GordonB Posted February 1, 2004 Share Posted February 1, 2004 I have a pre-ban shorty that I want to set-up for both social occasions and 3-gun. I currently have a standard A2 flash suppresor on the shorty. I was reading through all the compensator posts and rediscovered the EGW. Since I want to use this gun for social occasions I wanted the muzzle device to also suppress the flash in addition to lessening muzzle rise. Since the EGW is basically an A2 with a restricted end, does it also suppress the flash? How is the blast with the EGW? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted February 1, 2004 Share Posted February 1, 2004 Senor Tortuga: The EGW has a substatial flash, it also isn't that effective a brake. Any time the end is restricted you will get flash. The best brake for "flash" seems to be Ron Smiths brake. It is about the best for flash suppresion, if that is possible with a brake, and it isn't to bad as a compensator. Kind of an inbetween muzzle device. KURTM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonB Posted February 2, 2004 Author Share Posted February 2, 2004 Ron Smith? Is this the Smith Enterprises muzzle brake on the bottom of this link? http://dillonprecision.com/template/p.cfm?...67&min=0&dyn=1& Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted February 2, 2004 Share Posted February 2, 2004 Yep! Smith Enterprises. Sorry, I should have used his company name. KURTM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blkbrd Posted February 2, 2004 Share Posted February 2, 2004 You are talking about two different animals. A brake will increase flash and blast but reduce recoil allowing faster shooting while in a competition enviroment using ear protection, JP's Benny Hill model seems to be the best of the breed at reducing recoil at the expense of blast and flash. A true flashhider like the Vortex or A2 is your best bet for "social occasions" as it will have the least blast and flash. AR15.com has many reviews on the different flash suppressors. With a preban you can switch out between them to your hearts content, just watch your zero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonB Posted February 2, 2004 Author Share Posted February 2, 2004 Well the thing is I don't want to be switching around the muzzle device. It's just impractical in my view and I want to have the same feel/gun with for both social and play occasions (though in reality it is all likely to be just play). I took a class during the summer. During the night portion the participants shot-off rounds one by one. We each announced the ammo we were shooting and each shot off two rounds one-by-one down the line. The whole exercise was to show how the different ammo/guns flashed. Pretty cool IMHO. I was shooting Q3131A with an A2 FS. After I shot the instructor commented how little flash the Winchester had. Another shooter with an A2 produced no flash that I remember. What surprised me, was a guy shooting a 16" BM with an AK muzzle brake barely put out any flash. While a guy with a 20" with no muzzle device made huge fireball flashes. Also surprising was a guy shooting a Kaliban legal M1A (with the SA compensator) also barely put out a flash. I'm sure that the ammo selection played a huge part. But I came to the conclusion (rightly or wrongly) that 1) different compensators have different flash levels and 2) a compensator can hide the flash better than a bare-muzzle. I've read all sorts of posts saying the AK brakes/compensator put out a lot of blast. They may put out more noticeable blast, but from what I saw they have a minimal amount flash (with the right ammo). So in short... I don't think they are mutually exclusive. You can both reduce flash and jump with a compensator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbear38S Posted February 2, 2004 Share Posted February 2, 2004 A muzzle brake can effectively redirect flash so it's less in the view of the shooter but if flash is reduced at all from a bare barrel, the ATF deems it a flash supressor regardless of what the manufacturer calls it. Putting such a device on a post-ban rifle automatically makes that legal firearm an illegal assualt weapon. If a given brake is available in both post-ban and pre-ban configurations, it cannot, by law, reduce muzzle flash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear1142 Posted February 2, 2004 Share Posted February 2, 2004 GordonB, While it may look a little odd, you can accomplish some degree of flash suppression with some compensation/brake effect by trying an AK-74 style compensator. Not the one that Bushmaster makes. Check out Marc Kreb's of Krebs custom. He makes an authentic 74 style compensator and has an adaptor collar for installation on a standard thread AR. You can also check out the OPS inc, brakes. They are the new issue muzzle brake on the new military 6.8mm SPC AR's and SPR rifles and are reasonably effective at both flash suppression and compensation. Brownell's should have both models available. Erik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurtm Posted February 3, 2004 Share Posted February 3, 2004 BLKBRD: Just to clear something up. J.P.enterprises, make the Benny Cooley brake. Benny Hill makes his own design of brake, that happens to work quite well indeed, but doesn't look a thing like J.P.'s. The Cooley brake has a substantial muzzle flash. In general any brake with a flat surface for the gas to work on will give a big flash. Devices with round holes, like Benny Hill's and Ron Smith's tend to have less, but it is still more than say a vortec....which Ron Smith also happens to make! KURTM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blkbrd Posted February 4, 2004 Share Posted February 4, 2004 KurtM; you are very correct, this is what happens when I answer posts at 2:30AM. I have used both Benny Hills and Benny Cooley's and they are both great Brakes, its a matter of choice as to Brake for competition, or suppress flash for social reasons. IMHO I believe social rifles should have a flash hider or naked muzzle due to blast and the fact they will most likely be used at night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GordonB Posted February 4, 2004 Author Share Posted February 4, 2004 The OPS looks cool. And it is apparently certified ninja equipment. Only thing I don't like about it is that it is stainless (gotta black it out somehow) and the $. If anybody is interested, this the OPS during dusk: Picture 1 Picture 2 Picture 2 is similar to what the 16" with the BM AK brake put out. OPS Brake Full Auto M4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear1142 Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 (edited) GordonB, If you go to Robinson Arms (They make the M-96 Expeditionary Rifles) website and check out the Military section, they have video of FA M-96's with the Ops inc. brake doing 30 round mag dumps. They also show the small dispersion of the rounds on a mountain side about 100 yards away. Pretty impressive. Did I mention this is a 7.62x39 and not the little .223! www.robarm.com Erik [edit] I think this is the direct link to the page that Erik is talking about: http://www.robarm.com/rav02.htm Edited February 5, 2004 by Flexmoney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 GordanB, I have one of the EGW a2 style comps. They worked good on a 20" gun but sucked real bad on a 16" Overcomped is an understatement. The muzzle was pushed down about 6" or more. George tried everything with it to get it to work. Opened up the end, drilled extra holes etc. It just never was really good. The new style EGW race comp, the one by JerryM, and the Colt factory one all work well and not much flash. It was what was on our duty AR's until some NASA employee found a way to knock them off, then we had to take them all off. If you want it PM me with an address and I'll send it off to you. It is in my taking up space box now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear1142 Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Flex- Thanks, that's the link. Chriss- What did you mean by the NASA guy found a way to knock it off? Did he file a complaint? What happened? Erik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 The Colt comp is held on by 2 pins. Apparently one of our idiots decided that the comp needed to be removed to "properly" clean the gun. Our Rocket scientist took it off cleaned the gun and then put the comp back on, not very well apparently. The comp blew off at the range. They talked to Colt had the pins on all the rifles checked and then somehow it happened again. Do to the safety issue the order came down that all the comps had to be removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear1142 Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Chris, Sorry, I was a little slow and didn't pick up on the NASA reference. I kept thinking what the hell was a NASA guy doing in Pa. On another issue, I'm surprised the comps were only held on with the pins. I thought they would have tack welded them also. I guess anything Colt does shouldn't surprise me by now. Erik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriss Grube Posted February 6, 2004 Share Posted February 6, 2004 Erik, Yeah the system does leave a little to be desired. The Barrel has 2 indentations where they drill or machined the pin location. The comp slides on and the pins hold it in place. If you knock those pins out the comp slides right off. I would have expected a threaded barrel comp and the pin welded or soldered to make ATF happy but I guess that would cost a couple dollars to actually do things right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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