Tanfogliofan

Nealio, No need to apologize at all, the mag problem gave me such frustration to a point to where I dug out some old CZ mags and glued shims on the the back and sides so I would have the same dimension as the large frames. Did they work? No. Just added to the frustration! Man did they look goofy! Yellow shim on the back and red on the sides. I got teased! lol I doodled fruitlessly for month's until I was clued in. Yong Lee, a local GM now shooting a Stock 2, was the one that explained it to me. Then reinforced by an aeronautical engineer who explained to me in a bunch of terms this jug headed carpenter didn't understand. I did get his point though. the angle you want the bullet to be is to be pointing exactly parallel with the line of the slide. Now remember the taper. If you were to draw a line right through a photo or drawing of the 9m bullet this is the line your paralleling with the line of the slide. Toeing in he lips will bring the front of the bullet down to this point. Like I said earlier, it's going to look as if the slide won't even engage the bullet but it does. It really drops the profile quite a bit. In doing this you'll look down below the first and second round and you'll notice the downward position tightens them up nicely. tapping in the given direction seems to spread the mag just a bit and strangely enough allows for the 17 round capacity. I didn't believe it even after I did it but all I know is no more nose dives. As low as they sit in the mag it's almost impossible because the front of the mag actually keeps it from going down. tomorrow evening I should have my camera cord from the wife, it's at her work, and share with everyone what it's supposed to look like. Nealio, we're cool! I feel your pain brother!

Franky D, That's usually the case of a double feed. I would just get the CZ followers and tune the lips. doing so will drop the position of the first round clearing the second round from the slide eliminating the possibility of a double feed. Once you see a pic of my mag I think it will make it quite clear. I didn't think the slide would even strip off the top round once I was done but it works great this way. Go figure. I'll figure out how to post one hopefully tonight.

I suggest loading you mag up completely and looking under the first round. If you have a substantial amount of space between the second and third round your going to want to tune the lips. Once again, it's just what worked for me. I explained my technic back just a bit. What do you have to lose? A bad magazine? I'd get that hammer. I really need to get some dang photos of my mags posted!

I understand that it's the taper and I believe i was clear. OK maybe not enough. I'm sure if I had the mathematical formula it would be easier for people to understand. As the bullet comes up through the taper the front end has to be a certain width as the back end has to be to keep the bullet at a particular position. If the tapered front end is too narrow of a dimension this will cause the nose of the bullet to rise higher than the aft end. If the tapered front end is too wide and out of balance with the back end this would cause the nose of the bullet to slope downward. It's just simple math! You look at all the different double stack magazines it all comes down the this simple formula. You alter the mag to meet this criteria and bingo! I'm sure if Beven was on this he'd be saying the same thing. Ask an engineer. I shoot with three of them. Try listening in on a conversation about trinomial equations. Yuck! Now lets get it straight. I'm simply sharing a process that worked for me. This isn't a personal attack on anyone. If a person is offended by ones data I suggest filling out a hurt feelings report and submitting it to Dad. I'm sure he'll have a tissue for that snot bubble. Gun makers design their guns to function with specific dimension ammo. The nato 9mm parabellum specific length is 1.169". This is the number most all gun makers design their guns to run on. When you stray too far from this number your bound to run into problems. This could be the reason why some peoples large frame mags don't work. One thing I've learned is to do your research before giving up an "I'll tell you!" Somebody get me a calculator! I guess my point is don't be so quick to shoot down what could possibly help you and others because of your own pour experience. You don't know me or my process. Being open minded allows one to learn even from the people you don't necessarily want to here from. Anyhow, it's just a magazine.

The process I use and the dimensions that i end up with could very well be completely different from what you've done to your magazine. What leads me to believe that this is I didn't want to narrow the mag body so much I just wanted the bullet come out of the magazine at the angle it's intended to. Narrowing the body could do more harm than good. As it tapers the contact of the bullet to bullet through this section should be gauged so they are making proper contact with one another leaving them sitting in the magazine at the same angle that it's dispensed at. I believe the reason for the problem of the feed is that the 9mm bullet is tapered and the aft end must be stacked wider than the front end. Finding that width as it come up into the taper should be the key. I guess I just got lucky finding this combination with all eight of my mags. Darn it! Oh yah! Bullet length- 1.169"

One more thing to add. I took the followers that were in the front spacer magazines and tossed them. I replaced them with CZ/small frame Tanfoglio followers. They are completely identical so whatever is cheapest. The magazines with the rear spacers already came with the smaller followers. The ones that came stock with the front spacers always got stuck after the last round due to the exposed spring. Plus they seemed to come up too high and the slide would start digging a groove in them.

I run the old and the new magazines in my stock 2. At first I had problems with the ones with spacers in the front. Then after running the ones with the spacers in the back for about 2000 round I started to have feed problems with them. At a match another shooter took a look at them and said "It's not the spacer. It's the lips!" He explained to me that if you tune the lips to hold the bullet at it's correct angle the bullet is suppose to be at when feeding you'll eliminate the problem. I went home and took out my ball peen hammer and started banging on it. tapping on the lips until the front of the lips were toed in just a bit more than the back dimension. This narrowed them quite a bit. I filled the mag to the brim and went to the range. At first I was worried that the slide wouldn't strip the bullet off because it seemed to be too low but it was just right. 300 rounds I put through the thing and no nose dives! This is with the one with the spacer in the front! I went through and did this to all my mags and I haven't had the problem ever since! I've even used it limited class during a match and didn't have one failure to feed! Thank you Yong Lee for that one! Now the key isn't to hit it from the side but from the top roughly 5 to 10 degrees off vertical from either side. This brings the lips down and in and like I said the front should be slightly narrower than the back dimension. The reason is because your dealing with a tapered bullet. Try it out on one of your crappy mags and see if it turns into your favorite mag. I think you'll be surprised. I sure was!

That's good news! I'll be doodling on it tonight to see what I can do. If the 1911 pin doesn't work I'll be ordering up a small frame shortly. I hope she starts singing for you.

Here is a source for you. You can get adapters to fit different mini optics. I'm getting one for my Dr. Optics site. http://www.rescomp.co.za/pRHT%20C-MORE%20STS%20MOUNT/RHT-C-More-STS-Mount.aspx

The dilema I'm running into is with the large frame 22lr package is none of the parts from the standard slides are interchangable. the geometry is completely different. The firing pin chamber has a stop built in it. I would have to mill off roughly 3/8 of an inch off the the thickest part of the pin from the pin side back. Still frustrated over the thing! Something just came to mind! Maybe a 1911 firing pin. Hmm?!

Your totally right about the 22LR being a separate beast. The parts for the thing are completely different from the parts in the standard pistols. None of the standard parts are interchangeable with it. Might be with the small frame but not with the large frame. The geometry of the whole thing is different. I am writing on another thread about the 22lr and the frustrations I'm experiencing. The hammer was just another theory I had for getting the thing to ignite the 22lr round. My production gun absolutely sings with the hammer I have on it now. It had a smooth 8lb 2oz double and a scary 2lb 3 oz single. I didn't like to shoot it like that because of fear of AD's. The take up on the trigger is a steady 1lb 8oz so if you do the math that doesn't leave much room on prepping the trigger for long shots so I set it back to 11lb double and a 3lb single. My goal is to get these dang 22lr rounds to ignite.

One thing I'm going to try is to file down the firing pin stop only where the hammer makes contact. One of the first things I noticed is how much of the firing pin is protruding from the face of the stop. It's just barely sticking out! If the slide is even just a hair back from where it needs to be the hammer doesn't even make contact! The extractor could cause this to happen with how it meets up with the barrel. when the slide chambers a round the extractor is disengaged by the barrel when they come together. When tuning the extractor I took it down quite a bit where it meets the barrel to where the extractor is still engaged yet leaves the hook flush to the barrel face. It's hard to explain to those who haven't seen how the two interact so hopefully tonight I can post some pics to aid in the explanation. Now the reason I say the firing pin stop is I believe the hammer has to have more follow through in order to transfer the momentum to the firing pin. I guess I can add material to the firing pin by welding a touch to the hammer end of the pin but this might change the temper of the steel and bugger that all up. plus I think I would be able to replace the FP stop easier. If this works out to help on the strike end of things I was going to also try to file the tip of the firing pin flat and then into a vertical line face. So instead of it looking like this- (.) it would look like this('). I hope this makes sense. This way it would make contact with the rim. You would want the FPB in place so the firing pin wouldn't rotate but I hate those things so I would modify that so it doesn't actually work. It would only serve the purpose of keeping it from rotating. Anyhow that's where I'm at with the thing. I won't give up until she's absolutely hopeless or singing like a bird. The accuracy thing will be dealt with later. For now I just want it to go bang every time.

I finally recieved my 22lr conversion kit and I have to say i was a bit disapointed. The slide, including the breach face, is aluminum and after fitting the thing I took it out to the range to try it out and I was mumbling adn grumbling- WTF?!! First of all, light strikes like I've never seen! I still have the factory hammer and spring in my stock 2 and that should be what they figure it should run on. Well it doesn't! Second of all, it shoots everywhere but where you point it! I set up a purch/rest so I could get the thing sited in. I sat there going click-click-click-bang! round after round. At 15 feet I was shooting a group of about six inches! It was like there wasn't anything holding the barrel in the same place. Not only that, The sites had absolutely no adjustment left for elevation. When I recieved it the rear site was turned all the way down and I get out to the range and the thing is shooting four inches high! Oh yah! At 15 feet! So do I take off a 1/16" off the rear site? I've never had to do that before. I used hollow points during my first test and they didn't feed worth a crap. I did cut in a new ramp when I got home to see if the thing would feed better. That worked out ok when i took it out yesterday after our local match but still needed some fine tuning. All in all, what a major let down! The reason I bought it in the first place is so I could have an inexpencive way of plactice and to use at the local plate match. Now it's going to set in a box on my shelf unless I can get it dialed. We'll see. I'll keep you posted.

I have a Tanfoglio stock 2 that I'm considering taking some weight off the trigger. The reason I want to do this is I want to be able to use a lighter trigger spring to lower the trigger pull weight. Another reason is I want to be able to use any primer that's available whether it be soft or hard primers. I'm just not sure if I will get the results that I want. I have an open gun that has a cylinder and slide light speed 2 hammer and it works on even the most finicky primers. If I was to take some mass out of my tanfoglio hammer would this help in my two goals I have above? I don't want to start butchering my hammer without getting some form of confirmation from some of you with this type of experience. I've noticed on Eric Graufal's Tanfoglio that he has the thumb part of the hammer cut off completely and I believe he did this to lower the mass of his hammer. I never spoke to him or his gunsmith to find out but I think I'm making a good assumption. Another reason is that i just got a 22lr conversion kit for the thing and even with the factory hammer and spring I'm getting nothing but light strikes.

I really wish EAA didn't have the exclusive rights to importing the Tanfoglio line! In Europe Tanfoglio has great customer service and go out of their way to please the customer. you can order "tuned" mags from their custom shop but here in the US we have to deal with a supplier that doesn't want to put forth the effort of even having compitant smith's to assist in bettering the product. Here we are left to figure it out for ourselves. Don't get me wrong, I love the Tanfo I have, just wish we had more tech support! The only tech support for us is this forum! Thank you Brian E!

I use to have a TZ-75 small frame Tanfo. 9mm that the mags had the same problem. I tried my mags from my SP01 Shadow and those ran great! magtech mags are also good. try them out and see if that takes care of the problem. Good luck!

I currently use CMJ Montana gold's and they work great! I wanted to get some inexpensive moly coated to use for practice rounds but I'm not sure if you can shoot them through a Polygonal rifled barrel. Does anyone use these in their Tanfo's? and if so did you have any problems with barrel coating? I used them for a short time in my CZ Shadow and after 50 rounds it would start key holing targets because the barrel would get so coated to where the rifling wasn't even noticable in the barrel. Now in defence of the Moly coated, at the time I had the 147gn moly coated and I noticed it didn't have much surface area against the rifling. Now the 130gn moly bullet has more surface to barrel area and would seem to work better but I never tried those out. So if you have any experience with them please clue me in because I can get a hell of a good deal on these bullets.

Yup! Large frame is what I'm running. It's suppose to be here sometime this week. I hope it's here before the plate match on Thursday but if not oh well. It will give me more time to fit the slide and frame together. I was wondering if lightening the slide would help it to function better? A friend of mine has a small frame conversion on his tz-75 and that thing just sings. He shoots IDPA and practices with the 22lr setup. He had the slide milled to take off a few onces and it just runs and runs.

Keep the posts coming Brother! I have my 22 conversion ordered and now just waiting fo it to arive. I'll be using it for steel plate matches throughout the fall and winter month's and it's good to work out the quircks early on. I even ordered another firing pin so I have one to modify. Many thanks! Sean.

There are two things that were my main focus when I did my trigger. once you get these points to the "feel you want, you have to get the timing back in check. Now that invalves having to tune just about every trigger component in the pistol including the firing pin block. A lot of people, including myself, tried out the Henning XL firing pin but if you want to stay production legal you have to stick with factory pin because the firing pin block has to be operational. I started by taking the catches down on the hammer to .018" and then repositioning the secondary catch down and back a bit. this is what's goin to give you that sweet single action. I don't recommend doing this because if you don't understand the mechanics of the gun you'll end up buying a bunch of new parts. plus these hammers are case hardened and the only way to get them to the hardness level you need is to strip the finish and temper it yourself. I have a torch and a rosebud setup do the tempering. The double action interupter is a crutial component because is determines the set and break of the double action. I took mine down quite a bit so the double action stroke would be shorter. It's about 1/4" shorter than stock. The rest is time consuming. I already have the numbers of what you have to mill off each part so it simplifies it for me tremendously. I know this will confuse more than it will help but if you want to do your own trigger you have to go through the trial and error part. I have a friend of mine that tried to do his own and ended up buying all new guts for the thing. When he received the parts it still didn't work because none of the new parts were something you just drop in. They too had to be fitted. Just something to keep in mind when tackling a project like this. Ant, I won't be able to make it this weekend to one of those matches. Major bummer! The Wife and I are doing some family bonding. Anyhow, good luck to all and shoot straight! Tanfogliofan.

If I remember right, I think Henning still has two in stock at his shop. Go check out his website. on there is a number you can call to get a hold of him and have it sent to you. http://www.henningshootsguns.com/ Here is the site. This page has his phone number on it. Good luck to you! It's a great gun! I love mine! There is nothing like having a limited gun to shoot production.

I finally got up the gumption to order one. I want to try it out on my Stock 2 and use it for a local plate shoot we do out in my neck of the woods. Thanks for some feedback!

Hello fello Tanfans! I am currently working on a trigger package that could replace your original trigger parts that change your double/single stock triggers into a competition ready trigger! I have a stock 2 and have successfully made a trigger system for that drops the double action down to eight pounds and the single to a consistant two pound trigger that feels like any 1911 single action! I had the chance to take the parts out of my gun and put them into a totally different Stock 2 to see if it would be consistant in other D action Tans and it worked great! I have written Henning and I have a friend of mine helping me out with the tooling to mass produce it. Hopefully you'll see the trigger package advertized on the henning site within the next six months. I just completed a trigger job for one of the local shooters Stock 2 out here in the great Northwest and he loves the system. I'll keep you updated as it comes into fruition. If anyone is interested in having this trigger work done please send me a PM and I can see what I can do for you. I have a local shop that will receive guns for me to work on and have them shipped back. My price is reasonable and I use all your factory parts. Skydiver, Thanks for your comments! I look forward to shooting plates with you this thursday! Tanfogliofan.

Now I've been shooting my Stock 2 for almost a full year with about 8000 rounds through the pipe and I just had my first nose dive this weekend. It happened to be the first time I used Hollow Points and I figured out that I loaded them way too short. someone in my squad had the same round setup and I was able to use some of his to see if that was the problem and bingo! His were set at 1.145 and mine were 1.114. Doesn't seem like much but it was enough to nose dive the bullet every time. Go with a longer bullet and the thing will run just fine. The gun is a quality piece and shouldn't be brushed off as being a paperweight. It might take you a while to find the right combo but when you do you'll be glad you went with the Witness Elite match. Super accurate and very easy to handle. The gun I used before in production class was a CZ SP01 Shadow straight out of Angus's custom shop. Another wonderful gun to shoot but has it's quirks of it's own. I wasn't able to run any type of blazer rounds through it at all. FTF like crazy! One of my first matches with it I used Blazer brass 124gn rounds and didn't make it through my first box of 50. I was fortunate enough to have some friends in my squad at the time that had extra ammo so I could shoot the rest of the match. Now this is with a fully blown custom gun with all the bells and whistles that was $1350 out the door! I guess my point is you'll find something wrong with anything you buy. It's just finding the solutions to the problems and continuing to push forward. We "Tanfoglio Fans" have done most of the footwork for you. Just be attentive to the info provided by these threads and make the best of it. I'm sure you'll be satisfied with the new Elite.

When you told me about what was going on with the slam fires at Bunyans I thought "I wonder if the sear is bouncing off the hammer when the slide is dropped?" This happened to a 1911 that I use to shoot plates with. I figured out that the spring that held the sear down on the hammer was too light. The thing was the hammer would stop on the secondary catch and not continue. The Tanfoglio trigger isn't like the 1911 trigger. It has a bit more of a trap for the sear where the Tanfo., doesn't so it's very possible that the trigger can continue past the secondary catch and strike the firing pin. Juat food for thought. I had a really bad match on Sunday when I saw you. I Chronoed at 124.8 PF and ended up shooting for no score. Totally bummed! Oh well! There's always next time. Have a good one Ant!