Duplicating commercial loads

[Chris54326]

In my Browning Hi-Power, I carry 9mm Federal 147 gr HST rounds.  I'd like to start casting 147 lead and load my own for practice so I'm practicing "Apples for Apples" with recoil and velocity.  I've got a chrony, so all I need is to find out what powder Federal uses.  Any suggestions as to how to do that?  Or any suggestions on a good powder to try?

[Steve RA]

First you should probably chronograph the factory loads you are using to give you a goal to work toward.  After you determine that you can look in loading manuals to find a load that will duplicate the factory load.  Then you'll need to see how that velocity works with your lead bullets.  Unless you are already equipped to cast bullets you might consider using something like coated "commercial" bullets.  Casting equipment is like reloading equipment, you can go low budget or high budget.

[Taroman]

The powder in factory loads is what is called a "non canister" powder. Blended batch by batch.

I did the same development in attempting to duplicate Federal AE 147s.

First step is to chronograph the load you are duplication.

Then pull a round down and weigh the charge. Can also study the powder for size, etc.

I got this:

147

AE FACTORY

4.5

931

960

952

29

13.59

 

A bit of experimentation got me this:

147

BE86

4.5

908

958

939

38

15.30

 

As close as I needed to get.

[MemphisMechanic]

It doesn't have to be the same weight bullet, it simply has to recoil the same. 147 JHPs for defensive use will use a slower burning powder than our competition stuff so they feel snappier.

 

Good news is, I've already done the legwork for you on this exact same scenario. I took a defensive shooting class a couple years ago and wanted to take ammo that feels just like the stuff I would shoot in defense of my life.

 

I promise you that if you load up some ammo in that top combination (115gr FMJ and WSF powder) you will not be able to tell the difference. I stagger-loaded a magazine with 147 HST and the 115gr reloads and my friends could not tell which was which when they fired them through a G34 and G19. Felt identical.

 

[Chris54326]

Wow, you guys are amazing.  Thanks for the info.  More helpful than any I've received on any other sites.! 

 

I've been casting for about 4 years now and have a good setup, so the casting part isn't the problem.   I've always preferred not to shoot jacketed because I have a bullet traphere on my range and save all my lead for bulk rendering.  Casting my own bullets  lets me shoot and capture lead I've had analyzed rather than whatever unknown lead is in a jacketed round.  I can buy bulk ammo fairly inexpensively on-line but the lead content is unknown, and then I have to render it separately and have it analyzed specifically.  It all gets too complicated to keep track of.

 

I've just not known the "process" of trying to duplicate a commercial load, and all this info is very helpful in the respect.

 

Thanks, guys, very much appreciated.

Edited June 15, 2017 by Chris54326

[Chris54326]

Federal just got back with me a few minutes ago.

 

Here is what they said:  "That info is proprietary. We suggest contacting Alliant Powder for advice on what to use".   I figured they wouldn't divulge their proprietary information, but was pleased they named a specific commercial powder company for advice.  Taroman's suggestion of BE86 may well be "right on".  I will go through with contacting them anyway.

 

Thanks for all the suggestions, guys.

[himurax13]

In my Browning Hi-Power, I carry 9mm Federal 147 gr HST rounds.  I'd like to start casting 147 lead and load my own for practice so I'm practicing "Apples for Apples" with recoil and velocity.  I've got a chrony, so all I need is to find out what powder Federal uses.  Any suggestions as to how to do that?  Or any suggestions on a good powder to try?

In my experience, lead always feels smoother and softer than FMJ/Plated rounds when loaded to similar velocity/Power factor. The only inconveninces was wiping off the bullet live and the smoke that comes from it.

However, as someone stated before, going with a slower burning powder will increase felt recoil.

Sent from my VS986 using Tapatalk

[Chris54326]

Okay, problem solved..............or averted, which ever! I ordered 500 115 gr FMJ bullets from RMR today. Not going to have to worry about this lead mess any more. Wasn't trying to start yet another journey into casting, lubing and sizing lead bullets................just wanted a hassle free practice round.   Thanks to the data from MemphisMechanic, I'll put these jacketed bullets over 5.65 gr WSF and be happy. (that is reported to duplicate my carry round in recoil) So all is well in my neighborhood.

[Chris54326]

I used Memphis Mechanic's recommended "duplicate" for my Federal HST 147 gr load.  I am very pleased with the results and the recoil difference was, indeed, non-detectable.

 

This target was shot at 21 feet, rapid fire........or at least rapid for me.  My buddy insisted the first shot was dead center..........I'll have to take his word.

 

 

Edited July 14, 2017 by Chris54326

[anachronism]

What's with the 115 gr bullet choice? I thought your goal was to duplicate the Federal 147 HST factory load, using cast bullets?

[mlmiller1]

He was wanting to duplicate recoil for practice.  Not load itself.  Found it is neither the bullet weight or bullet speed that makes it "recoil" like factory rounds