Czechmate Recipes

[tacomandood]

Ok, just got back from testing. I only did tests for velocity to narrow down proper charge weights/PF, and I will be doing accuracy and grouping tests in the next week or two. I ended up loading 10 rounds of each charge weight to collect a little bit better data. So, 100 rounds fired in total. Results are as follows:

 

9mm Major Load Data

Firearm: CZ Czechmate (9mm)

Bullets: Rocky Mountain Reloading (RMR) Multi-Purpose Round (MPR)

Bullet Weight: 124 grain

Case: Mixed Headstamp Including Federal, Winchester, Aguila, Blazer

Primers: CCI No.500 Small Pistol Primers

C.O.A.L.: 1.165”(+/-0.005")

Winchester Autocomp	6.4grs	6.6grs	6.8grs	7.0grs	7.2grs
Power Factor	157	161	164.8	168.4	171.9
FPS	1272	1302	1329	1358	1386
Standard Dev.			14.8	12.2	9.6
High					1403
Low					1369

 

Hodgdon CFE Pistol	6.1grs	6.3grs	6.5grs	6.7grs	6.9grs
Power Factor	150	155.8	158	160.8	165.9
FPS	1212	1257	1273	1297	1338
Standard Dev.	23.8	18.1	30.3	7.8	8.1
High	1245	1284	1298	1311	1356
Low	1174	1231	1182	1289	1330

As noted above, bullets used were RMR's MPRs (basically jacketed hollow points) and all loaded at 1.165"(+/-0.005"). Also, I forgot to record data for Standard Deviation and High/Low velocities on the first few loads of WAC, but results were pretty consistent when I was running them through.

 

Non-statistical Observations:

As far as WAC, it seemed to be more consistent regarding FPS increases to charge weight. An average increase of 30FPS per 0.2grs made it easy to track how the loads were performing, Though I didn't collect SD and High/Low, the velocities were a bit more consistent than the CFE Pistol, especially in the lower range. 

Qualitatively, the WAC seemed more erratic on the recoil and felt noticeably louder through my ear muffs. This is my first time shooting an Open gun, and double plugging will absolutely be necessary if going with this powder. I'm relatively young at 22, so if this stuff was hurting my ears through muffs I'd rather not risk hearing loss long-term. I'll probably go with a 7.0grs charge weight, depending on accuracy, grouping, dirtiness, and my determination on felt recoil. The loads at 172PF definitely felt hot, and I wouldn't want to shoot that regularly if 168PF is consistent. Still, the dot tracked a little crazy between shots; however, this may be due to the fact that my first shots were with this powder and I may not have been gripping the gun as hard as I normally would when warmed up. I'll start testing with the CFE Pistol next time to see if felt recoil and dot tracking is actually affected by this.

 

For CFE Pistol, it seems I started a little bit low on the charge weight, but that was because I had fewer data points beforehand to start with and didn't want to run the risk of starting too high. I may make a few test loads at about 7.1-7.2grs of CFE Pistol to get closer to the 168-170PF that I'm looking for. While shooting, there were obvious issues with consistency of velocities until reaching the higher end of powder charges. I've noted this with Hodgdon powders in the past, and think it may have something to do with lower pressure and unburnt powder until you start reaching near-max loads. The unburnt powder was easily spotted on the fired cases, and I'm almost certain this is the cause of the higher SDs and variance. Though the 6.9grs charge was finally reaching Major PF, I want to see where 7.1+grs will sit before continuing with some accuracy testing.

Qualitatively, the CFE Pistol felt a lot better to shoot than the WAC. It didn't get much louder from 6.1grs to 6.9grs, and it definitely felt quieter (though this may be entirely subjective). Recoil was also a lot more up-and-down rather than the shaky dot movement I experienced from WAC. The dot seemed to snap back a bit faster to original point of aim instead of bouncing or moving side-to-side. Again, I will start with CFE Pistol next time to see if I'm the cause for this observation, and will continue to alternate starting powders as I move on to accuracy and recoil testing.

 

For both powders, obvious pressure signs began to show as the charges got higher. Though there was hardly any primer flattening, I did start to notice some slight cratering in the upper range of test charges. Nothing I'm particularly worried about, though. I did use some stepped/crimped cases, and they held up fine, but I don't plan on using them for anything other than practice ammo in the future, just in case (hehe puns). Let me know if you guys have any questions. I'll update back here when I do more testing!

[Nasus]

On 4/5/2019 at 9:20 AM, tacomandood said:

Ok so I spoke to a local gunsmith and did some research on my own for lengthening the chamber. Everyone here is saying to ream the barrel in order to allow for a longer load, but from what the gunsmith told me as well as what I've found, that will only allow the cartridge to sit deeper inside the chamber instead of actually solving the issue of the cartridge being too long from the bullet. Wouldn't it be better to throat the chamber of the barrel? This would allow a longer bullet to sit in the chamber, while not necessarily sacrificing the internal dimensions nor the headspace length. In this case, you're actually creating more room for the bullet rather than masking the issues by allowing the cartridge to sit in further. 

 

Anyone got input on this? It is just something as simple as semantics and terminology that has me confused here?

 

 

The last thing i would ever do to any pistol under any circumstance would be to ream a barrel chamber . The chamber in 9mm is perfect for all 9mm ammunition, in length and diameter, factory or your own load. All new pistols have a tight chamber on day one and most like the Czechmate need 500 - 1000 rounds to run them in. I find that 1.15 is the longest mine like as it prefers a conical to a round nose, the conical being pointed does not actually touch the barre inside. 

[Joeyxbat]

On 3/5/2019 at 10:45 PM, selecw said:

7.1 Autocomp with 124 Everglades JHP @ 1.165 (reamed barrel} 

This gives 171 PF

i prefer Autocomp as there is no powder spillage during reloading

 

Oh and Everglade bullets have a more round tip profile than PD or MG which will help your oal if your barrel isn’t reamed

I just bought a used czechmate and I'll be loading same bullets but Im gonna try the 115gr since i have some sitting around.  Have you tried their 115 gr yet, if so, how much powder should i start loading? Thanks

Edited May 2, 2019 by Joeyxbat
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[Steel_Guy]

On 3/5/2019 at 10:45 PM, selecw said:

7.1 Autocomp with 124 Everglades JHP @ 1.165 (reamed barrel} 

This gives 171 PF

i prefer Autocomp as there is no powder spillage during reloading

 

Oh and Everglade bullets have a more round tip profile than PD or MG which will help your oal if your barrel isn’t reamed

Can you tell me how much deep they reamed the barrel?

[Steel_Guy]

On 4/25/2019 at 11:55 PM, tacomandood said:

Ok, just got back from testing. I only did tests for velocity to narrow down proper charge weights/PF, and I will be doing accuracy and grouping tests in the next week or two. I ended up loading 10 rounds of each charge weight to collect a little bit better data. So, 100 rounds fired in total. Results are as follows:

 

9mm Major Load Data

Firearm: CZ Czechmate (9mm)

Bullets: Rocky Mountain Reloading (RMR) Multi-Purpose Round (MPR)

Bullet Weight: 124 grain

Case: Mixed Headstamp Including Federal, Winchester, Aguila, Blazer

Primers: CCI No.500 Small Pistol Primers

C.O.A.L.: 1.165”(+/-0.005")

Winchester Autocomp	6.4grs	6.6grs	6.8grs	7.0grs	7.2grs
Power Factor	157	161	164.8	168.4	171.9
FPS	1272	1302	1329	1358	1386
Standard Dev.			14.8	12.2	9.6
High					1403
Low					1369

 

Hodgdon CFE Pistol	6.1grs	6.3grs	6.5grs	6.7grs	6.9grs
Power Factor	150	155.8	158	160.8	165.9
FPS	1212	1257	1273	1297	1338
Standard Dev.	23.8	18.1	30.3	7.8	8.1
High	1245	1284	1298	1311	1356
Low	1174	1231	1182	1289	1330

As noted above, bullets used were RMR's MPRs (basically jacketed hollow points) and all loaded at 1.165"(+/-0.005"). Also, I forgot to record data for Standard Deviation and High/Low velocities on the first few loads of WAC, but results were pretty consistent when I was running them through.

 

Non-statistical Observations:

As far as WAC, it seemed to be more consistent regarding FPS increases to charge weight. An average increase of 30FPS per 0.2grs made it easy to track how the loads were performing, Though I didn't collect SD and High/Low, the velocities were a bit more consistent than the CFE Pistol, especially in the lower range. 

Qualitatively, the WAC seemed more erratic on the recoil and felt noticeably louder through my ear muffs. This is my first time shooting an Open gun, and double plugging will absolutely be necessary if going with this powder. I'm relatively young at 22, so if this stuff was hurting my ears through muffs I'd rather not risk hearing loss long-term. I'll probably go with a 7.0grs charge weight, depending on accuracy, grouping, dirtiness, and my determination on felt recoil. The loads at 172PF definitely felt hot, and I wouldn't want to shoot that regularly if 168PF is consistent. Still, the dot tracked a little crazy between shots; however, this may be due to the fact that my first shots were with this powder and I may not have been gripping the gun as hard as I normally would when warmed up. I'll start testing with the CFE Pistol next time to see if felt recoil and dot tracking is actually affected by this.

 

For CFE Pistol, it seems I started a little bit low on the charge weight, but that was because I had fewer data points beforehand to start with and didn't want to run the risk of starting too high. I may make a few test loads at about 7.1-7.2grs of CFE Pistol to get closer to the 168-170PF that I'm looking for. While shooting, there were obvious issues with consistency of velocities until reaching the higher end of powder charges. I've noted this with Hodgdon powders in the past, and think it may have something to do with lower pressure and unburnt powder until you start reaching near-max loads. The unburnt powder was easily spotted on the fired cases, and I'm almost certain this is the cause of the higher SDs and variance. Though the 6.9grs charge was finally reaching Major PF, I want to see where 7.1+grs will sit before continuing with some accuracy testing.

Qualitatively, the CFE Pistol felt a lot better to shoot than the WAC. It didn't get much louder from 6.1grs to 6.9grs, and it definitely felt quieter (though this may be entirely subjective). Recoil was also a lot more up-and-down rather than the shaky dot movement I experienced from WAC. The dot seemed to snap back a bit faster to original point of aim instead of bouncing or moving side-to-side. Again, I will start with CFE Pistol next time to see if I'm the cause for this observation, and will continue to alternate starting powders as I move on to accuracy and recoil testing.

 

For both powders, obvious pressure signs began to show as the charges got higher. Though there was hardly any primer flattening, I did start to notice some slight cratering in the upper range of test charges. Nothing I'm particularly worried about, though. I did use some stepped/crimped cases, and they held up fine, but I don't plan on using them for anything other than practice ammo in the future, just in case (hehe puns). Let me know if you guys have any questions. I'll update back here when I do more testing!

I'm assuming that your barrel was reamed 0.050" deeper becasue I can only get to 1.110 COAL.

[regor]

Here are my results from testing with HS6 and Precision Deltas. I had to ream my barrels quite a bit to accept a these long load with PD JHPs. 

 

 

I liked the 115s better and ended up shortening to ~1.155 to get them to feed reliably, but haven't chronographed that load yet.