dauntedfuture
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Posts posted by dauntedfuture
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Loading data is not tough, use 60g data or use 69g data and work up. As far as accuracy is concerned; there are steel tip and non steel tip 62g fmj bullets. I have not found any of the steel tip, M855, C77 SS109 bullets to shoot well. I have tried some Armscorp 62g fmj and they shot like crap too.
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It will be fine. Marks will come out. Make sure you size enough and trim.
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I will be interested to see what happens. Years ago when the AR-10 platform was new and guys were messing with non .308 in the rifles there were issues. I don't think that we had adjustable gas blocks and have learned a lot in the last 20 years or so. I should still think that you are not going to be able to run it as fast as a bolt gun. I would be looking for extractor marks on the brass as well as flattened primer pockets. Good luck and let us know what happens. I should think that there will not be an issue with feeding but who knows.
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There is no advantage to attempting to seat a 69g closer to the lands. You should seat them deep enough so that they all sit nice and comfortable in the magazine with a few .001 to spare.
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Determining the ma load is easy; work up the powder until the bolt gets stickey and then back it down about .3-.5g or so. as far as an OCW test goes i tend to stick to .5g as its just easier to do. Regarding shooting 155s; these don't always shoot all that well in non-specially set up rifles. The Sierra 2155 and 2156 all have very short bearing surfaces, i cant comment on the Hornady amax bullets but i suspect the bearing surface is short too. These bullets generally do not jump very well and need to be seated close to the lands. They also need to be seated into the case enough to develop enough to hold onto the bullets, this is usually at a minimum 1/2 the bore diameter, more is usually a little better. In most factory guns you are going to have a hard time to accomplish both of these things. Rifles for Palma competition are set up to shoot these bullets and have a short throat and a tight bore.
Shooting and hitting 14" gongs is not a measure of accuracy, you need quantitative results on paper, not hit or miss.
What ever you end up doing, your max reliable range is going to be limited to the velocity that your 20" barrel develops and the point where the bullet transitions from super to sub sonic. in a 20" i suspect this will be 800M max, check a ballistics calculator to be sure.
I would not try too hard to get those 155 AMAX to shoot, if they dont shoot, then they dont shoot in that barrel, save your self some time, effort and barrel wear and try a 175 SMK. Sierra also makes a 150g SMK bullet that has the same profile as the 168g SMK up front but with a lower bc and it will take the jump.
Seat those 175 SMKs into the case, they take the jump fine, load with FGM primers and some H4895. They should shoot well.
This is not to say you cant get those 155 amax to shoot in a factory barrel, i did it in a 24" win M70 HV and did well with it at 1000K but i dam sure made sure they were going supersonic when they made it all the way down there.
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I suspect you need more powder. If you are making power factor then you might need a lighter spring or a slower appropriate powder. If you recall in many loading books there are warnings about using too fast of powder in plastic pistols, its safe, but they might not cycle,With this said, you might need a slower powder. I suspect that your chamber is on the tight side and this combined with a light load and marginally strong springs are giving you the trouble. I suspect the gun was set up to run 9mm major from the get go.
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I am 99% sure that you are not sizing your brass enough. Suspect, but dont know that you selected a different batch of brass for your 69g loads, possibly all one headstamp etc. AR chambers are all cut differently, even with a .223, .223 Wylde or a 5.56 chamber, if they use different reamers then the chambers are all going to be different. I suspect that the brass you selected for your 69g loads was all shot out of one gun with a bigger chamber and thats causing the issue. What is happening is that some of the brass you picked up has been shot in a smaller chamber then what you have and that brass gets sized enough and there are small to no issues, the other brass shot in a bigger chamber has issues.
You are going to need to screw your sizing die down a little more. Ideally you size and try a mix of 10 sticks of fired brass in a gauge or the chamber to make sure that everything is right. Even if you use a gauge; with a clean chamber and the muzzle in the air, insert a stick of brass in the chamber or with caution, a loaded round, tap on the back gently with a pencil etc. the round or stick of brass should drop right out and not stick at all.
When you chamber a slightly too-big stick or brass/ammo, the AR system will size it a little bit. It will usually fire and extract. It might fire and stick in the chamber and the extractor will tear the rim off. Big time extractor marks on brass can be an indicator of brass that needs more sizing. In a bolt gun you would feel this, in an auto, you will not.
In a perfect world you CAN NECK size brass for an AR that has only been fired in you rifle. There is no reason to do this but it CAN be done if you want to, i dont suggest it.
For the ultimate in case sizing accuracy use an RCBS case mic and size brass .002 under fired case size.
It is possible that a loaded round with a bullets that's way too long will prevent a round from chambering. This is highly unlikely unless you are shooting 80g+ bullets, most AR throats are very long. It would be hard for a magazine length loaded bullet of almost any kind to be seated too long. Most of the time the round will still chamber just fine and upon attempting to extract the loaded round, the bullet will stay lodged in the chamber.
Brass that has not been trimmed and is too long has the potential to crimp the bullet as the round is chambered. While not suggested and or recommended most chambers are cut that the brass at 1.760 still has plenty of room. Trimming is always recommended. If you trim your brass each time i would actually recommend setting up your trimmer so that you are trimming to 1.755-1.760 so that you are not cutting as much brass.
So in summary, keep trimming your brass each time, use a FL die and test size a few sticks of brass before you load a big batch of ammo.
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To date i know of no comps that have holes in the bottom. I would consider that something else it going on. You might think about and or consider other factors that are throwing your rifle forward. Do you have a Full Mass Operating System (FMOS) if you do then you might think about Light Weight (LW) components. Also consider an adjustable gas block. Its more likely that your bolt slamming forward is driving the run down then anything else. As far as safe goes, yes its safe but i would not do it. I don't think that a hole in the bottom will do much..
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You are going to have a hard time with most powders in .38. Most .38 charges you will be able to get two charges in the case. With .357 this will be much less of an issue as the case will runnith over. In .357 with something like H110, a charge will fill the case. If you want .38 bulky you are limited to trail boss or black powder. remember that the .38 is an old black powder loading.
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The biggest difference between these cartridges is how fast they will throw a super high BC 6.5mm bullet. The faster the bullet goes, the more powder it takes to get there and more powder = less barrel life. I can tell you from first hand experience that most 6.5x.284 LR single shot target rifles are built on short actions. I have a R700 and a RPA quadlock and had a MOs rifles(s) in 6.5x284 and all are short actions. If your reamer is throated on the long side you might not be able to extract a loaded round without removing the bolt. You can set up 6.5x284 so it feeds and functions in a short action. The 6.5CM or the 6.5x47 are both about the same in terms of performance, they both have close to the same capacity and barrel life. 6.5284 was the cartridge de jour for many years with NRA LR shooters, i have not been shooting much LR lately but I think its still the most popular ctg on the LR line other then .308.
If you want top of the line performance in a single shot LR rifle then go with the 6.5x.284. If you want to compromise, go with one of the other two. .260 rem (AKA 6.5-.308 or 6.5-06 are close in velocity but are not nearly as popular and would work too.
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The good news is that you don't need anything but new dies. It will help if you get another tool head and powder die. If you had been loading .308 and wanted to load .30-06 you could McGuyver some reloads for a .30-06 by just neck sizing .30-06 with a .308 FL or Neck die and use that .308 die to seat bullets. Its not suggested but is safe and would work.
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I am saying that if you take two bullets of the same weight and different BCs and shoot them both at the same velocity, the one with the lower BC will retain less velocity and therefore less energy. You would have to run a BC program to find out. At 100 there is not going to be much of a difference. Years ago there was some experimentation with high BC flat based bullets. the idea was they would shoot as well as a blat base with the BC of a boat tail bullet. they did not shoot well.
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I would give a COLT CSR 1516 5.56 COMPETITION SPORTING RIFLE TRY FOR 700.00 if I was getting into things. It looks like someone took a new carbine and is trying to make it look like the Colt CSR 1516. There are also lots of good options out there if you want to try and build yourself an upper for a little more then what you are already thinking of spending. If you were closer I would spin your parts together for a case of good beer!
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The pointy end of the bullet has some effects on the BC of the bullet. All things equal a more pointy bullet will have a higher BC. The shape of the base of the bullet has a great deal to do with BC as the boat tail on the bullet increases BC. So yes, there is a trade off between a flat base and BT bullet, the flat base bullet will generally shoot better and the BT bullet retains energy and velocity longer. In BR this comes into play more then almost any other discipline as you are looking for .010 improvements in group size or better.
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Yes, You need an extended picatinny rail set to your scope weight. You are looking for one that's 2-3" longer (forward direction) then the receiver. That will move the scope forward. You will also need new rings as low as you can go. Depending on your application a +10 or 20 MOA base would be a good idea too. There are many options out there. I still like the EGW bases and Leupold QRW lings.
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Loads for lead in general require less powder then a true jacketed bullet. Plated and coated bullets load more like lead then jacketed bullets. If you cant find 135g data for what you want to load then look at 125g and 147g loads, a 135 would be somewhere in the middle. If you start closer to the 147g load you will be on the less powder side.
I would not say that a load with a failure rate of 1 in 15 stovepipe "ran good." Stovepipes can be an indication of many things to include too little powder.
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Its not the point that makes the bullets bore accurate, it is the more uniform base of the bullet H 55 SP vs the H 55 FMJ. Pointed, tipped or HP bullets are all drawn in the reverse manner of a FMJ. As a result you get a consistent base on the bullet. The uniform base of the bullet provides an even surface for the gas to bear against as the bullet exists the muzzle and creates less disturbance.
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You can't use felt recoil as any kind of comparison between loads. Different powder and bullet combinations yield different recoil impulses. You are also asking yourself the wrong question .."Why is my ammo slower then federal...." What you should be asking is "Is the velocity that I am getting across my chronograph CLOSE to what the reputable loading book says it should be when I take into account the loss of velocity of a 14.5" barrel vs. the 24"-26" test barrel that was used.." If available consult .223/ 5.56 pistol load data.
You should also not search forums as the first and or final place to start when working on or up a load. You should always consult a loading book to check or verify a load. Imagine what would happen if someone fat fingered in 27g of RL10 vs RL 15 and you loaded it into a case.
What you can get from the forums is some subjective and objective information that you cant find in the books like...Lack of smoke with lead, mild perceived recoil, clean, dirty, will not cycle etc.
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I sort brass that has crimped in primers. When loading,if the primer goes in too easy I scrap it. I FL and trim all my .223 brass each time.
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You can work with all three bullets. You are going to find that the 52g bullets will start dropping like rocks past 200. they will shoot well. You will find that the trajectory of the 69 and 77s are going to be close-ish. You will need to run a ballistics program with the 69s and 77s to see at what velocities they are about the same. I think that you will find that you can comfortably run both bullets so that the 69 and 77 match up for drop. The 77s will buck the wind better.
CFE, benchmark and Varget are all close in burn rate and should work well for the 69 and 77s. use what's left on the 52g. You are going to have to pick one powder to start with and then match velocity with another powder to get the same drop.
I would load 24g with the BM, Varget, CFE and BLC2 with 69s and 77s after checking to make sure this is a safe charge. Load 5 rds each and crono them all. If safe adjust the powder charges up or down so that all the 77s are running at the same speed and your 69s are running at the same "adjusted for drop speeds. This assumes you pick your largest stock of powder and bullets to serve as the benchmark.
If it was ME....I would pick one bullet and powder that I want to use for my 200 yd plus ammo and buy more of those bullets and that powder. I would load up what ever I have is left with reasonable safe charges and reserve that ammo all for 200 yds and in, it (52g, X or Y bullet) loaded with which ever powder you don't use for the LR load will all shoot pretty close. I would also consider what powder I used in my LR .308 loads and see if that works first before trying something new.
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A Neck sizing die will come down to the shoulder and should not touch the shoulder. For what its worth most all NRA LR shooters that I know FL size their brass, do what you want. Try a test with FL vs NS brass and see what happens. When you do this make sure you run them onto a target and over a crono. About the only advantage of NS is that you can get away with not lubing the case and the cases don't grow as much.
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Ok, try 40-41g of H4895 in a LC case with a 168g SMK. If this does not work something is wrong with your rifle. Expectation management is key, you have a factory rifle with a factory barrel. Contrary to what many people read, post and claim, a factory Remington is a good 1-1.5 MOA barrel for a 10 shot group at 100 yds with good ammo. Occasionally wind will push shots together. Others will post a 4 shot group that measures .3 with a "flyer" that opens up the group to .75/1". I would bet that another 5 rounds would round that whole group out. Be happy with 1" and go and shoot. If you keep looking for a .25 MOA load you will wear your barrel out testing.
Other good options include 175 SMKs, 150 SMKs for bullets and varget and RL15 for powder. FL size, weight sort and trim your brass. Stay away from FGM brass. VLD bullets will not likely shoot as well in long throat guns.
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As I understand things with these carriers they are best suited to low power "gamer" loads. I too would like to hear from the experts that run these.
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AR fire control parts from most all of the MFGs are case hardened. If and when you start cutting through this your trigger pull will not last long. Years ago, in 1994-1995 when the AR-15 was first legal as a service rifle and we did away with the .30 rule, there were not match triggers for the AR. Many many people tired to recut the geometry of the triggers and polish them up. This worked for a few hundred rounds and then the triggers god mushey and started to fail. The set screw up through the grip hole helped a little. On other guns we drilled a hole in the bottom of the receiver and installed a set screw. Accuracy Speaks Derrik Martin, Frank White and some other AR pioneers started experimenting with triggers. They started milling off the interface portions of the hammer and trigger and welding on material that they could then machine. This worked and still works today. Soon there after many others got into the trigger game and the noted service rifle game changer, the Maliazzo-Krieger trigger. Soon there after Armalite made a copy, there was a lawsuit and they redesigned their triggers.
So now well armed with a history lesson in AR triggers DO NOT start attempting to modify the standard trigger by polishing or re-cutting it. I personally don't think that the set screw and light springs will give you what you want. I would save your money. I also shot a factory COLT trigger in NRA competition, 9.5 LBS and won many a matches with it, so it can be done.
Cheers.
Extractor marks on my cases
in Rifle/Shotgun
Posted
Regardless of what your or any case gauge says, you should be able to chamber and unload sized brass or loaded ammo without any issue at all. If its tough to close or you cant close the bolt you need to size the case more (provided you are not jamming bullets, you trim the cases and you don't have a big burr on the neck of the case) to the point where things work. Ejector marks on brass in a semi auto are usually an indication of needing more sizing provided you are attempting to shoot a moderate load.
44g of varget with a 168g is on the bot side for a gas gun especially if you are using MIL cases.