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Vince you have a way of giving advice that is huge without being complicated. Hard to describe, but it's pretty awesome.

Yeah I have the extended firing pin with the lighter firing pin spring...I'm through trying to make this gun reliable with the 11.5# spring. I do not want to be stuck with using only Federal primers (because they always seem to be hardest to get) and this past weekend, with the 11.5# spring, the gun light-striked about 6 times in 30 shots with Federal primers anyhow. Maybe my firing pin canal is dirty...regardless, I've wasted enough time and matches light striking with the 11.5# spring to know when I'm beat. If the Tanfoglio's can be more reliable with lighter springs/lighter DA pull, I'm going to buy one in the offseason...especially if the large frame (Stock 3) is available.

I'm shooting a CZ 85 with an upgraded hammer, sear, and lighter springs. I'm using a 13# hammer spring and getting a decent DA pull...but when I use an 11.5# hammer spring I get a GREAT DA pull. I do not have a tool that measures the weight of the trigger pull, but there's a big difference between the two hammer springs...problem is, with the 11.5# spring, I'm not getting reliable ignition at all. I've got a Tanfoglio Match that I've been very impressed with, so I'm thinking I'm gonna get a Stock 2 or 3 the next time they're in stock somewhere. Question I have is how light of a DA pull is possible with either one of these guns while still having reliable ignition and without having to send the gun away to a gunsmith? Something in the 5-6# range?

Oh okay...I was just going based off of the thread here where someone said they called EAA and the receptionist asked if she wanted to talk to EAA or IFG...plus the fact that they have the same address. Either way, if I can get a large framed Stock 3 in my hands, I'll be happy. I've not had issues with EAA before.

I think it's been determined that IFG and EAA are the same folks. There's a thread on this board about it... I'm real interested in a large framed 9mm...hope the price is good.

I installed a CGW hammer (kit 3) in my CZ 85 combat without having any experience working on guns at all. Most difficult part, as I recall, was getting the stock hammer separated from the stock hammer strut and connector (which have to be installed on the new hammer.) What I ended up doing, which worked well, was take a 2x6 and drill a hole partway into it...set the hammer assembly on the wood to where the pin that I was punching out was directly over the hole in the wood...to get the pin to move initially, I used a nail punch (a punch that at the tip is small enough to get to the pin being removed, but that gets wider the further you get away from the tip - much stronger than a regular punch)...once I had the pin moved as far as the nail punch allowed, I switched to a regular punch and popped it the rest of the way out...then all I had to do was collect the pin from the hole in the piece of wood. Installation of the pins on the new hammer assembly was much easier... Only other thing I had an issue with was that I was trying to put the sear in upside down - obviously it wouldn't go in properly, but it was so close that I believed for a while that I had to have it going the right way. Lesson learned was to take a pictures during disassembly that I could refer to during reassembly.

Is that a Match?

Yeah that's why I asked how his performances with the Glock compare to his performances before the Glock (rather than how he compares to the field shooting a non-Glock.)

So it sounds like his performances are as good with the open glock as they were with the 2011's he shot before the switch?

Wow I figured 9 major a polymer open gun would be hard go control...that didn't look so bad.

You're shooting 9 major?

Gene I followed your method tonight at practice and I'm pretty confident in it. Thank you very much for posting that.

I'm going to do the Matt Mink method this Thursday and on the weekend (practice Thursday, match Sunday)...in doing it around the house, it seems like it's smoothest for me because of the spurs on the hammer. I did it about 500 times tonight without even coming close to losing control of the hammer. Whether I can do that at the line given I just had an AD or not is to be seen. I will keep a weak hand finger in there as long as possible as extra insurance. The way I was doing it before I didn't really have a chance with the heavier hammer spring...it wasn't a carelessness issue, it was a technique that couldn't work with anything but the lightest hammer spring, and I just found that out on stage 1 of Sunday's match. Thank you for all of the replies/help.

That makes sense...it'd be a pain for there to be different rules for different guns.

And I have no idea why a bunch of make up application videos pop up after the video I posted...I don't have anything to do with those...

Unless someone tells me there's a problem with what they see in this video, this is how I'm going to make ready with the CZ going forward. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t60eKEtsSdo Allen wrench is in the wristband, pull the slide back to chamber a round, take the allen wrench out of the wristband, slide allen wrench through the skeletonized hammer, use my index and middle fingers as hooks around the allen wrench, pull back on the hammer and pull the trigger, gently lower the hammer, put allen wrench back in wristband...I can still get behind the hammer a little bit with the allen wrench in there, at least when the hammer is first released, so I might as well do that as an extra precaution...and I'll keep my left hand connected to my right for stability and just ride it up my right hand carefully to put the hammer all the way down. Doing this should remove any chance that the hammer might slip out of my fingers - the allen wrench would have to break or my fingers would have to get sawed off at the knuckles for that hammer to slip into free fall. The only risk here is that I don't ease the hammer down gently enough, but that risk is always going to be there. I tried the method of putting my thumb behind the hammer and rolling it out, but it doesn't work smoothly for me...

Is half a pound enough of an advantage to make it mandatory to be all the way down with the hammer?

Trigger pull force seems the same to me...might a few millimeters of pull shaved off. The "half cocked" position isn't anywhere near halfway cocked...more like 1/8th cocked.

I emailed/asked the DNROI about half cock with a CZ that doesn't have a mechanical decocker - asked if, since it's okay to have the decocker models at half cock (because that's considered "safe,") it is possible to allow the non-decocker CZ's to start at that same position...told him that it would pretty much eliminate the possibility of an accidental discharge. The reply I got was "I will bring this before the BOD to see if the exception could include handguns without a decocker, it will probably take a ruling or rule change, I will keep you posted." Might be good if anyone else who'd like to see CZ shooters able to start at the 'half' cock position to drop an email in to the DNROI as well...you can email him at dnroi@uspsa.org.

That probably will work fine (pinching front and back)...I just am not real comfortable (after this DQ) doing anything that lets the hammer drop to it's fully decocked position without having a firm hold on it. Here's what I plan to do going forward: - wear a wristband on my right (strong) hand and put an allen wrench in there that is strong enough to not bend or anything but small enough to fit through the skeletonized hammer when the hammer is in the fully decocked position - at the make ready command, rack the slide, left hand grabs the allen wrench out of the wrist band, slide allen wrench through the hammer, use the index and middle fingers of my left hand to 'hook' the allen wrench on both sides of the hammer, pull back slightly on the hammer and release trigger, then using the allen wrench and the 'hook' fingers ease the hammer down - experimenting with that last night, I was able to have a finger in between the hammer and firing pin until the hammer is 3/4 of the way down...I think I'll already have a firm hold on it using the allen wrench/finger hooks, but I might as well take the extra precaution of leaving a finger in there as long as possible - my left hand will be in constant contact with the right hand so that it is braced to where the lowering of the hammer is just an uncurling of the hook fingers I'll shoot a video of it if I get a chance tonight to run it by you guys... The above might take an extra 5 seconds, but I'd love to have lost 5 seconds of my life yesterday over being DQ'ed...

Yeah the guy over on czfirearms.us said the only safe way to let the hammer down is to use your thumb and roll it out of the way as the hammer falls. I played with that - I could see it working. Reality is, there's no fool proof way. Sliding a piece of metal through the hammer and easing it down using that seems to me to be the most fool proof. I may do it. I thought you were saying that dropping the hammer to 'half' cock is somehow allowing the hammer to move on its own...

How would the "hammer move on its own" starting from the position we're calling "half-cock?" Other option I came up with for dropping that hammer is putting something (like an allen wrench) through the hammer and easing it down with that...

Yeah that's exactly what my problem today was - I wasn't ready for that harder hammer fall from having put in the heavier spring. I'd decocked this gun 1,000's of times before today, but today was the first with the heavier hammer spring. Just practicing it here at the house I can tell it's riskier with the heavier spring even when I'm ready for it...I don't know that I'll be successful in decocking 1,000 times with the heavier spring. I emailed the DNROI to see if it's possible that, since a CZ with a mechanical decocker is allowed to be holstered at half cock, if a CZ without a mechanical decocker can be holstered in that way as well. And to be clear, when we're talking half cock on these CZ's, the hammer is nowhere near halfway from being fully decocked...

If the hammer is deemed safe at half cock on a decocker version of a CZ, why wouldn't it be deemed safe on a non-decocker version of a CZ?

Thanks Vince, I appreciate that. Never considered a DQ as a possibility despite you guys always saying "there are those that have and those that will..." I didn't stick around because I was standing there trying to figure out how to never have that happen again (had to get to my range to work it out) and it was going to burn a hole in me and I think once you get a DQ you should be done for the day (i.e., work out your issues and come back another day.) If I thought you guys needed me to help paste and paint I'd have stayed no doubt, but you had 8 guys so I thought I probably would be more of a distraction by sticking around than anything else. If that ever happens again I switch back to the Glock. I think I've got the technique figured out better. Question I have and the purpose of this thread was - are you CZ guys running 13# hammer springs with the extended firing pin/lightened firing pin spring...or am I inviting danger with this combination? (the extended firing pin/lightened firing pin spring came as a part of a kit from Cajun Gun Works with an 11.5# spring, not a 13# spring.)