have found that for Rem 7 1/2s it makes for a tighter primer pocket that's good for 5 or 6 reloadings.

Edited August 29, 2010 by jmurch