The Start

[scooterj]

If the RO is "really" paying attention to the shooter, as he or she should be, there is no need for a reply to "are you ready". I prefer not to use the random start option of the timer for this reason. I'll alter the amount of time between "standby" and when I press the statr button. I feel I have more control this way. Not trying to sound like a control freak,but the safety of all competitors and spectators is my main concern.

[Vince Pinto]

ScooterJ,

You're definitely not a control freak.

All ROs worth their salt use the "instant" function on their timer. This way, competitors can't anticipate the buzzer (and possibly "creep") by watching you run previous competitors.

The "delay" or "random" function is essentially for self-practice.

[BDH]

And BDH, fish don't count. 

Troy, don't know nuthin' about no fish! knowhutImean?

As far as timers on instant or delayed, of course, I always go with the instant option. I pay close attention to the shooter, and give the Are You Ready? command as soon as they assume the correct start position. Unless they state Not Ready, I go to Standby, and then I vary the count before tripping the timer so they can't out guess me. It seems that most of the shooters will either keep their hand on the gun, or have it moving between the start position and the gun, until they are ready. As soon as they settle down, we get to it....

My suggestion.... if you want to make sure the RO doesn't get going before you are truly ready, just keep your hand on your gun.....

[mcoliver]

Waitaminute? I think BDH posted that response above this. But I'm seeing my name as poster. Anybody have the same "problem"?

[Flexmoney]

All ROs worth their salt use the "instant" function on their timer. This way, competitors can't anticipate the buzzer (and possibly "creep") by watching you run previous competitors.

I can usually guess the "instant" most RO's are going to trip the buzzer.

I use the random delay...so competitors can't anticipate the buzzer.

[scooterj]

Guess away Flex. I've seen draw times doubled by shooters "jumping the gun".

Mash the button while they are on their way back to the ready position. All it takes is one "brain fart" to screw up a stage, and when it happens before the "beep", GUESS what the rest of the stage looks like!

[Flexmoney]

Guess away Flex.

I don't creep...or jump the buzzer. I just know when it is coming . I don't move on a "guess". I start on the signal.

Many RO's don't make a real effort to ensure the buzzer goes of...what is is...one to four seconds after "standby"(8.3.3).

This is easier to see during a Steel Challenge match. With five stages and five starts each...that is 25 starts per match. We often shoot thru twice, so that is 50 starts in a day. You tend to notice patterns. Some guys shoot with the same squad every match, with the same RO's. On some level, they get to know when the buzzer is going to go off.

Mash the button while they are on their way back to the ready position.

??? I hope you don't do this. Not only is it just plain wrong trying try to get the shooter...but, every shooter needs to start from the exact same "ready position".

[ErikW]

Flex, I've heard of shooters Grandbagging this way with their colluding buddy on the timer.

[scooterj]

Not saying that I'd do that in a match, but in practice, I'll do it to buddies to get them to "listen" for the beep before moving. It has taught a few of us to listen and be patient.

[Flexmoney]

Good points.

I have also seen where the RO will react to the shooter (likely on some sub-consious level), while using the "instant" function of the timer.

FYI...the Pact Mk-IV timers default (when you turn them on) to a random delay of 3.0 - 3.5 seconds. Of course, that can be changed with a few button presses.

[BDH]

I can usually guess the "instant" most RO's are going to trip the buzzer. 

I use the random delay...so competitors can't anticipate the buzzer. 

Maybe we should do a little test on this??

Also, I remember my RO L1 intstructor telling us that you always want the control of instant. That way if the competitor is in anyway moving, you have the ultimate control over him. In Bend, I watched at least 5 competitors gradually lean trying to anticipate the buzzer, only to fall out of the box when we didn't fire the timer as they expected. Of course, they turned around a little embarrassed, and then we just started again.

[Flexmoney]

BDH,

Notice I said "most". You and a few others would be the exception.

I'd be willing to do a suprise test (with random RO's). I'll bet I could get away with a few "quick" draws.

[Garfield]

I use direct mode on the button because I indeed want to have control over the beep. I sort of count in my head the delay after "standby" and try to "randomize" my starting-delay from shooter to shooter to avoid getting predicatable.

[Skywalker]

My .02:

If you use instant start option, a competitor creeping to the gun will never receive a start signal, but instead a well deserved procedural that will be evident and indisputable.

If you use delayed start option, in the same case above, the competitor will get a start signal, and you'll have to discuss a lot to explain him he deserved a procedural for creeping, and that, no, he moved before the start signal instead of "on" the start signal.

[BDH]

Notice I said "most".  You and a few others would be the exception.

Just pickin' on ya Flex!! Overall, I know what you are saying, and with the better shooters, they certainly are more perceptive to how the RO runs the timer. One thing that I've seen is RO's that visibly move the timer (sometimes a few inches ), as part of them starting to push the button. Watching that a few times almost always tells the better shooters that as soon as they see any movement, they know the buzzer is coming and they can go.

If you use instant start option, a competitor creeping to the gun will never receive a start signal, but instead a well deserved procedural that will be evident and indisputable.

Sky, I guess this depends on how you handle it. Like I said, in Bend this year, I watched several people lean until they fell out of the box. One way to deal with that would have been to hit the button while they were moving, and ding them with a Procedural (and you are correct, they earned it). However, we choose to let them fall out of the box, and then just started them over. It avoided us hitting them with a Procedural, and to tell the truth, it threw most of them off enough that they sort of penalized themselves anyway.

Of course the flip side is that I have also had my thumb already starting to press the button, the shooter starts for the gun (and is moving) when the timer goes beep. In that case, I had no choice other than to award them their Procedural.