Fast method of setting case mouth belling? beginner question

[Windshadow]

.45 colt and I was wondering if anyone had a quick way to set mouth belling at powder drop (lead slugs)

case length for a case is a known why can there not be a chart telling you how to preset the powder drop die (and the crimp die I understand the amount for bullet seating depth is a touch variable due to bullet nose shape)

that way the amount of projection of the belling funnel could be preset with the calipers when setting up.

on my first set up of my new 550B the funnel was far too deep and the dase was expended against the die wall resulting in the rim being sheared off and the case and die had to be removed placed in a padded vise and the case driven out with a drift pin... (my fault as I thought the die would be pre set at some save starting value it took 2 more cases with to much belling to be resized (though not stuck) with out folding to reach the proper slight belling I have measured the exposed funnel and placed said measure in the die box for the next time I swap to this cartridge and in the future I will know to have the funnel well wound out when starting the die swapping but I wondered if there was such a chart and if not perhaps those of us on this list could supply the numbers for what they load the next time they change dies and have the funnel out of the machine?

Cheers

Windy

[XRe]

Buy some toolheads, so you only have to do this adjustment once!!!!

Ok, that said... With no powder in the measure, and no primers in the magazine, put cases in all four stations. Back the powder die out a good amount. Lower the handle so that the ram goes to the top. Now, screw down the powder die until you feel contact. This usually puts the expander portion of the funnel in contact with the case, so no bell, yet. Now, raise the handle a bit, and put another 1/2 turn or so on the powder die, and lower the handle all the way again, so that the powder die actually does something. This should start the expander into the case. Now, repeat those three steps as needed (raise handle slightly, turn down the powder die, lower handle) until the case just starts to be belled - probably use 1/4 turns on the die so you don't go too far. Now, put an unbelled case in station 2, lower the handle, raise the handle, and check the case for bell. Adjust as necessary.

This should at least keep you from ruining stuff Its pretty quick to do - quicker than it sounds...

[ChuckS]

Dave is right! never mind....

Edited August 7, 2009 by ChuckS

[Intel6]

Just to add to what Dave said already. The trick to setting the powder die is to watch the travel of the powder bar in the measure. The case will not start getting belled until the powder bar travels all the way to the end of its movement and stops. Until it does that the powder funnel (with the belling taper) is still getting pushed up by the case. When the powder bar reaches the end of it's travel it stop's the funnel from moving up any more and then the case gets pushed up further on the funnel and gets belled.

If you follow Dave's method above you can keep and eye on the powder bar and make large adjustments to the powder die until the powder bar starts reaching the end of it travel and then slow down and make smaller adjustments.

Neal in AZ

[XRe]

That's a good tip, Neal Learn something new every day...

[Intel6]

That's a good tip, Neal Learn something new every day...

Dave, I re-read your post to make sure you didn't mention that tidbit so I didn't look like an idito saying it again.

I have been using Dillons for 20+ years now so I have picked up a few things over the years.

NEal in AZ

[rvb]

A couple of things I'm not sure were pointed out above...

Be sure to set it up using a SIZED case. May be obvious, but it should be said...

I'm not sure where I got the info from, either from calling Dillon or read it here, but they recommend 0.015 to 0.020 of belling to ensure the powder measure gets solidly and repeatibly to the end of its motion. 0.017-0.018 has served me well, and I get very consistent powder drops.

I've done the same as Neal many times to set the bell up.

Also note that if you want to use the same caliber conversion for two calibers (such as 9mm and .38 super), Dillon will sell you just the powder funnel so you don't have to swap funnels between calibers or pay for two whole conversions. I think I ordered my funnel from Brian here where they are listed seperately, they aren't listed seperately on Dillon's site (wasted a lot of time moving funnels between tool heads before I figured that out).

-rvb

[Patch44]

Does anyone make a setup thingie that replaces the powder measure when setting bell mouth.

It would be way easier to set the powder funnel if you did not have to have the powder measure in place. I agree separate toolheads are the hot set up, but if you had a gauge you could place on the charging die/powder funnel that replicated the throw of the powder measure, it would make the whole process easier.

Just wondering ...

Just dusted off 10 year old 650 and getting to know it all over again ...

John

Edited August 7, 2009 by Patch44

[Windshadow]

Thanks for the tips after emptying another 150 to 200 factory Black hills .45 colt this weekend I will have 600 empties to fill next week and 200 of them are 45-70 or 45-90 so I will be doing a bit of die swapping. I can see why extra die plates get so many strong recommendations.

Cheers

Windy

[Jim M.]

XRe mentioned separate toolheads and, of course, that is the ideal set-up. I only have complete toolheads set up permanently for the three calibers I load most, and I swap the dies in and out of a fourth toolhead for the occasional loading of other calibers. To make that easier, buy an extra powder die for each caliber you want to load. As rvb mentioned, you can also buy extra powder funnels for each caliber, such as one for the 9mm and one for the .38 Super. I also did that. Combined with a powder die set for each caliber, you shouldn't have to adjust the case mouth belling when you switch calibers.

Keeping the same case mouth belling requires that you put a lock ring on the powder die (and other dies, if you don't have a separate tool head for each caliber) that holds the adjustment when the die is removed. That's one place where I use a product not made by Dillon. I use either Hornady lock rings where I have lots of room (I load mostly with a 1050), and RCBS lock rings where the dies have less room between them.

I don't know of any fixture for setting the case mouth belling. Just do it as the posters have described above then lock that adjustment, with a Dillon lock ring if you have dedicated tool heads or an RCBS lock ring if you swap dies in several calibers in and out of one toolhead. You only have to do that adjustment once. It stays put, even with die changes (at least for me, on the 1050. I can't say about your press.).

Jim