6.5 Creedmoor

[freedoms]

Anyone have the part number's to order Dies Set &  Casefeed Plate for 650XL  6.5 Creedmoor.

Thanks 

[valerko]

i'm no expert , but if you want decent accuracy out of 6.5 , loading on progressive might not be best idea. I use trickler for dispensing and still get variations.

Just my 2 cents 

[TRG65]

use the 308/30-06 conversion, 21094 is the number on mine

 

If you are loading precision rifle, I highly recommend the Whidden floating tool head.  I would also recommend Whidden bushing dies as well.

[usmc1974]

On 2/27/2020 at 8:26 PM, valerko said:

i'm no expert , but if you want decent accuracy out of 6.5 , loading on progressive might not be best idea. I use trickler for dispensing and still get variations.

Just my 2 cents 

If you want accuracy,  like hitting a 10 or 12 inch target at say 1000 yards. Valerko is absolutely correct. Just a thought.

[TonytheTiger]

David Tubb has been loading on a Dillon for years. 

[NateTSU]

The 65guys have some really good videos and articles on making precision rifle rounds on a progressive. If someone is on the fence about it I would highly suggest checking them out. 

[usmc1974]

2 hours ago, TonytheTiger said:

David Tubb has been loading on a Dillon for years. 

Yes, he does, but I'm pretty sure it's a Dillon 550. Besides that, he's David Tubb.

[K-Texas]

On 2/29/2020 at 7:09 PM, TonytheTiger said:

David Tubb has been loading on a Dillon for years. 

 

I've seen that point made several times in recent years, so I simply wonder what equipment he used when he began setting records a good many years ago. Back then, about the only aspect of his handloading that got any mention were the bullets he used. And if you win enough competitions, endorsement deals tend to come your way.

 

Mechanically speaking, there is an advantage in eliminating as much flexing as possible whether it be the press linkage, toolhead or shellplate. As long as I can remember, and probably before, REDDING has used a feature on their single-stage and turret presses known as Top-Dead-Center. A steel horizontal pin that runs through the press which the steel linkage arms contact and stop exactly at the same point every time.

 

LEE did something similar when they introduced their Classic presses, and I do load 5.56mm NATO on a Classic Turret with minimal variations in OACL. But the powder measure is an RCBS Uniflow that will repeatedly drop exactly 25.0 grs. of TAC every time. The Top-Dead-Center addition to the Classic presses, although different from REDDINGs, is also steel-on-steel. I do not use any competition die sets or micrometer seating stems for any rifle cartridge. When you set your dies up properly, any flex of the moving parts has been eliminated.

 

You could say that Dillon presses have the same, or a similar feature, but they are nubs on either side of the press and part of the frame casting. That's not to say that flexing can't be overcome, but it typically means custom parts as tolerances are a bit looser.

Edited March 3, 2020 by K-Texas

[TonytheTiger]

3 hours ago, K-Texas said:

 

I've seen that point made several times in recent years, so I simply wonder what equipment he used when he began setting records a good many years ago. Back then, about the only aspect of his handloading that got any mention were the bullets he used. And if you win enough competitions, endorsement deals tend to come your way.

 

Mechanically speaking, there is an advantage in eliminating as much flexing as possible whether it be the press linkage, toolhead or shellplate. As long as I can remember, and probably before, REDDING has used a feature on their single-stage and turret presses known as Top-Dead-Center. A steel horizontal pin that runs through the press which the steel linkage arms contact and stop exactly at the same point every time.

 

LEE did something similar when they introduced their Classic presses, and I do load 5.56mm NATO on a Classic Turret with minimal variations in OACL. But the powder measure is an RCBS Uniflow that will repeatedly drop exactly 25.0 grs. of TAC every time. The Top-Dead-Center addition to the Classic presses, although different from REDDINGs, is also steel-on-steel. I do not use any competition die sets or micrometer seating stems for any rifle cartridge. When you set your dies up properly, any flex of the moving parts has been eliminated.

 

You could say that Dillon presses have the same, or a similar feature, but they are nubs on either side of the press and part of the frame casting. That's not to say that flexing can't be overcome, but it typically means custom parts as tolerances are a bit looser.

All valid points. I'm currently getting consistent sub .6 moa ammo with ES inside of 35fps across 15 rounds on my 550, and thats all the precision I require. If a guy needs better than that a progressive probably isn't the way to go.

[K-Texas]

4 hours ago, TonytheTiger said:

All valid points. I'm currently getting consistent sub .6 moa ammo with ES inside of 35fps across 15 rounds on my 550, and thats all the precision I require. If a guy needs better than that a progressive probably isn't the way to go.

 

Always good to speak with an open mind. The load I spoke of earlier in 5.56mm NATO was first inspired and presented to spec-ops by none other than Chris Kyle. But in testing the SIERRA 77 gr. Open Tip March bullet w/cannelure, it came apart in water jugs at 50 yards. That load was spec'd 2700 FPS at the muzzle for reliable tumbling out to 300 yards, and was a game changer considering why we went to the 5.56mm in the first place. The Hornady 75 gr. version that they use for the Tap II and their NATO Match load is really good, and any difference in accuracy between the 2 is moot, Even to the point of 1/2 MOA for 10 rounds at 100 yards from a Colt's Competition 16" model before the last bankruptcy forced them to shut down their partner, Bold Ideas in Breckenridge TX. They came with a guarantee of sub MOA at 100 yards for 3 rounds. 25.0 grs, of TAC is .8 grs. below the Max Charge and will get you 2750 FPS from a 16" barrel.

 

For match or hunting loads with a bolt rifle, things are a bit different. I'm not in to any sporter that won't shoot the kind of groups you mentioned. But being honest, I have not yet bought the Precision Rifle I want in 6.5 CM. And as crazy as this might sound, I've already bought an 8# jug of the powder I plan to use, and I've been keeping up and giving due diligence. The powder that has impressed me most, even though H-4350 got so popular as to be unobtanium, and with RL17 being a very worthy alternate, RL16, might defy Alliants' numbering sequence because in actual handloads, charges tend to be higher. And for those who may not know, Alliant imports it from Bofor's in Sweden, while they make Norma Powders. So I bought 8# of Norma URP, which is kind of the premium grade, as is the case for RL15/N203B and RL22/MRP.

 

But, for the finale, there's no way I won't make those 6.5 CM loads except in Single-Stage mode. And even progressives can be used that way. I just believe that the more mechanical movement that is introduced, the more it must be accounted for.

 

[TRG65]

I use a Dillon 650 with whidden or Redding bushing dies in whidden floating case heads.  I don’t use the Dillon powder dropper.  My ES is usually around 20 and the SD 6-8. 3 shot group set usually average in the upper .3 or low .4 and 5 shot groups a tenth bigger. This is on multiple rifles and loads, and when the rifle still has a new barrel or at least hasn’t started deteriorating noticeably.  I do get variation in my bump and seating depth. If I’d use a single stage, it would probably be less, but I did try on the RCBS JR that I was given for free, it gives bump and seating variations too. I’ll admit it isn’t the most solid single stage.  I also use the expander in the seating die and don’t expand as a separate step.  But my ammo isn’t holding me back from doing better at PRS matches, it is the fact that I don’t shoot live rounds for practice at distance. I do a little dry fire and shoot local matches, but I’ve can’t look around and “feel” what the right wind call is going to be that comes from lots of rounds being shot in practice at distances where the wind is a factor. 

[usmc1974]

I think Progressive press, might be okay if you use the right powder. Because I've started using accurate 2520 from my 6.5 Grendel and it meters like a dream. I mean like, nine times out of 10 it will drop exactly 28 grains, and the tenth time maybe 28.1 so I guess you can get good accuracy out of a progressive press. Just saying.