New to 223 Reloading - Tools and equipment selection

[cautery]

OK... been putting this off too long, but am getting set up to load 223 for our three ARs (1:9, 1:9, 1:10). I will have load and component questions for sure later, but am focusing on getting the right/desired tools/equipment first. Here is a beginning list and questions:

(In no particular order or priority... some of it is neat to have stuff I will get later)

[EDIT] Oops... forgot what I already bought...

0) Giraud Trimmer on order... [/EDIT]

1) I have a standard set of Redding Dies (FL size, standard bullet seater, and 223 taper crimp). I will be getting a Comp Bullet seating die (no compressed loads), but am considering getting a Type S full length bushing sizing die. My ONLY concern is the knowing whether the Type S can be adjusted for full neck resizing... I'm finding conflicting info. ?? I am also going to get a universal decapping die for the loading head.

2) Redding Instant Indicator Headspace and Bullet Comparator - Getting this because I simply want it to use for measuring headspace in the three rifles, and other neat to have info. I know it is not a requirement.

3) Stuck case removal kit - Is the Redding kit sufficient, or is there a better/alternate option?

4) Case Lube - Use Dillon's? Or is it worth buying lanolin oil and some pure ethyl alcohol and making my own?

5) Uniquetek toolhead clamp kits - Have used these before on 550 and they work great. Will be using them on the 223 toolheads whether I settle on loading with the 550s or the 650 press. (May consider trying out the precision machined toolhead or precision machined toolhead with "floating die" setup. Again, I know this is NOT required. I'm just doing it to remove variables.

6) Uniquetek Turbo Bearing kit - will use these if settle on using 550s to reduce shell plate tipping.

7) 223 Case gauge - Which case gauge should I choose? Dillon? Wilson? other?

8) Dillon Swager - I'm sure I have some MILSPEC stuff and don't want to do it by hand.

9) Shell plate(s), buttons, powder funnel for 223

10) Dedicated powder measure for 223 (Dillon probably with spring mod and other mods to try an make meter extruded powder better since I have 8lbs of Varget to use up.) Will likely use a micrometer powder bar since I have had great luck with them in the past. MIGHT consider one of the precision machined powder bars if it looks like it might help metering.

11) Extra top for Dillon tumber (big one) so I can modify the top with a cutout for easier dumping into the separator.

12) Redding Big Boss II single stage press - always wanted a single stage press for making LR match ammo

13) Flash Hole Deburring Tool _ Redding? or aomeone else's?

OK, list is long, and there's a bunch of other neat to have stuff, but for now...

Any comments, suggestions, additions?

Thanks!

Edited August 15, 2013 by cautery

[R112mercer]

1) Not to sure about this, but you said your loading for AR's, so you probably want to go with a small base sizing die like Dillon's dies to make sure it'll fit your chamber. I would avoid neck sizing.

2) No opinion, I don't have this.

3) I haven't stuck a case. Yet. No opinion.

4) I use Dillon case lube.

5) I haven't used the Uniquetek toolheads yet, I just purchased one of the screw in ones. But in talking with Uniquetek's owner Lee at Rocky Mountain 3 Gun he said the floating die toolhead is only for benchrest/long range accuracy. Probably overkill if your not doing these activities.

6) I load on a 650, no opinion.

7) If you use JP barrels I would recommend a JP case gauge. If not, Dillon.

8) I use a $10 counter sink I bought at Home Depot to remove Military crimp. Chuck it in a drill, a quick buzz and it's gone. Get the widest/shallowest cutter they have.

9) Dillon

10) I went with Hornady's case activated powder drop and an RCBS funnel. The Hornady unit accepts their powder funnels or the RCBS, it works great, and you can use stick powders like Varget without the bridging issues of Dillon funnels.

11) No opinion

12) I use a xl650, no opinion.

13) I don't flashhole deburr, I don't have time for that and I don't hang on to my brass that long to make it worthwhile.

Good luck!

Edited August 14, 2013 by R112mercer

[kamikaze1a]

I would start with the minimum equipment and just start reloading. Some of the stuff you listed would be nice to have but not required. Press, dies, lube, dial caliper and a scale is all you need to start reloading.

By the way, if you want to make your own spray case lube, you need 91% or purer isopropyl alcohol. Lanolin will not dissolve in ethyl alcohol.

[Dan Sierpina]

I process my brass with a single stage press, in batches over the winter mostly.

Dillon Case Lube, one bottle lasted YEARS! If you're loading commercially, maybe making your own would be cost effective.

I use a 60 degree cutter in my lathe to chamfer primer pockets.

Modify the powder funnel with a taper reamer, and polish the inside, use smooth handle motions and above all wait at the top of the stroke for dropping stick powders. Wait even with ball powders, it's a lot more powder than what goes in pistol cases, and it goes through a smaller hole.

You didn't mention a case trimmer, you'll need one. I use a Gracey with a carbide cutter. The Giraud is the fastest available. If you have a drill press, you can get the Forster power base, and their carbide head that trims and deburrs.

I don't bother with micrometer adjustments on the Dillon measure. It doesn't take that long to adjust it.

[cautery]

1) Not to sure about this, but you said your loading for AR's, so you probably want to go with a small base sizing die like Dillon's dies to make sure it'll fit your chamber. I would avoid neck sizing.

5) I haven't used the Uniquetek toolheads yet, I just purchased one of the screw in ones. But in talking with Uniquetek's owner Lee at Rocky Mountain 3 Gun he said the floating die toolhead is only for benchrest/long range accuracy. Probably overkill if your not doing these activities.

10) I went with Hornady's case activated powder drop and an RCBS funnel. The Hornady unit accepts their powder funnels or the RCBS, it works great, and you can use stick powders like Varget without the bridging issues of Dillon funnels.

Good luck!

Thanks Rob...

I'm going to try and not use small base dies unless one of the rifles has a chamber that requires it. Ammo for storage will be loaded to the tightest spec'd chamber and test fired for function in all rifles (SHTF stuff).

I tend to agree that the floating TH might be overkill even for me. I'm gonna call and chat with Lee.

Thanks for the lead on the Hornady/RCBS setup... I'll check 'em out. I've got a spare Dillon measure that I plan to mod...

I would start with the minimum equipment and just start reloading. Some of the stuff you listed would be nice to have but not required. Press, dies, lube, dial caliper and a scale is all you need to start reloading.

By the way, if you want to make your own spray case lube, you need 91% or purer isopropyl alcohol. Lanolin will not dissolve in ethyl alcohol.

Thanks, kamikaze1a... Good advice... I plan to get started ASAP... I actually could load tonight. I have all those things.

Oops... isopropyl, check... OK... know where I can get some... think I have some alrady in my cycling stuff. I have a pound of lanolin from another project, but not lanolin oil... I'll likely just grab a bottle of Dillon and use that 'til its gone.

I process my brass with a single stage press, in batches over the winter mostly.

Dillon Case Lube, one bottle lasted YEARS! If you're loading commercially, maybe making your own would be cost effective.

I use a 60 degree cutter in my lathe to chamfer primer pockets.

Modify the powder funnel with a taper reamer, and polish the inside, use smooth handle motions and above all wait at the top of the stroke for dropping stick powders. Wait even with ball powders, it's a lot more powder than what goes in pistol cases, and it goes through a smaller hole.

You didn't mention a case trimmer, you'll need one. I use a Gracey with a carbide cutter. The Giraud is the fastest available. If you have a drill press, you can get the Forster power base, and their carbide head that trims and deburrs.

I don't bother with micrometer adjustments on the Dillon measure. It doesn't take that long to adjust it.

Thank Dan!

I plan to use your taper reamer suggestion, et al. on one of my spare Dillon measures...

Thanks for the reminder on the trimmer.... I forgot to list it. Put a Giraud on order a couple of days ago... 12 WEEK back order... My drill press arbor bearings are too worn for using the Forster... I NEED a new drill press.

It's not that the mic is that important... (looks cool though). What I like is the VASTLY reduced thread lash... The standard screw has a ton of lash to deal with if you overshoot a setting.

[kamikaze1a]

91% Isopropyl should be available at a fully stocked drug store. I have not tried the 70% variety but I heard that the 91% or purer works best so that what I used.

You can use the solid lanolin but will need to "warm" the solution on your stove with a water bath to get the lanolin to dissolve. About 8-10:1 should be good for most applications. Be very careful while warming as alcohol is very volatile and the flame is nearly invisible...don't completely seal the container that holds the alcohol and you don't necessarily have to heat until all the lanolin completely dissolves.

With once fired brass, you could probably get 2 or 3 reloads before trimming would really become and issue. And in a pinch, you could use a case de-burring tool to get rid of the primer pocket crimp.

[CocoBolo]

I use to process brass on a single stage till I broke it. I do prep and loading on the Hornady Lock and Load, use the RCBS small base dies, (my third set of dies and the best ones I have found). I use the dillon swagger, but sometimes just chunk the lee primer pocket reamer in the drill press, it is faster than the swagger but the swagger does a better job. Trimming I use the WFT, chucked in the drill press, Lymann had tool for chamfer and deburr. I like one shot on the outside of the cases and the Hornady Unique in the neck, put there by rubbing some lube on fore finger and thumb then sliding the case neck over the finger. Wilson drop check, knowing how to use it means everything. I drop check cases after full sizing before loading, and again after loading. I keep the rejects in a practice bucket, a few of those have had to be slam ejected, slam the rifle down on the ground to eject them.

The Hornady powder measure works great, sometimes I even use it on the XL650.

Cleaning the cases after sizing, they go into Fine Walnut I bought at Harbor Freight, love that stuff, corn will get jammed in the flash hole.

Load 10 drop check them, if it looks great dry cycle them thru the gun. If they are hard to eject, well you need to lower the sizing die, if it is all the way down cut it down .005, or get the small base dies.

Almost forgot, I clean the sizing die as needed or about every 200 rounds. If you start to see dents in the case the die is dirty.

Edited August 15, 2013 by CocoBolo

[kamikaze1a]

Where are you seeing the dents? On the shoulder?

[cautery]

91% Isopropyl should be available at a fully stocked drug store. I have not tried the 70% variety but I heard that the 91% or purer works best so that what I used.

You can use the solid lanolin but will need to "warm" the solution on your stove with a water bath to get the lanolin to dissolve. About 8-10:1 should be good for most applications.

Thanks again... I have a double boiler/water bath setup and a two burner (electric) hotplate for use in the garage/shop that I got for another project. So liquefying the lanolin is no issue.... And if I can't find better than 91% locally (CVS and Brookshires has it I beleive), I have chemical supplies I can go to.

I use to process brass on a single stage till I broke it.

Wilson drop check, knowing how to use it means everything. I drop check cases after full sizing before loading, and again after loading.

The Hornady powder measure works great, sometimes I even use it on the XL650.

Cleaning the cases after sizing, they go into Fine Walnut I bought at Harbor Freight, love that stuff, corn will get jammed in the flash hole.

Load 10 drop check them, if it looks great dry cycle them thru the gun. If they are hard to eject, well you need to lower the sizing die, if it is all the way down cut it down .005, or get the small base dies.

Almost forgot, I clean the sizing die as needed or about every 200 rounds. If you start to see dents in the case the die is dirty.

Thanks a bunch... I will get the single stage eventually for various reasons, but also to process/load long range accuracy, and other projects.

Wilson gauge it is... I have several and like them... Perhaps I will get both Wilson and Dillon (I don't have a JP barrel)

I'll have to go read up on the Hornady measure... it'll be hard NOT to use the Dillon even if I have to mod it a bunch... Love Dillon products, and usually don't use anything non-Dillon unless they don't make the part.

REALLY would like to not have to use the small base dies.... but I'm not sure if I want to mill off the bottom of the sizer die body either.

[bigedp51]

cautery

I'm loading for three AR15 rifles and a bolt action .223 on a 1973 vintage Rockchucker press, so pay attention.

1. A small base die makes my cases .0005 smaller in base diameter BUT the die sizes further down the case. If you buy once fired LC cases you will need a small base die because the LC brass may have been fired in a M249 machine gun with a larger chamber and the cases need to be brought down to a "normal" size. Also a taper crimp helps in the shorter carbine barrel with uniform pressures and accuracy.

2. A standard 5.56 chamber is .002 larger in diameter than the standard .223 die so if you are loading for one AR it is more than good enough to resize cases fired in a AR15 rifle. BUT the small base die is added insurance when loading for several AR rifles.

3. You do NOT need any bushing dies for a AR15 that have a larger military chamber (fatter and longer) I have my bushing dies for my bolt action and get better results with a Lee Collet die that I forgot to put in the photo.

KISS - Keep it simple stupid

Edited August 15, 2013 by bigedp51

[cautery]

UPDATE:

- Decided NOT to use Type S dies. Simply adding a Competition Seater Die to my standard set.

- Ordered the Redding Instant Indicator Headspace and Bullet Comparator, Redding Stuck Case Removal Kit, Dillon Case Lube, Redding Flash Hole deburring tool

- Using standard 550 toolheads modified with Toolhead Clamp hardware; will move to machined toolheads (maybe floating die) later.

- Ordered UniqueTek Turbo Bearing kits for both 550 presses.

- Decided to use a Wilson case gauge

- Decided to use the RCBS Primer Pocket Swaginf die for now to see if it works (with press listed below). Will get Dillon swager if necessary later.

- Dillon caliber conversion kit for .223

- Found a new Dillon Powder Measure in my loading room. Spent some time looking at ways to improve it... Ordered some hardware, et al. yesterday. Will post an artile on the process and results later. (There is a LOT of stuff that can be done to improve the function/precision)

- Decided to get a Redding T7 Turret Press instead of the Big Boss II for various reasons... mostly because I can have multiple dies (Instant Indicator, swaging die, et al) in the press and don't have to change/reset them.

- Will get other stuff later... including a concentricity/runout tool, second top for Dillon tumber, et al.

Edited August 16, 2013 by cautery

[kamikaze1a]

With my rifles, I found the small base sizers were not necessary and over-worked the brass. Proper adjustment of my standard sizer die was sufficient. Bumping back the shoulder sufficiently is the key.

It's easy to go overboard when reloading 223/556 for the AR platform. Just trim the brass every few firings, use a consistent powder measure, properly seated primers, quality bullets, good flowing powder, uniform COAL and concentric seating=quality reloads. Most of the rest nice to have/do but probably not necessary for ammo out of an AR with most applications. Long range or bench resting for smallest groups you got it going on but under 300yds, your efforts better spent at the range and your $$$ on more ammo. My 2¢