STI 2011 Failure to Extract issue.

[Maxximuss]

I have a STI Tactical 2011 5" in 9mm. It has run like a champ since I bought it. It is my duty weapon and I use it for steel/multigun matches. The gun has about 3k rounds through it. It began double feeding a couple hundred rounds ago (about one week). This double feed is where the fired brass will get partially extracted (about 1/2 cm) out of the barrel and the next round in the mag will push up against the un-extracted brass (pushing up against it more than driving it in). This happens with MBX and STI mags. This happened with a 9lbs and 11lbs recoil spring. In the beginning it would do this malfunction about every 50 rounds or so. Now it does it about every fifth round or more. This happens with factory new and reloaded ammo. I replaced the extractor with a Brazos tuned extractor and the problem still occurs. Help! Attached are some pictures of what the malfunction looks like.

[lee blackman]

What you have is not a " double feed." What you have is a failure to extract... Failure to extract that happened out of nowhere, didn't happen out of nowhere. It happened because of a loss of extractor tension, and about the right round count, 3000 you said. Thats part of running a 1911 type firearm...

9mm is kinda sensitive about extractor tension to begin with. There are a ton of articles online about extractors. I recommend getting a weigand gauge, test the tension, and add tension. Check tension about every couple thousand rounds, if a duty sidearm make that everytime you clean the gun. The extractor is the one weak point of the 1911 design. Its not something you have to replace every couple thousand round, it just needs to be maintained. Maybe look at replacing after 25 or 30 thousand, just for preventative maintenance.

Personally I recommend EGW extractors. I use Benny Hill at Triangle Shooting Sports, because he does a good job, has fast turn around, and is relatively inexpensive.

Here's a nice article:

http://modernserviceweapons.com/?p=131

[45 Raven]

I own an STI Tactical 2011 in 9mm and had similar issues when I first purchased the gun NIB. Consultation with STI resulted in them sending me a new STI extractor. Since installation of that extractor, I've not had that issue, but have had a couple of failures to feed over around 2000 rounds downrange. I also had the hammer start to follow at about 800 rounds (no work had been done on the trigger as purchased), but that is another subject.

I would be very interested in hearing a follow-up from the OP with how this problem is ultimately resolved, just for my personal knowledge should I experience the same issue at some time in the future.

Thanks.

[Maxximuss]

I just ordered a Weigand 1911 extractor adjusting tool and plan on calling STI tomorrow. I have several 2011's so I better plan on learning to tune my extractors. I have never had a problem with any of my Limited guns before.

[Postal Bob]

How are your loaded rounds in regards to passing in the case gauge or the plunk test in the barrel? If your loaded rounds are bulged, it could be putting extra pressure to extract them, and the extractor is pulling past the rim.

If you loaded rounds check out, the other thing is maybe the extractor tunnel is oversized. And the extractor has too much play to keep hold of the empty cartridge.

The fact that a new Brazos tuned extractor gave the same results, suggests it's not specifically an extractor problem. Either oversized ammo, or an oversized extractor tunnel.

[tyler2you]

In the picture, it looks like there's damage to the case rim caused by the extractor. Were you able to easily remove the case from the chamber? Ejector in good shape?

I'd go with an Aftec extractor since it's a 9mm.

Edited April 21, 2016 by tyler2you

[Maxximuss]

How are your loaded rounds in regards to passing in the case gauge or the plunk test in the barrel? If your loaded rounds are bulged, it could be putting extra pressure to extract them, and the extractor is pulling past the rim.

If you loaded rounds check out, the other thing is maybe the extractor tunnel is oversized. And the extractor has too much play to keep hold of the empty cartridge.

The fact that a new Brazos tuned extractor gave the same results, suggests it's not specifically an extractor problem. Either oversized ammo, or an oversized extractor tunnel.

All of my loads are case gauged and I don't case gauge factory ammo. Neither of the ammo has had any problems in other guns. That is a good idea about the oversized extractor tunnel, I didn't consider that. I sure hope that isn't the problem. I just ordered an Aftec extractor to see if that fixes the problem. It might just be that the extractors are better tuned for .40 or something. I called STI today and left a message, no one called me back yet. I need it fixed so I can get this Glock off my hip...

[45 Raven]

The fact that a new Brazos tuned extractor gave the same results, suggests it's not specifically an extractor problem. Either oversized ammo, or an oversized extractor tunnel.

What are your options if the extractor tunnel is oversized?

[Maxximuss]

In the picture, it looks like there's damage to the case rim caused by the extractor. Were you able to easily remove the case from the chamber? Ejector in good shape?

I'd go with an Aftec extractor since it's a 9mm.

There is always a mark where the extractor partially pulled the brass out of the chamber and slide off. I bought a Aftec and see if that will fix the problem. The fired brass was easily removed from the chamber either by hand or racking the gun again with the magazine removed. The ejector looks un-damaged (I think), I'll take a picture of it.

[cindynles]

Did you check to see if the extractor is clocking? When you replaced the extractor did you install a FPS or did you reuse the old one?

[Maxximuss]

Did you check to see if the extractor is clocking? When you replaced the extractor did you install a FPS or did you reuse the old one?

That is a possibility, the extractor didn't look perfectly flush as it normally does on the rear of the gun. I reused the old FPS. I will reinstall the extractor and see if it will sit more square/flush. How often do you replace the FPS?

Edited April 22, 2016 by Maxximuss

[427Cobra]

Thank god you found out about this at the range and not at work

[Targetpractice]

In the picture, it looks like there's damage to the case rim caused by the extractor. Were you able to easily remove the case from the chamber? Ejector in good shape?

I'd go with an Aftec extractor since it's a 9mm.

There is always a mark where the extractor partially pulled the brass out of the chamber and slide off. I bought a Aftec and see if that will fix the problem. The fired brass was easily removed from the chamber either by hand or racking the gun again with the magazine removed. The ejector looks un-damaged (I think), I'll take a picture of it.

good move with the aftec. That should definitely solve your problem.

[tyler2you]

Make sure you follow the instructions for the Aftec install. The FPS needs to be radiused. Also, check to make sure the tip of the Aftec doesn't hit the barrel.

[Postal Bob]

Did you check to see if the extractor is clocking? When you replaced the extractor did you install a FPS or did you reuse the old one?

That is a possibility, the extractor didn't look perfectly flush as it normally does on the rear of the gun. I reused the old FPS. I will reinstall the extractor and see if it will sit more square/flush. How often do you replace the FPS?

I installed a Brazos tuned extractor on my 9mm 1911 STI. The old fps was a poor fit with it, and I put in a new one and fit it to the extractor and gun. But like you noted, the back of the extractor wasn't flush with the back of the slide. That shouldn't matter, as it's the spacing at the front of the extractor, and the tension of it that matters. You really need to check the spacing of the front of the extractor and the tension. And if need be adjust it, and/or get a new fps. Here is an article by Brazos that explains how to check and fit an extractor and fps. http://www.brazoscustom.com/magart/0609.htm , http://www.brazoscustom.com/magart/ejection%20perfection.htm

Edited April 22, 2016 by Postal Bob

[cindynles]

This is what I mean by "clocking". A clocking extractor will release the rim of the fired brass too soon resulting in it not clearing the ejection port.

Edited April 22, 2016 by cindynles

[Maxximuss]

Solution:

The fps from my 9mm Tactical wouldn't fit very easily into the Brazos extractor fps channel, it would bind up on the top portion. This would make the Brazos extractor clock as it was pushed into place. The fps from my Sti Tactical in .40 would fit the Brazos extractor without binding. I swapped the 40 and 9 fps fps. They both went in smooth and didn't bind up. I had to add some bend into the Brazos extractor, it didn't have enough bite on the brass rim. I did a test fire of over 100 round (shooting strong hand, weak hand, and even some intentional limp wrist) and didn't have any malfunctions. I ran some duty rounds through it and it also ran flawless. I believe the problem is solved! Thank you all for the help and input!