2009 Open/Production Nationals Popper Issues

[zhunter]

With all due respect, Larry is ONE person who thinks the rules regarding poppers are fine now. The majority on this thread disagree, fine, let Larry have his opinion, let it go. If enough people feel there is a problem, as a membership driven sport, we have the ability to get it changed.

Please, if you feel strongly, send an e-mail to your AD, but stop arguing with someone who is not going to buy into your line of thinking.

Actions speak louder than words

[RIIID]

I would guess that the number of popper failures since the inception of poppers in the shooting world is rather small compared to the number of poppers that have been hit and fallen. It just takes one popper at one major match to get an uproar going. The rules as written do work, it's in the shooters control as what to do, make the decision and live with it.

Rich

[COMATZD]

For as long as I have been in this sport there have been issues with poppers. I have read most of the stuff in this thread in many forms over the years.

In this instance there are a few things that spring to mind;

1. The RO's adjusted the popper for several minutes after Randi shot and before the next competitor. The only reason to adjust the popper is to correct a problem. Therefore they knew a problem existed. There should be a mechanism in the rules to deal with this. If the RO has no authority to stop the shooter when they see a popper is not working then do they have the power to stop the shooter if they see a paper target has blown down in the wind? If they have the authority for the latter then they need it for the former.

2. Poppers should be set so that a hit in the calibration zone by MINOR ammo will cause the popper to fall. If the shooter hits the calibration zone of the popper and it does not fall then chrono the ammo. If the ammo makes it then the popper is at fault, simple logic. You then adjust the popper, re-calibrate with the match calibration ammo and proceed.

I'm a bit new to this, but I've seen problems with poppers as well.

I like BritinUSA's proposal with the addition of requiring at least two hits for #2. These two suggestions would allows RO's to make a REF call if they can clearly determine proper hits and/or allow the shooter to more fairly decide to move on or not. If you can chrono a sample of the ammo used, then one could argue that two proper hits have certainly tested the calibration of the popper, as shot. This goes back to the fact that an RO can visually inspect the equipment to determine REF.

It seems more fair to test an ammo sample (which theoretically won't change) than to test the popper which has now been affected by at least two hits.

[Flexmoney]

Time out. (8 pages... )

I'm going to close this thread for a cooling off period.

Some of the posters are now going back and forth at each other. That's a no-no.

And, some are getting shooter and match specific. Granted a specific instance spurred this thread, but we need not beat that aspect into the ground. Brian's Forum isn't here for that.

Nik suggested...some pages back...that if you thought the rule ought to be changed, then we should have a (new) dedicated thread on that. That sounds like a good idea. BUT...don't just sound off that somebody else needs to do something. Do the freakin' work. Write the rule up and cover ALL of the bases.

- Mod Squad.