Fullauto_Shooter Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 (edited) I recently shot a night match (Thanks Steve J for a great match) and discovered that my night-stand gun wasn't 100% reliable. I had previously fired about 500 rounds with no issues but it didn't stand up to shooting under match conditions. On the bright side, it's much better to find this out at a match than late at night when the chips are down. The pistol (Kimber TLE-RL) ran smoothly on 3 of 4 stages, but failed miserably on one stage. Traced the problem down to the little "extra" part that sticks up next to the disconnector on the frame - it was staying in the up position and causing the slide to jam. Talked with a few guys at the match and they called it a "lawyer part" - I don't know what the proper name is. I've taken the pistol apart, cleaned everything, and the problem still exists. I asked another knowledgable guy and he told me that there was a part that I could buy to replace the "lawyer part" and make the pistol more reliable. Has anyone else had this problem and what did you do to fix it? It's just disturbing that I trusted my life to this pistol only to find out that it isn't 100%. Any thoughts or suggestions are welcome!! ETA: Did some more web-searching and think these parts are called a "Schwartz Safety". BTW - Insomnia sucks!!!! Doug Edited January 5, 2009 by Fullauto_Shooter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DougCarden Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Doug, talk to your local guys and find a good 1911 smith...there are bunches in TX......Benny Hill and Mike Caylor along with Dave Dawson come to mind, and I dont mean to slight anyone else that I missed. Have someone you trust go through the gun and tell you what you need or dont need....and yes, it is a lawyer part put in there to make someone in an office "feel" safer........IMHO...of course...... DougC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmoney Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 On the Kimber, the parts for the Schwartz safety system can simply be removed. The rear sight has to be taken off first, but it's an easy job. I did it to my own Kimber. On the Colt/Para system, when the equivalent parts are removed, a spacer needs to be installed. That's probably what your friend was thinking of. I agree that these parts are unnecessary. Mike (your friendly neighborhood lawyer) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighVelocity Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Have you replaced the mainspring housing? Aftermarket mainspring housings sometimes need a little stoning where the ledge on the underside of the grip safety engages it. I have a TLE/RL II as my nightstand gun, too, with a TLR-1 weapon light on it. The "lawyer part" hasn't given me any trouble in the 4 pistol matches I've used it in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve J Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 (edited) On the Kimber, the parts for the Schwartz safety system can simply be removed. The rear sight has to be taken off first, but it's an easy job. I did it to my own Kimber. On the Colt/Para system, when the equivalent parts are removed, a spacer needs to be installed. That's probably what your friend was thinking of. I agree that these parts are unnecessary. Mike (your friendly neighborhood lawyer) If it can simply be removed on a Kimber, do that, but keep it to put back in if you ever want to sell/trade it. For anyone looking, here is a link to the shim that replaces the parts on a Colt. 1911 AUTO FRAME SLOT BLANK I always just removed the firing pin block plunger assembly from the slide, but replacing the frame parts with a highly polished "frame slot blank" should help the Series 80 trigger pull some. You still have to pull the plunger assembly from the slide, otherwise the firing pin remains locked. Edited January 5, 2009 by Steve J Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve J Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 and yes, it is a lawyer part put in there to make someone in an office "feel" safer........IMHO...of course...... DougC Asshats that think they know more than John Moses Browning. The man hasn't been born yet that does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike cyrwus Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 i doubt the swartz safety has caused the malf. just my guess. Have a good guy check it out before you just remove the safety and think its fixed. I have 50k+ on swartz trigggers, they are pretty reliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beretta Lover Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 I had the same thing happen to my custom as soon as I added my SA mainspring housing. I replaced the series II firing pin (which has a little collar on it) with a 1911 series 70 firing pin. Viola problem solved. The schawtz system has to lower (or raise) in order to allow the firing pin with the collar on it to get through the firing pin channel. Once the firing pin was replaced with a series 70 firing pin the problem went away. Completely. The Schawtz causing this problem is common enough to where it is really something of an issue. I would venture to guess it happens to guys with magwels more than others. It's like having a tooth ache. People don't know that it's a problem until they have one. Then it matters. I'm not a dentist, but I did have a Schwartz firing pin block problem until I used an $8 firing pin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike cyrwus Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 I had the same thing happen to my custom as soon as I added my SA mainspring housing.I replaced the series II firing pin (which has a little collar on it) with a 1911 series 70 firing pin. Viola problem solved. The schawtz system has to lower (or raise) in order to allow the firing pin with the collar on it to get through the firing pin channel. Once the firing pin was replaced with a series 70 firing pin the problem went away. Completely. The Schawtz causing this problem is common enough to where it is really something of an issue. I would venture to guess it happens to guys with magwels more than others. It's like having a tooth ache. People don't know that it's a problem until they have one. Then it matters. I'm not a dentist, but I did have a Schwartz firing pin block problem until I used an $8 firing pin. How do you figure a MSH contributed to a safety failure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighVelocity Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 I had the same thing happen to my custom as soon as I added my SA mainspring housing.I replaced the series II firing pin (which has a little collar on it) with a 1911 series 70 firing pin. Viola problem solved. The schawtz system has to lower (or raise) in order to allow the firing pin with the collar on it to get through the firing pin channel. Once the firing pin was replaced with a series 70 firing pin the problem went away. Completely. The Schawtz causing this problem is common enough to where it is really something of an issue. I would venture to guess it happens to guys with magwels more than others. It's like having a tooth ache. People don't know that it's a problem until they have one. Then it matters. I'm not a dentist, but I did have a Schwartz firing pin block problem until I used an $8 firing pin. How do you figure a MSH contributed to a safety failure? As I stated above, the grip safety/MSH relationship is critical. This is because the grip safety is what activates the firing pin safety. If the grip safety's range of motion is limited due to a replacement MSH, this can interfere with the function of the firing pin safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullauto_Shooter Posted January 6, 2009 Author Share Posted January 6, 2009 I had the same thing happen to my custom as soon as I added my SA mainspring housing.I replaced the series II firing pin (which has a little collar on it) with a 1911 series 70 firing pin. Viola problem solved. The schawtz system has to lower (or raise) in order to allow the firing pin with the collar on it to get through the firing pin channel. Once the firing pin was replaced with a series 70 firing pin the problem went away. Completely. The Schawtz causing this problem is common enough to where it is really something of an issue. I would venture to guess it happens to guys with magwels more than others. It's like having a tooth ache. People don't know that it's a problem until they have one. Then it matters. I'm not a dentist, but I did have a Schwartz firing pin block problem until I used an $8 firing pin. So a simple firing pin swap did the trick huh? I'll give it a shot and see if this fixes the issue. Thanks for the suggestion. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullauto_Shooter Posted January 6, 2009 Author Share Posted January 6, 2009 I removed the Schwartz safety and installed a 70 Series Firing Pin and the problem seems to be fixed. The slide moves freely now with no snags - still have to put some rounds through it to verify the fix, but it seems OK. Thanks for all the tips. Doug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve J Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 2:27 am? You're not kidding when you say you have insomnia, Doug. I hope your bedroom heater is 100% from here on out. I also hope we have 60+ temps for our last night match of the year in February. Keep your fingers crossed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullauto_Shooter Posted January 7, 2009 Author Share Posted January 7, 2009 (edited) 2:27 am? You're not kidding when you say you have insomnia, Doug. I hope your bedroom heater is 100% from here on out. I also hope we have 60+ temps for our last night match of the year in February. Keep your fingers crossed. Thanks Steve - and yep, it's almost 0300 and I'm still up. I've been getting by on 2 hours sleep a day for the past couple months and it sucks!! Still have to get to the range and try out my fix on the pistol, but I'm optomistic that it'll be fine. Looking forward to the FEB night match too. Slight thread drift, but what type of holster would you recommend for my Kimber / Light combo? I don't like incurring the 2 second per stage penalty for not starting from the draw. Doug Edited January 7, 2009 by Fullauto_Shooter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve J Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 2:27 am? You're not kidding when you say you have insomnia, Doug. I hope your bedroom heater is 100% from here on out. I also hope we have 60+ temps for our last night match of the year in February. Keep your fingers crossed. Thanks Steve - and yep, it's almost 0300 and I'm still up. I've been getting by on 2 hours sleep a day for the past couple months and it sucks!! Still have to get to the range and try out my fix on the pistol, but I'm optomistic that it'll be fine. Looking forward to the FEB night match too. Slight thread drift, but what type of holster would you recommend for my Kimber / Light combo? I don't like incurring the 2 second per stage penalty for not starting from the draw. Doug Blade-Tec makes nice Kydex holsters for guns with mounted lights. If they have one in stock, you're in luck. Their backorders take a while from what I hear. Fobus also makes some, but they're a rear draw with a strap. A less expensive option would be a big ol' one-size-fits-all nylon pouch holster. I've seen them, but I don't know who makes them. Don H and John K used them at one of last year's night matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmoney Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 Ordering direct from Bladetech can be frustrating, they can sometimes take forever. See if they have your holster in stock at www.shootersconnection.com first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike cyrwus Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 I had the same thing happen to my custom as soon as I added my SA mainspring housing.I replaced the series II firing pin (which has a little collar on it) with a 1911 series 70 firing pin. Viola problem solved. The schawtz system has to lower (or raise) in order to allow the firing pin with the collar on it to get through the firing pin channel. Once the firing pin was replaced with a series 70 firing pin the problem went away. Completely. The Schawtz causing this problem is common enough to where it is really something of an issue. I would venture to guess it happens to guys with magwels more than others. It's like having a tooth ache. People don't know that it's a problem until they have one. Then it matters. I'm not a dentist, but I did have a Schwartz firing pin block problem until I used an $8 firing pin. How do you figure a MSH contributed to a safety failure? As I stated above, the grip safety/MSH relationship is critical. This is because the grip safety is what activates the firing pin safety. If the grip safety's range of motion is limited due to a replacement MSH, this can interfere with the function of the firing pin safety. Well, right. But its a mis-fit msh and or grip safety that needs to be correctly fitted; and its not properly activating the safety; its not a problem with the safety. The msh/grip safety problem is manifested in the safety system. Shouldnt be a big deal to get up an runnning 100% with the safety; thats my point... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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