Guest qstick Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 Hello everyone, I was having lunch with a friend this afternoon and we were discussing my new addiction to IPSC and he suggested custom plugs. I called a few of the ear DR.'s in the area wondering about the NRR and I got a few varied responses. One place could make a set of custom plugs that are usually used by swimmers (?) andmade out of silicone and have a NRR of 27. Another could make a set of foam plugs that he thought were NRR 29, but he wasn't sure, etc... How much of a difference is there between NRR ratings of 27 and 29? If I decide to get the plugs, they will be used in conjuction with Peltor muffs that have a rating of 29. Any suggestions? I have a headache already from trying to figure out this NRR stuff As always, thanks for the help, Zach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimel Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 NRR is based on the Decibel scale which is a log scale. 3 dB is either double or half. Thus, 21 dB NRR is twice as loud (to the user) as 24 dB NRR. I believe that there was a pretty good discussion of this back on the old board. You might try a search although it is possible that thread didn't make it over in the conversion. I am not so sure custom plugs are worth the money unless they are the electronic variety and even then... But that is just me. I would just find a brand of the disposable foam plugs you like and go with those. Keep in mind that all foam plugs are NOT created equal. Different brands will work more or less better for different people...despite what the marketting folks tell you. I made it a habit to purchase a couple pair of the dispo plugs whenever I found a brand I hadn't tried before. Eventually I found a brand I really liked and bought a box of them. I have since abandoned plugs and gone to over the head ear muffs...although when around the open gun folks I tend to add a set of foam plugs under the muffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynn jones Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 hi kimel, i double plug with the custom ear plugs and pro ears but i shoot 38 super (say what?). if you shoot limited or don't RO 38supers. i would just use electronic muffs and wear a baseball hat. lynn jones Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 Custom plugs are some of the best money I ever spent. They're only $50 and they have the best noise reduction of anything I've ever tried. I've used every muff and plug there is - aside from the electronic custom ear plugs. A few benefits: - A *HUGE* increase in comfort. No more raw ear canals. I wore plugs professionally, and after a while of popping plugs in and out my ear canals literally bled. I cannot stand foam plugs for any length of time any more. - More convenient. No waiting for the foam plugs to expand and seal. - Vastly more durable than any other plug made. Mine are 2 years old and look new. I personally think e-muffs are a joke. As soon as I put on glasses, it was like having no hearing protection at all. The sound travels right up the bows. As far as the detractors go... I think not all audiologists and plug companies are created equal. I got my plugs through Emtech Labs via an audiologist in Vancouver, WA. He's not too hip on the gun thing, but he did a fantastic job making the impressions. They fit *perfectly*. If anybody in the area wants plugs, he is DA MAN. By the way, I think that custom plugs are the only ones that come remotely close to meeting the NRR most of the time for most people. They're literally totally incomparable to anything else I've used as far as cutting noise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest qstick Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 Kimel --thanks for the explanation...I was super-confused. Eric - thanks for the info...I am going to call Emtech in the morning and see if they have someone in my area that could do the fitting etc... thanks again, Zach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 qstick, One word of note. Make sure the audiologist *guarantees* his fitting. When my ear impressions were made, the world went silent. No sh*t. It was just like going deaf. The foam plugs to keep the molding agent from sticking to my eardrums were tamped *very* firmly against my eardrums. The molding agent was injected very firmly as well. It was rather unnerving to say the least. But , that is what should happen with a good fitting. I would totally avoid the "instant fit" plug makers that shove silly putty in your ears, wait for it to set and call that an earplug. I think that kind of junk is why so many people are down on custom plugs. The Emtech plugs are a three step process: impression, mold, then a final earplug. The results are worth the wait. Also, make sure you are very relaxed when you are allowing the molding agent to set up in your ears. Contorting your face will alter the shape of your ear canals, resulting in a poor fit. If the plugs don't fit perfectly when you get them, take them back. If they don't fit perfectly, you will be another unhappy customer. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skywalker Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 Just to add to EricW wise words: IMO, the most qualified people to fit custom earplugs to your ears are the professional hearing aids companies, such as Maico or Amplifon (I don't know Emtech, but it seems to be something worth). They are used to build custom hearing aids for deaf people, and they know pretty well how to fit a custom plug. I went to an Amplifon shop, told'em what I needed, and got the same three-step process described by EricW. One more word about hearing protection: plugs alone are not completely protecting your drums! Low frequencies can travel damn well through your skull bones below the ear, for this reason plugs are not totally protecting you. Remember to always double the protection with good earmuffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Moore Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 i too agree with double pluging while shooting. there's nothing more nerve racking than people behind you talking while you're trying to concentrate. double pluging allows you to hear the buzzer and any range commands. i've been doing this for a couple of years now and my stage concentration has risen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Sweeney Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 I've tried the cusotm plug route, and never got them to fit. My ear canals are narrow, and I build up wax fast. If I get them fitted with wax, they don't seal when my ears are clean. If fitted clean, when I have any wax buildup I can't get the plugs in with a mallet. The standard measure for plugs and muffs is to take the highest rated fo the two, then add 5 points to that rating. Example: muffs 22, plugs 27, total 32. Comfort is most important, and if you have to give up a couple of points for something you can wear all day, do it. But there are hundreds of plugs and muffs on the market, and you should be able to find a high-rated model that is comfortable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TONY BARONE Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 Kudos to eric w. EMTECH LAB makes quality plugs. They're the only way to go if you want good noise reduction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErikW Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 I've got custom plugs done at a gun show. They kinda hurt after a few hours. I'd like something better, but not as pricey as the in-ear electronic ones. How does one get Emtechs? Local franchisees? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted June 17, 2003 Share Posted June 17, 2003 Consult your Professional Audiologist. Or call Emtech for a referral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest qstick Posted June 18, 2003 Share Posted June 18, 2003 I called Emtech today to see if there was anyone close by that could do the fitting and I got the name of an audiologist about 20 minutes away. After work I had to run to the grocery store and passed right by the office, so I decided to stop in and see about making an appointment. The audiologist tells me that the last appointment of the day just cancelled, and if I was willing to wait about 10 minutes, he could take the impressions today. $65 and and a few minutes, and the molds are on the way to Emtech. When I called Emtech, they said to make sure you ask for the Earsavers HP...apparently there are two levels of Earsavers, and the HP's have the highest level of noise blockage. Thanks again for all your help, Zach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMSI Posted June 19, 2003 Share Posted June 19, 2003 I took a shooting course from Todd Jarrett this past weekend. He highly recommended using electronic muffs. He said based on his experience (considerable) that with plugs only sufficient sound enters from below and behind the ears to cause damage. Most muffs cover the problem area. Obviously, using plugs with muffs would provide the best protection, but hearing is diminished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Moore Posted June 19, 2003 Share Posted June 19, 2003 smsi. i use both custom plugs and muffs. when i'm not shooting and away from the action i can last all day without wearing muffs, they tend to hurt when worn for long times. when it's my turn to shoot on go the muffs, all i hear are the range commands, i don't hear the yahoo's in the back talking to one another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted June 19, 2003 Share Posted June 19, 2003 You know what, I don't want this to be interpreted as me saying TJ and others are full of it (but I'm sure I get the hell flamed out of me anyway for denouncing TJ), but my understanding from what I've read is that hearing loss through bone conduction is basically an urban legend. According to most maintream audiologists, you'd have to wear a full helmet to avoid sound transmission through bone conduction. Earmuffs won't do the trick. Well fitted earplugs provide equivalent protection to well-fitted earmuffs. The primary issue is not what kind of protection you are wearing, but whether it fits properly. For me, custom plugs were the solution. They fit well, seal well, and are comfortable so I will wear them. They seal so well, I feel that muffs are unnecessary. Your mileage may very. The gospel according to Aearo... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted August 27, 2003 Share Posted August 27, 2003 QStick, How did your plugs turn out? E Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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