Loading 223 on a 550

[BobEvan]

I have been loading 45, 380, 357 on my 550 for many years and put 1000's of roads put through it with no problems. just got an AR15 and Dillion dies to start reloading for it. trying to set up dies today and noticed that I was not getting any expansionon of the case mouth to accept the bullet at the powder drop die. (second die) I know all my pistol dies expand the case mouths. is this to be expected with the 223 rifle die? thanks, Bob

[Mark R]

Adjust the powder die down until you get the flare you need. The powder funnel in the powder die is what opens the flare ever so slightly. Little at a time.

[BobEvan]

Adjust the powder die down until you get the flare you need. The powder funnel in the powder die is what opens the flare ever so slightly. Little at a time.

tried that but does not seem like there is any way the powder die can open up the case mouth. looks like it is just a straight cut end with no expander. adjusted die down and ended up crushing the neck.

[technetium-99m]

If you're loading boat tailed bullets you don't really need any bell, just put the bullet on there and roll on.

If you want to flair the neck a bit for flat based bullets or something you can use a Lyman M die and then close it up after seating with a crimp die.

[TerryS]

I don't flare any of my rifle case mouths. After trimming i slightly chamfer case, I load flat base bullets for my 223 with no problems

[George Post]

The Dillion powder die for rifle does not expand the case. Just not made to.

George

[GentlemanJim]

The Dillion powder die for rifle does not expand the case. Just not made to.

George

George is correct!

You dont bell rifle cases.

Jim

[BobEvan]

The Dillion powder die for rifle does not expand the case. Just not made to.

George

George is correct!

You dont bell rifle cases.

Jim

Thanks for the info guys, looks like I do not have to worry about expanding the case mouths, thanks again. Bob

[gm iprod]

You don't bell MOST bottle neck rifle cases. Nearly all straight rifle cases require belling.

When loading Lead projectiles into a bottle necked case it is wise to use a Lyman M die (or similar) to flare the case mouth slightly (after trimming and chamfering) a little to accept the lead projectiles. This prevents damage to the heal of the projectile which will lead to poor accuray and usually significant leading.

Using modern Jacketed Projectiles and Bottle Necked cases it is unwise and un-neccessary to flare case mouths.

[njl]

Dillon .223 dies are quite a bit different from Dillon pistol dies. I looked at mine just recently, and the instructions weren't quite clear. If someone could describe and explain the differences between Dillon pistol dies and Dillon .223 dies, that might be helpful.

[zero-down]

Dillon .223 dies are quite a bit different from Dillon pistol dies. I looked at mine just recently, and the instructions weren't quite clear. If someone could describe and explain the differences between Dillon pistol dies and Dillon .223 dies, that might be helpful.

The dies actually have no relevance here. The powder funnel in the pistol conversions creates the flare to help you seat the bullet. You adjust the powder die until you get the right amount of flare as the funnel pushes against the measure. With the 223 conversion, the powder funnel rides with the case and activates the powder measure. It seals on the outside of the mouth and therefore does not flare the case.

Edited April 12, 2011 by zero-down

[roadapple]

The Dillion powder die for rifle does not expand the case. Just not made to.

George

George is correct!

You dont bell rifle cases.

Jim

What they said.

[njl]

Dillon .223 dies are quite a bit different from Dillon pistol dies. I looked at mine just recently, and the instructions weren't quite clear. If someone could describe and explain the differences between Dillon pistol dies and Dillon .223 dies, that might be helpful.

The dies actually have no relevance here. The powder funnel in the pistol conversions creates the flare to help you seat the bullet. You adjust the powder die until you get the right amount of flare as the funnel pushes against the measure. With the 223 conversion, the powder funnel rides with the case and activates the powder measure. It seals on the outside of the mouth and therefore does not flare the case.

That part I got. I was more concerned with proper adjustment of the resizing die. .223 will be my first bottleneck cartridge.

[Chills1994]

as far as knowing you're resizing enough there are different ways of doing that.

me?

I use a little gadget made by Hornady in their lock-n-load line.

it consists of an anodized red cylinder with a knurled brass thumb screw. then there are several gray/silver caliber specific cylinders that attach to that red cylinder. the brass thumbscrew allows you to clamp the thing onto the jaws of your dial/digital calipers. you stick the headstamp part of the fired case onto one jaw. then you close the jaws so that the mouth of the case goes into the gray cylinder. then you run the jaws closed or tight onto the case. then you can zero the display.

run the case up in the sizing die (with lube of course). then re-measure the case with that doodad still on the calipers.

it should now read in the negative numbers now....somewhere in the -0.002" to -0.004" range.

there is some float in the 550's toolhead and in the shellplate so you won't really get consistent numbers untill there is a shell in each station of the shellplate.

if you over resize, you will push the shoulders back enough to create a ridge which can be so bad that it won't chamber.

I case gauge my stuff along the way too until I I get everything dialed in. and then I still case gauge every single reloaded round. we're talking what? 50K psi plus plus.

[Chills1994]

It finally came to me what it is called...a headspace gauge...well...DUH!

and here are a few pics of it:

just coincidentally that pic is from this link:

http://www.westernshooter.com/2008/02/reloading-for-automatic-rifles-david.html

which appears to be a pretty good article.

this is what it actually looks like in the package:

http://images1.tacticalstore.com/180-180-ffffff/opplanet-hornady-lock-n-load-headspace-gauge-with-five-bushings-hk66.png

duh! bushings is what those grayish silverish things are called. duh!

anywhooo....there might be some people to come along shortly who just use a case gauge to figure out if the case needs to be resized in the first place.

if the just fired case doesn't fit the case gauge, then they'll go ahead and resize/deprime it. then they will stick it back into the case gauge to see if it fits and how well...and I guess that's how some people adjust their sizing dies. I guess...

[cardiackid]

I case gauge every round as well. I bought a JP .223 Wylde gauge (even though I shoot a standard chamber) and every round goes through it. I've loaded about 1200 rounds of .223 so far on a single stage and haven't had a single round not pass gauging, however it's just one of those checks I'll continue to make.

[kelbro]

It finally came to me what it is called...a headspace gauge...well...DUH!

and here are a few pics of it:

just coincidentally that pic is from this link:

which appears to be a pretty good article.

this is what it actually looks like in the package:

duh! bushings is what those grayish silverish things are called. duh!

anywhooo....there might be some people to come along shortly who just use a case gauge to figure out if the case needs to be resized in the first place.

if the just fired case doesn't fit the case gauge, then they'll go ahead and resize/deprime it. then they will stick it back into the case gauge to see if it fits and how well...and I guess that's how some people adjust their sizing dies. I guess...

You can do the same thing with a caliper and a spent case that fits above the shoulder. It's just a relative measurement.

[g56]

Order a Dillon stainless case gauge for 223/5.56, that's the best way to make sure the cases are sized properly. I originally bought a Wilson case gauge, they are plain steel, that thing rusted if you even looked at it crooked!

Finally ordered the stainless case gauge from Dillon, that's what I should have gotten in the first place!

[roadapple]

Order a Dillon stainless case gauge for 223/5.56, that's the best way to make sure the cases are sized properly. I originally bought a Wilson case gauge, they are plain steel, that thing rusted if you even looked at it crooked!

Finally ordered the stainless case gauge from Dillon, that's what I should have gotten in the first place!

This is good to know! I have one Lyman, and one Wilson. I was thinking about shopping for some more case gauges, looks like I'll go with Dillon.

[joey_safety]

The Dillion powder die for rifle does not expand the case. Just not made to.

George

George is correct!

You dont bell rifle cases.

Jim

Thanks for the info guys, looks like I do not have to worry about expanding the case mouths, thanks again. Bob

I apologize in advance for reviving such an old thread, but this is the topic I was hoping for clarification with.

I loaded a bunch of Sierra69 grain MatchKing to take to the range and try to hone in on a good load today using H335.

I loaded 6 of each weight at .2 increments from the min to max out of the Sierra manual...

My question is if there is no belling done to my 223 cases and my 69g BTHP have the bottoms shaved off each time I seat the boolit is this more of a sizing problem?

If it is sizing then I am in a different tight spot.

I bought a thousand "pre-prepped" brass ala sized and primed.

How would I resize those?

Thanks!

[warpspeed]

If they had not been primed already, I would suggest you either full length size them or just neck size them.

Depending on the die you have, if you can remove the decaping pin you should be able to just resize the case neck.

[392heminut]

You might also try chamfering the inside of the case necks a little.