Rikarin Posted February 7, 2005 Share Posted February 7, 2005 Hello With factory ammo, I like .40's recoil because it pushes back in my hand instead of muzzle flippy 9mm. My first gun was .40 but I switched to 9mm in competition because there's too much kick to rapid fire .40. So, my question is, if I load 9mm and .40 bullets in same minor power factor and shoot them in say G19 and G23, do they still recoil differently like with factory ammo? Or its because same load, both behave same? If they still recoil differently, I might want to change to G23, since my own reload is now possible. This is a big $$$ question and wanted to pick your brains... As always your brain power is appreciated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted February 7, 2005 Share Posted February 7, 2005 Do a search and you will find 100 replies to this question. 50 will say the 9 mm is softer - the other 50 will say the .40 is the way to go.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcoliver Posted February 7, 2005 Share Posted February 7, 2005 I've always found the 9 to be snappy when loaded to higher PF's. The 40 starts to become pushy as the PF lowers. I compensate by dropping recoil spring poundage so the gun doesn't feel too sluggish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierruiggi Posted February 7, 2005 Share Posted February 7, 2005 My humble advice: 1st and most important, learn to shoot major PF loads fast and accurate, unless you have a SEVERE physical handicap, it IS possible for everyone. Plus, there certainly are advantages in shooting major (Production Division is an exception for obvious reasons). 2nd if you don't own the Glocks already, consider getting the full sized models instead of the compact ones (I'm sure you already know, but they are the G17 in 9mm and the G22 in .40). They'll help with the recoil a little bit and the longer sight radius can help accuracy too. If you do better with those, consider the longer models too (G34 in 9mm and G35 in .40). Don't jump into conclusions after firing them one or two times, I for example, find the G23 easier to "time" than the G22. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikarin Posted February 7, 2005 Author Share Posted February 7, 2005 Do a search and you will find 100 replies to this question.50 will say the 9 mm is softer - the other 50 will say the .40 is the way to go.... My applogies... Its kinda lonly process of doing research & practice all by myself (with help of books and videos) and I opted out for actual human support MColiver: what do you mean by "sluggish" and why you don't like it? Pierruiggi: Matt Burkett said its beter to practice with same ammo/gun all the time. Is there any reason I should pracitce with major? I compared G19 and G17 and for some reason, G17 was more snappy for me and decided on G19 because I had no idea about reloading or power factor last year. Of curse if snappiness is not factor I'd had bought G17. I wish I have an acess to G34 and G35 but not many people shoot production around me. and can't compare. Ranges doesn't have those too but I will try to locate one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Orr Posted February 7, 2005 Share Posted February 7, 2005 Personally - If you are a reloader and can get components at a reasonable cost (where you live?)... I would buy the G 35 and download for Production competition. If you are not a reloader and feel sure you will shoot production only, a G 34 or a standard size 9 mm. Even if you do reload - not much $$$ to be saved on a 9 mm. A G 35 would allow you to play in other classifications. I think that Pierruiggi makes good points in his post. Do a search in the Glock Forum for "Production" and read what the REAL Glock shooters have to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jessej Posted February 7, 2005 Share Posted February 7, 2005 Rikarin, Didnt we meet at Richmond a week ago? Kevin C (Docglock) recently won a G35 at the last GSSF match in Richmond. I'm sure if you ask him, he'll let you check it out He's a very generous guy. BerKim won a G35 also and shoots in Richmond too. They both belong to this forum. And I have a G23 for comparison if you like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe D Posted February 7, 2005 Share Posted February 7, 2005 I have a 34 and a couple of 35s. I load the 34 to a 127-129 pf and the 35 to a 138-140 pf. I use a 147 gr. bullet in the 9 and a 180 in the 35. The 35 shoots just as softly as the 34 even though the pf is greater. Loading a 35 down to the same pf as the 9 yields a softer shooting gun. Not just my opinion, but echoed by several other shooters that have shot both of these guns. The only difference in reloading cost is the bullet. 147s cost me $40m vs $50m for the 180s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harmon Posted February 8, 2005 Share Posted February 8, 2005 look into loading the 9mm with 147 grain bullets and a fast burning powder. should be alot less snappy than 115s. factory 9mm ammo, especially winchester white box, is pretty rough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricW Posted February 8, 2005 Share Posted February 8, 2005 Rikarin, The problem you are experiencing is a little more complex that it would seem. I shoot a G19 too, and I find that I like *hotter* loads because they snap the gun back into position automatically. I personally feel like people are deluding themselves into a region where the Glock performs marginally because they're trying to equate "low recoil" with "puts bullets on target quickly". I question whether there's a 1 to 1 correlation there. Shooting foofer loads does pay dividends with 1911's, but I'm not so sure that it matters so much in the Glock until you hit 22 rimfire recoil. The G19 is an eminently shootable platform (I really like mine), but you might consider doing something a little contrarian and shooting hot ammo in it and see what happens. Glock grips are thin and pliable. By running hotter ammo, you can cause the frame to store energy then release it in the form of driving the muzzle back down into position. The key is in learning to let the gun shoot itself. I find that doing Bill Drills (Draw, fire 6 shots at 7 to 10 yards as fast as you can) is a great way to dial in your grip technique so that you learn to let the gun do the work. I'll also say that my ammo preferences are definitely FAR from the norm in USPSA. My last suggestion will sound really silly, but see if you can your hands on a 44 mag and put a box downrange. Then go back to your 9mm. Changing your relative perspective can make recoil management seem much easier. My 2 ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierruiggi Posted February 8, 2005 Share Posted February 8, 2005 I agree with EricW, I for some reason shoot better .45ACP rounds that make high PF (195PF and up), I find that they're snappier and that acually HELPS me put rounds into target faster. Matt Burkett said its beter to practice with same ammo/gun all the time. Is there any reason I should pracitce with major?I compared G19 and G17 and for some reason, G17 was more snappy for me and decided on G19 because I had no idea about reloading or power factor last year. Of curse if snappiness is not factor I'd had bought G17. I wish I have an acess to G34 and G35 but not many people shoot production around me. and can't compare. Ranges doesn't have those too but I will try to locate one. Don't listen to that Burkett dude... He doesn't know crap! Just kidding, just kidding! Perhaps I did not express myself correctly. It certainly is benificial to keep variables (such as ammo) consistent throughout practices and matches and if you are shooting Production, then yes, there's no point in shooting "major" simply because there is no "major" in that Division. However IF you shoot another Division, then you should CONSIDER shooting ammo that makes major PF. I think you'll find more beneficial to score major than to have marginally more mag capacity. Also, I see absolutely NO benefit to shoot .40 ammo that makes only minor PF. On the subject of "snappiness" between different guns, once again, consider that "snappy" can be beneficial. It all depends in your technique, style, and ATTITUDE towards shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikarin Posted February 8, 2005 Author Share Posted February 8, 2005 Thank you so much for the support! Every girl needs some emotional support, don't we??? :D Merlin Orr - I have been complaning I don't want to buy reloader because it doesn't match the interior scheme of my condo. Alas. I decided to buy one after learned about power factor stuff. I am not still sure if I shoot other division though. I can't pour too much money Jessej - I don't know if we met since (1) I am focused on shooting so much, only names I remember so far from Richimond people are Tom, Lily and Ron. Please say "hi" to me next time you see me!!!! I am so so so happy to know there's way to compare G35 and G23 locally and will take up the offer and contact BerKim. Joe D - I have been reading up alot and that sounds like very popular opinion. I am waiting for the reload from Atlanta Armas (147Gr, least power factor) for testing before start reloading and see how I will feel. EricW - Hmmmm. I NEVER thought about that! When I shoot very slowly (2-3 sec interval) I can let the gun do the work but since I started competition hence trying to shoot "faster", I aquired bad habit of pushing muzzle down trying to keep gun under control. It is THE task of mine for now to get rid of this. Strong recoil makes me loose control a bit especially like very close targets you wanna go almost aoutmatic fire. Again, thank you all for your input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcoliver Posted February 9, 2005 Share Posted February 9, 2005 MColiver: what do you mean by "sluggish" and why you don't like it? Hello Rikarin. By "sluggish" I meant I'm "waiting" for the slide to reciprocate. I found this is more noticeable to 1911-type guns than the glocks when the load (or recoil spring) is lowered. But this is really subjective and may vary from one person to the other. Also, I agree with the posts above about hot ammo. I found out I shot my old G19 better with cor-bon ammo. After that I started using reloads that were already hotter. There is something about the glock snappy recoil that makes it track consistently if you leave it alone. And I even spent a lot of time tinkering with my 1911 instead of shooting it just so I can duplicate that glock recoil...to no avail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikarin Posted February 9, 2005 Author Share Posted February 9, 2005 Oi! Never in my wildest dream I thought Glock's snappy recoil actually can be used to get back where it was. Whoa. You know, I never understand why people take so many years to get better on this "poing and click" sports. There are so much into this. I thought whenI got perfect ammo and perfect gun, I can just practice but its more organic than that, isn't it? I will re-examine my "recoil management" all over again. I think I was trying to keep the frontsight from even moving anywhere. I will let the gun do its work tomorrow at range. Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flexmoney Posted February 9, 2005 Share Posted February 9, 2005 Rikarin, All other things being equal...a heavier bullet (at the same pwer factor) will feel softer. If that is your goal, then a minor 40 load would be a good way to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikarin Posted February 10, 2005 Author Share Posted February 10, 2005 Rikarin,All other things being equal...a heavier bullet (at the same pwer factor) will feel softer. If that is your goal, then a minor 40 load would be a good way to go. You are absolutly right... about heavier bullets. I have recieved 147gtr 851+ (whatever it is) subsonic minimum powerfactor which passes IDPA/IPSC minor today. I went to the range and my grouping was half the small AND I can dump a magazine twice as fast. NOW I started to wonder what it will like if this is .40. Gready! Ok, I am going tol become Sharpshooter (now I am Marksman) in couple month!! Thank you for support Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted February 10, 2005 Share Posted February 10, 2005 Rikarin Maku Mozo means "don't be deluded"..... welcome ot the forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rikarin Posted February 10, 2005 Author Share Posted February 10, 2005 RikarinMaku Mozo means "don't be deluded"..... welcome ot the forums Thanks Tightloop. I can force translate it in Japanese to....... screen faking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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