Stoeger M 3500

[EricS]

Be advised. I'm a retired cop and Army veteran so I've been around a few guns including shotguns. But. I'm brand new to 3 Gun and am absolutely not an expert in either competition or shotguns in general. Basically I'm just a big ol' goober with a desire to compete and a limited bank account (read: I'm cheap as hell).

I've been perusing the M3000 thread and got very interested. I went looking locally and found a 26" M3500 in black. I asked and Sperman and P.E. Kelley indicated there wasn't a great deal of difference between the two. After reading the positive reviews and getting some good advice (Thanks Mister Kelley!) I took the plunge and bought it. It was advertised at $499 but I actually got it for $432 out the door. It comes with 4 chokes; IC, Full, Cyl (I think it was) and Turkey. I shot it with the IC choke only today.

I shot it right out of the box with some 3 Dram Eq. 2 3/4" 8s. It was disappointing. It'd feed some but not consistently. I shot the box and it seemed to get better but it was covered in grease so a cleaning seemed to be in order.

I took it home and did a detail strip and thorough cleaning. It's fairly well doused with a cosmoline type substance. I then lubed the entire gun thoroughly. I grabbed some Duck and Goose 2 3/4 lead and 3 inch steel for break in and a grab bag of leftovers from my last (and first and only) 3 Gun match that I was running in my 870.

The gun is a little heavy to my hands but then I'm used to an 870 and doubles so most semis feel at least a little heavy to me. The fit and finish are actually quite good. I have no complaints there especially for a sub 500 dollar gun. It breaks down and reassembles easily and quickly. Pointing was good with the red fiber optic front sight falling perfectly to my eye.

I started with some 3" Ts and 2 3/4" 2s and 5s. It ran perfectly. I intended to run all 3 boxes before switching out to the lighter loads but excitement and curiosity got the better of me. After a handfu of the heavier loads I loaded up some of the light stuff. It was a mixture of Winchester, Federal and Brand X in 2 3/4", 3 Dram Eq., 7 1/2 and 8s. Again, it ran near flawlessly. I say near because in that grab bag was some 1 ounce loads and some Winchester Extra Light loads. It would eject the Extra Lights but not feed them every time. It would regularly but not perfectly. Interestingly enough it ate the 1 Ounce #8 loads with aplomb.

I shot the thing until my shoulder was begging for mercy. In reality I can fire this shotgun with either heavy or light loads much longer than I can my 870. I have limited experience with semiauto shotguns but the gun feels light shooting to me. I had a friend try it and he was quite enthusiastic (he also being a pump shooter). Especially when he heard what I paid for it.

My impressions. I love the thing. It points well and easily. Transitions weren't quite up to the 18 1/2" barreled 870 but then what is? It ate all the 2 3/4" 3 Dram Eq. 7 1/2s and 8s I could feed it. I get the feeling from my experience with extra light loads that it might be a little ammunition sensitive. At least on break in because it also ate 1 ounce loads with no issue so perhaps a few hundred rounds of loosening up will address that. It also may be lube sensitive from what I'm reading and from my initial atempt to shoot it. I recommend a complete detail cleaning and thorough lubrication before you shoot it. After I did that it ran like a Swiss watch. I was that guy. Don't be that guy. It shot spot on point of aim/point of impact. I didn't pattern it but it shoots where I aimed it. It feels good in the hand and the build quality is very good. It seems like it should cost quite a bit more than I paid for it though I'm not telling anyone else that and they most defimitely cannot have it back.

I'll be ordering a mag tube extension and a larger bolt handle. Other than that I'm just going to shoot the thing and see where we go. I have another match at the end of January so we'll see. In the meantime I'll be spending some of that money I saved not buying a more expensive gun on Load 2 shell holders and practice ammo.

Folks, I think I've found my 3 Gun shotgun.

[openclassterror]

Getting the sticky grease off makes a difference on cycling, also I recommend putting it away with the slide locked back for a week to compress the recoil spring. You will probably still have a little trouble getting reliable cycling out of the lightest of loads. However, I am a HUGE proponent of the 3000, so I think as long as you identify the low threshold of recoil it takes to run it and stay above those loads you will be very happy. The very feature that allows ghost loading (the carrier is activated when the bolt is almost to the rear of its travel) is the Achilles' heel on weak loads. If the bolt doesn't go all the way back on cycling, it won't lift the next round. Let me know what mag tube extension you have to run on the 3500. We are running a batch of adapters for the Nordic tubes that allows them to work on the 3000s, I wonder if the 3500 is the same. It is similar to the Nova/Supernova though not interchangeable. They will go for sale as soon as I have my vendor account set up with Brian so I am official on the forum. Hopefully within the next 2-3 weeks. I have already talked to him, but my website isn't set up for consumers yet. Many thanks to Mr Kelley for leading the way on this platform!

Tom

[EricS]

Thanks for the tips and info Openclassterror. I'm becoming a believer.

My plan is to get the Nove/Supernova mag extension and see where we are. From all I can find the 3000 and 3500 share the mag tube in common. If so it should fit. I'm definitely interested in becoming a customer of yours. If you want a beta tester for the 3500 let me know. I can cut you a check for an adapter anytime.

I'll second your kudos to Mr. Kelley. He's really brought this firearm into the public eye. I think Stoeger should at least comp him a gun!

[openclassterror]

I appreciate your interest but to be clear I am not marketing until my inclusion in the Enos vendor list is complete. I value the forum people here and don't want to jump the gun. Kelley is not only a competent gun mechanic, but a passing fair 3gunner as well. Might look at his standings in the 3Gun Nation Pro series.

[EricS]

Understood. I'm a fair hand at fabrication so I'll take a swing at her myself. I'll let you know what I use and how it goes. I've now followed Kelley on YouTube and am currently going through is videos. The man can shoot!

[elynch2007]

Nordic told me that Stoeger used both Nova and Super Nova tubes on the 3500 at random, Stoeger suggest 3 and 3 1/2 inch shells for a 3500 or it may not cycle.

[EricS]

In looking at the Nordic MXT and EXT tubes from their site it lists both the Benelli Nova and Super Nova as the same tube extension. I have already run 2 3/4 12 gauge through mine with no issues if loads are kept at a certain level. My feel for the gun is 2 3/4 inch 3 Dram Equivalent (I wanna say 1200 fps but someone please chime in if I got that wrong), 1 1/8 ounce 7.5s and 8s will run all day after cleaning, lube and break in. Also, no recoil attenuator in the butt-stock when running light 2 3/4 inch loads. That's for the gun I am currently shooting. YMMV.

[gunther]

I just picked up one of the m3500s so far so good. I only have 35rds through it. But took some pics next to a Benelli M3

[Jesse Tischauser]

I just picked up a 26" M3000 off of gun broker today. $459 shipped if all i have to do is add a tube, weld the lifter, pop on a hi viz front sight, and open the loading port this could be the ticket for entry level inexpensive 3 gunning.

Do we need to weld the lifters on these?

What's the scoop on the Nordic extension nut mods?

[P.E. Kelley]

I just picked up a 26" M3000 off of gun broker today. $459 shipped if all i have to do is add a tube, weld the lifter, pop on a hi viz front sight, and open the loading port this could be the ticket for entry level inexpensive 3 gunning.

Do we need to weld the lifters on these?

What's the scoop on the Nordic extension nut mods?

NO "need" for the welded lifter. It is longer and shaped better to lessen the finger bite.

JT, you'll find this on another M3000/M3500 thread that you posted on. Some guns the Nova tube nuts just screw on. Other guns you must remove a section of material from the end of the tube. Still others have had to wrench on the tube nut to re-form threads. Others still say it is a lathe operation on the tube nut.

AND!!!! Please do me a BIG favor and pick up a copy of the current issue of Shooting Illustrated where my article is on getting this shotgun ready for 3-gun. If you guys don't support the magazines that offer you info on your sport, they won't pay me to write for them. Then I can't afford to buy the gun and buy the ammo and take the time to collect the info.

Edited December 29, 2013 by P.E. Kelley

[gunther]

Here is a little better pic of the loading gate, top is a M3 bottom is M3500.

[Jesse Tischauser]

I just picked up a 26" M3000 off of gun broker today. $459 shipped if all i have to do is add a tube, weld the lifter, pop on a hi viz front sight, and open the loading port this could be the ticket for entry level inexpensive 3 gunning.

Do we need to weld the lifters on these?

What's the scoop on the Nordic extension nut mods?

NO "need" for the welded lifter. It is longer and shaped better to lessen the finger bite.

JT, you'll find this on another M3000/M3500 thread that you posted on. Some guns the Nova tube nuts just screw on. Other guns you must remove a section of material from the end of the tube. Still others have had to wrench on the tube nut to re-form threads. Others still say it is a lathe operation on the tube nut.

AND!!!! Please do me a BIG favor and pick up a copy of the current issue of Shooting Illustrated where my article is on getting this shotgun ready for 3-gun. If you guys don't support the magazines that offer you info on your sport, they won't pay me to write for them. Then I can't afford to buy the gun and buy the ammo and take the time to collect the info.

I'll definitely pick p a copy and send a letter to the editor too.

Edited December 29, 2013 by Jesse Tischauser

[P.E. Kelley]

That would be great Jesse! Thank you!!!

[slymantis]

sounds like we're going to be seeing more of these things at 3 gun matches soon.

[openclassterror]

I was hoping you would say what magazine the article was in. I will pick up a copy tomorrow! Does Shooting Illustrated have many articles on 3gun related stuff? If so might be worth a subscription.

Tom

[giarc01]

I picked up the magazine on Friday along with my m3500. I went out Saturday after cleaning it a bit and ran almost 75 rounds of 2 3/4 7.5 shot 1 1/8 oz. @ 1350 fps and it ran like a sewing machine. No hiccups, no fte, no ftf's. I pulled the trigger as fast as I could a few times and it went off every time. I watched my buddy do the same thing with it and saw a fire ball come out the side. For having less than $600 in a 3 gun that I can still take out and goose hunt with you can't beat it. Thanks again to Patrick Kelly for a great article and great info on here. I will post some pictures when my tube arrives next week.

[Mlussoro]

i was just at sportsmans and was told about this gun, they didnt have one in stock but the more i read about it im thinking this might be my entry into 3 gun shotgun!! thanks for the review!!

[EricS]

I just picked up a 26" M3000 off of gun broker today. $459 shipped if all i have to do is add a tube, weld the lifter, pop on a hi viz front sight, and open the loading port this could be the ticket for entry level inexpensive 3 gunning.

Do we need to weld the lifters on these?

What's the scoop on the Nordic extension nut mods?

NO "need" for the welded lifter. It is longer and shaped better to lessen the finger bite.

JT, you'll find this on another M3000/M3500 thread that you posted on. Some guns the Nova tube nuts just screw on. Other guns you must remove a section of material from the end of the tube. Still others have had to wrench on the tube nut to re-form threads. Others still say it is a lathe operation on the tube nut.

AND!!!! Please do me a BIG favor and pick up a copy of the current issue of Shooting Illustrated where my article is on getting this shotgun ready for 3-gun. If you guys don't support the magazines that offer you info on your sport, they won't pay me to write for them. Then I can't afford to buy the gun and buy the ammo and take the time to collect the info.

I'll definitely pick p a copy and send a letter to the editor too.

Count me in on that as well, for what it's worth coming from a nobody like me. You've made a big fan here Patrick. I've subscribed to your YouTube channel as well (and yours too Jesse). Thanks for cluing me in on this and giving me the support to give this shotgun a try!

[P.E. Kelley]

I just picked up a 26" M3000 off of gun broker today. $459 shipped if all i have to do is add a tube, weld the lifter, pop on a hi viz front sight, and open the loading port this could be the ticket for entry level inexpensive 3 gunning.

Do we need to weld the lifters on these?

What's the scoop on the Nordic extension nut mods?

NO "need" for the welded lifter. It is longer and shaped better to lessen the finger bite.

JT, you'll find this on another M3000/M3500 thread that you posted on. Some guns the Nova tube nuts just screw on. Other guns you must remove a section of material from the end of the tube. Still others have had to wrench on the tube nut to re-form threads. Others still say it is a lathe operation on the tube nut.

AND!!!! Please do me a BIG favor and pick up a copy of the current issue of Shooting Illustrated where my article is on getting this shotgun ready for 3-gun. If you guys don't support the magazines that offer you info on your sport, they won't pay me to write for them. Then I can't afford to buy the gun and buy the ammo and take the time to collect the info.

I'll definitely pick p a copy and send a letter to the editor too.

Count me in on that as well, for what it's worth coming from a nobody like me. You've made a big fan here Patrick. I've subscribed to your YouTube channel as well (and yours too Jesse). Thanks for cluing me in on this and giving me the support to give this shotgun a try!

EricS...It is for guys like you that make the effort worthwhile. Thank you!

[EricS]

Ok. I got my NC +5 extension tube in the mail today. I also bought the follower and tube clamp. I couldn't wait so I went down to my work room and got started. Most of it you already know. I took the shotgun all the way down, did a quick cleaning, made sure I had everything and got my Dremel out. Then I decided to check to make sure everything fit as anticipated before I started cutting. I wanted a good idea how much of the stock tube to take off. A funny thing happened and I'm not sure what to think. I took the +5 tube off the nut and screwed the nut onto the stock tube. And screwed and screwed. It bottomed out at the bottom of the stock tube's threads. Puzzled I reassembled the shotgun to see what I was missing. As I screwed the nut onto the assembled shotgun it engaged the detent ball. Then it pulled the barrel and forearm tight to the receiver. I twisted and banged it but it's tight. Like the tube was made for the 3500 specifically. No trimming at all. No grinding, sanding or modifying in any way. Running my finger inside the nut/stock tube joint there is a small shelf I'll probably have to address but it loads and spits out the rounds with no issues as is. This is the Nordic +5 MXT for the Benelli Nova/Supernova. Am I missing something? When I say it screws down tight I'm talking about made to fit tight. To the end of the threads and engaging the barrel detent, pulling everything together tight. I can't see where there's any slop or poor fit at all. I'm stymied. I don't want to look a gift horse in the mouth but I'm concerned I missed something really important.

She's awful pretty ain't she?

Edited December 30, 2013 by EricS

[giarc01]

Eric,

That makes me really excited that you didn't have to do anything. Hopefully my order will ship quick so that I can get mine finished up.

[EricS]

Eric,

That makes me really excited that you didn't have to do anything. Hopefully my order will ship quick so that I can get mine finished up.

I hope yours fits like mine did though I'm still worried that I missed something. It runs and fits and looks right but I can't get over the feeling that it shouldn't. I think I'm being paranoid.

[openclassterror]

If it isn't right, it will not fit loose. It WILL NOT SCREW ON. You can force it, and deform the threads, but it is an interference fit. I would be interested to know, do you have any calipers with which to measure the threads on your shotgun magazine tube? (the tube on the gun, not the extension) On mine, the thread is 1.000 outside diameter, with 2mm thread pitch. (One turn is .0787 inches.) The male part of the thread is .049 wide, and the gap between threads is only .029. The nut provided me by Nordic was approx. 1.75mm thread pitch, and groove and land of thread were the same width prior to machining. I am interested to find out if the discrepancy is in the shotguns, or the nuts provided by Nordic. We are running the first batch of barrel nuts right now to fit the threads on my shotgun, so I am hoping we aren't making a part due to tolerance issues at Nordic. I am eagerly awaiting more info on this.

Thread Specs on Stoeger M3000- (inch equiv)

Major diameter 1.000

Minor Diameter 0.965

Square buttress thread type

width of thread .049

width of groove .029

total thread pitch (one revolution) 0.079

total thread length 0.560

Pilot length 0.200

Pilot diameter 0.960

Is this the same?

[openclassterror]

BTW, I am glad yours went right together. Nothing to worry about, there have been reports all along that on some guns they screw right on no problem. We are just trying to address the problem children. As I recall, even Mr Kelley's screwed right together. Be glad that you got a setup that worked out of the box!

Tom

[EricS]

I'm sorry Tom but I don't have the calipers to check the threads. I can say that to my hand they matched the Nova/Supernova thread pattern exactly. I'll try and get some better pictures of mine up in a bit. Maybe you can get something from them.