CZ P-10 F and Shadow mag compatability

[ida9x19]

Hello, I've got a bunch of mags for my Shadow 1, and am considering getting a striker fired gun for fun and competition. Do anyone know if the CZ 75 magazines will fit in the P-10 F, and vice versa?

[broadside72]

Nope, neither way

 

[ida9x19]

Are they close so that it can be modified by adding another notch or something? I'm a bit puzzled why they didn't stick to one design, could it be the striker mechanism or some other technical constraint?

[Johnny_Chimpo]

18 minutes ago, ida9x19 said:

Do anyone know if the CZ 75 magazines will fit in the P-10 F, and vice versa?

 

They are not interchangeable at all, in either direction.

 

If you want a polymer CZ that takes 75 magazines, the P-07 and the SP-01 Phantom are your only two choices.

Edited January 13, 2023 by Johnny_Chimpo

[broadside72]

4 minutes ago, ida9x19 said:

Are they close so that it can be modified by adding another notch or something? I'm a bit puzzled why they didn't stick to one design, could it be the striker mechanism or some other technical constraint?

 

P10 mags are too wide for the frame of the 75 series. The 75's are too short in the P10F as far as I could tell. I have both guns and checked, could have saved a ton of $$ had they been interchangeable 

[GrumpyOne]

49 minutes ago, Johnny_Chimpo said:

 

They are not interchangeable at all, in either direction.

 

If you want a polymer CZ that takes 75 magazines, the P-07 and the SP-01 Phantom are your only two choices.

The CZ75 mags will rattle around in a P07, and may not lock in. The P07 magazine is a little wider that a 75 magazine. I've never tried to fire a 75 mag in my P07, but I have fit them. 

[Arcrunner]

13 minutes ago, GrumpyOne said:

The CZ75 mags will rattle around in a P07, and may not lock in. The P07 magazine is a little wider that a 75 magazine. I've never tried to fire a 75 mag in my P07, but I have fit them. 

And they can also over insert and bend the ejector... don't ask me how I know

[Johnny_Chimpo]

16 minutes ago, GrumpyOne said:

The CZ75 mags will rattle around in a P07, and may not lock in. The P07 magazine is a little wider that a 75 magazine. I've never tried to fire a 75 mag in my P07, but I have fit them. 

Every single one of my 75 mags (8 or 9) lock in, feed, and lock the slide open in both P-07s I've had.  They do rattle around a bit, but they work 100%

Edited January 13, 2023 by Johnny_Chimpo

[GrumpyOne]

3 minutes ago, Johnny_Chimpo said:

Every single one of my 75 mags lock in, feed, and lock the slide open in both P-07s I've had.  They do rattle around a bit, but they work 100%

If I recall correctly, I was able to pull my 75 mags out of the P07 without hitting the mag release. It may be that my mag release does not lock into the mag body as far as yours (on my P07). I did not have the mags loaded, nor did I close the slide. I kind of wiggled them back and forth and they pulled out.

[Johnny_Chimpo]

3 minutes ago, Arcrunner said:

And they can also over insert and bend the ejector... don't ask me how I know

 

It depends on the mag.  On the other hand the P-07 ejector is much stronger than the P-10's and it's stupid easy to change without tools, unlike the P-10's ejector which is integral to the rear insert.

[Johnny_Chimpo]

Just now, GrumpyOne said:

If I recall correctly, I was able to pull my 75 mags out of the P07 without hitting the mag release. It may be that my mag release does not lock into the mag body as far as yours (on my P07).

 

Very possibly since there are dimensional variations in everything that is mass produced.  I don't believe it's coincidence that the mag release location is the same between the 75 and the P-07/P-09.

[GrumpyOne]

I talked to CZ about the mags back when I bought the P07, and they said, no, they wouldn't work, as the 75 mags were smaller and could possibly pull out, so I verified. CZ P07 Duty

[Johnny_Chimpo]

3 hours ago, GrumpyOne said:

I talked to CZ about the mags back when I bought the P07, and they said, no, they wouldn't work, as the 75 mags were smaller and could possibly pull out, so I verified. CZ P07 Duty

 

The P-07 Duty had frame flexing issues.  I wonder if that contributed.  Both my P-07s are the 2nd gen with the replaceable backstraps and new plastic that eliminated the flexing.

[ida9x19]

Thanks for all the replies folks. I found this video which shows that the P-07 (and I assume also the P-09 and P-10) has a wider magazine: 

https://youtu.be/M0R4Ro3vdTQ&t=24m50s

 

He explains that the P09 is a true double stack, while the CZ 75 has a little bit more narrow stacking. Maybe it makes sense that they went with a full double stack on these new guns, since I've heard that makes for a more reliable magazine. Also they holds more rounds in a 140 mm. But sure it's a bummer to have to purchase a whole lot of new magazines.. Might opt for a P320 og Glock instead since I will have to a bunch of new magazines anyway.
 

Another thing I noticed: There are some videos on youtube of people trying to fit P226 mags in CZs. They won't fit quite, but almost.

[Johnny_Chimpo]

6 hours ago, ida9x19 said:

Thanks for all the replies folks. I found this video which shows that the P-07 (and I assume also the P-09 and P-10) has a wider magazine: 

https://youtu.be/M0R4Ro3vdTQ&t=24m50s

 

He explains that the P09 is a true double stack, while the CZ 75 has a little bit more narrow stacking. Maybe it makes sense that they went with a full double stack on these new guns, since I've heard that makes for a more reliable magazine. Also they holds more rounds in a 140 mm. But sure it's a bummer to have to purchase a whole lot of new magazines.. Might opt for a P320 og Glock instead since I will have to a bunch of new magazines anyway.
 

Another thing I noticed: There are some videos on youtube of people trying to fit P226 mags in CZs. They won't fit quite, but almost.

 

There is no such thing as a double stack magazine in which the rounds don't stagger from side to side.

 

The CZ 75 and P-07/P-09/P-10 magazines work exactly the same  The rounds are staggered (not directly side by side) all the way from the bottom to almost the top where the last 3 or so rounds line up in a single column.  The difference is meaningless since the P-07 magazine holds 15 rounds, exactly the same as the MecGar P-01 magazine. 

 

You're also wrong about a P-09 mag extended to 140 mm holding more ammo than a 75 magazine extended the same length.  They hold exactly the same number of rounds.  I didn't learn that from youtube.  I learned that from actually owning and competing with those very pistols for the better part of the last 15 years

 

The only difference in double stack magazines comes from how they feed into the chamber. 

 

Handgun magazines are almost universally double stack/single feed, where the staggered stack turns into a single stack near the top and the top cartridge always feeds from the center of the magazine.  Many AICS-pattern rifle detachable magazines work the same way.

 

Internal magazines of virtually all bolt action rifles, as well the detachable mags of many semi auto rifles (AR-15, AR-10, G3, FAL, AK-47, M-14 as examples), are double stack/double feed where the top round feeds from either side of the magazine.

 

Stop overthinking this.  I've seen you other posts theorizing about magazine feed reliability and you're wasting your time.  All this has been figured out by the engineers that design and develop these systems.

 

 

Edited January 14, 2023 by Johnny_Chimpo

[ida9x19]

1 hour ago, Johnny_Chimpo said:

There is no such thing as a double stack magazine in which the rounds don't stagger from side to side.

Yes, anyone thinking otherwise is a fool.

 

1 hour ago, Johnny_Chimpo said:

You're also wrong about a P-09 mag extended to 140 mm holding more ammo than a 75 magazine extended the same length.  They hold exactly the same number of rounds.  I didn't learn that from youtube.  I learned that from actually owning and competing with those very pistols for the better part of the last 15 years

Hmm.. With the P-09 magazine being wider, it should be able to hold the same number of rounds in a shorter length. Simple mathematics. Follower and basepad design may be some other factors. But thank you for your contribution and experience 

 

1 hour ago, Johnny_Chimpo said:

Internal magazines of virtually all bolt action rifles, as well the detachable mags of many semi auto rifles (AR-15, AR-10, G3, FAL, AK-47, M-14 as examples), are double stack/double feed where the top round feeds from either side of the magazine.

 

I hope none of the mentioned magazine double feed, that would be a bad design (pun intended). Staggered feed is better. 

 

1 hour ago, Johnny_Chimpo said:

Stop overthinking this.  I've seen you other posts theorizing about magazine feed reliability and you're wasting your time.  All this has been figured out by the engineers that design and develop these systems.

You don't have to pay attention to threads that don't interest you. I'm an engineer, and the topic interests me.

[Johnny_Chimpo]

1 hour ago, ida9x19 said:

Hmm.. With the P-09 magazine being wider, it should be able to hold the same number of rounds in a shorter length. Simple mathematics. Follower and basepad design may be some other factors. But thank you for your contribution and experience 

 

 

You can think whatever you want.  Your theories are irrelevant when facts prove otherwise.

 

As for the rest, you clearly didn't come here to learn.

 

Edited January 14, 2023 by Johnny_Chimpo

[GrumpyOne]

Yes, the P07 / P09 mag body is wider...but not by enough to allow it to accept anymore rounds than the 75 mags.

[GrumpyOne]

Attitude
Please be polite. Or if not polite, at least respectful.
No bickering. Regardless of the subject matter.
Antagonistic, offensive, or quarrelsome tones are not acceptable.
No trolling. No alternate accounts.

 

If I have to mention this to certain persons in this thread (again), there will be a forum timeout involved. 

[ida9x19]

2 hours ago, ida9x19 said:

Yes, anyone thinking otherwise is a fool.

Noted. The above is not my proudest comment, as being a fool has nothing to do with whether someone has knowledge of what a staggered magazine is or not, but rather with how one behaves (at least that is how I view it). But my comment should be seen in context as a response to what I felt was a demeaning demeanour from an experienced member to a new member. My emotions got the better of me. I'm indeed here to learn, otherwise I wouldn't take time to ask on a forum. And if I only wanted to shoot and not care for technical stuff I would be shooting a Glock! 

 

If anyone else are interested to discuss magazine types I'm always here.

Edited January 14, 2023 by ida9x19

[Dirty_J]

3 hours ago, GrumpyOne said:

Yes, the P07 / P09 mag body is wider...but not by enough to allow it to accept anymore rounds than the 75 mags.

This. Absolutely this. 

[Degnan]

If you are willing to look at other brands the IWI Masada takes cz75 mags.