Iggy42 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 (edited) Ok I wanted to make sure I understood something correctly when it comes to the nose dive problems with Limiteds. All I am concerned with at this current time is factory ammo. As much as I would like to reload my own (or use competition ammo from one of several reloaders) it is not an option at the current time. Someone please let me know if I have this right. Stock Mag Body + Henning 140mm pad + stock spring + stock follower + factory .40 S&W = no nose dives (if mag lips are tuned properly) Stock Mag Body + Henning 140mm pad + Grams Spring + Grams Follower + factory .40 S&W = nose dives If it matters I am investigating the purchase of a Limited for USPSA limited division and possible 3-gun use later Also could someone fill me in on how much I can expect from a 140mm mag with stock follower/spring. I am hoping it is still 21 but I would like to make sure. Edited February 17, 2011 by Iggy42 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 Iggy42> In the two magazine scenario's you listed you will have issues on both...... Stock Mag Body + Henning 140mm pad + stock spring + stock follower + factory .40 S&W = no nose dives (if mag lips are tuned properly) This setup will not work well because you are using the stock spring which isn't long enough to use with the 140mm base pad. You could try to make a grams 11 coil spring with the stock follower but it may not work because the top of the grams spring isn't setup to connect with the bottom of the stock follower correctly. The other thing to understand is that the factory follower is a lot taller (3 - 4 times taller) than the grams follower and this eats up space within the magazine. So with the stock follower there is no way that you are going to get 21 rounds in the magazine. You will be lucky to get 18 - 19 rounds in there when using the stock follower. Stock Mag Body + Henning 140mm pad + Grams Spring + Grams Follower + factory .40 S&W = nose dives Yes, this setup will be prone to nose dives because factory .40 ammo is too short. You need to run a longer OAL of 1.2 - 1.225. Here is the bitter pill to swallow...... IF you must run factory ammo and want reliable feeding then you can only run the stock .40 mags with the spacer plate in it to account for the shorter factory rounds. You will NOT be able to run longer after market base pads and will have to stick with using the factory base pad. This essentially limits your max round count to 15 with the stock mags. If you want to run longer base bads with the longer grams 11 coil spring and follower then you MUST run longer OAL ammo, and preferably undersize the whole case down to .415 by using the EGW U-Die and pushing the brass all the way through. If there was a high capactity mag base pad, spring and follower combo that worked with factory length ammo then we would all be using it wouldnt we? Unfortunately there isn't a reliable solution for this other than loading your own ammo to a longer OAL and undersizing the whole case befor loading the rounds. If you are expecting to use the EAA/Tanfo gun in Limited the ONLY way you are going to be competitive from a round count per mag perspective is to reload your own ammo. There is no getting around that fact. It is what it is. If that isn't a viable solution for you, then maybe this gun isn't what you should be shooting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skydiver Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 (edited) Another alternative if you really like the gun, you can also play L-10 like I do. :-) I saw that you are investigating your CZ options. I do recommend going with that Tactical Sport that you were asking about. It'll be comparable to the Limited. Actually, I just thought of this now, if you could get your hands on a small frame .40, then you'll get the reliable feeding with the shorter OAL. I saw on an old thread that Henning has a couple of small frame guns. I wonder if he has one in .40 that he is willing to part with. I don't know whether to believe it or not, but the EAA website claims that the Stock 2 comes in .40 S&W. The Stock 2 in 9mm is supposed to be small frame, perhaps the .40 is as well? Since you'll be playing in Limited you can start cocked and locked, and not have to deal with the double action start. Any which way, good luck and welcome to the sport! Edited February 18, 2011 by Skydiver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealio Posted February 18, 2011 Share Posted February 18, 2011 You could try to make a grams 11 coil spring with the stock follower but it may not work because the top of the grams spring isn't setup to connect with the bottom of the stock follower correctly. The other thing to understand is that the factory follower is a lot taller (3 - 4 times taller) than the grams follower and this eats up space within the magazine. This is the exact setup I have (in 9mm). The spring is fine with the stock follower (the non-MecGar ones). And yes you do lose a couple rounds on capacity. I can only get 20 reliably in my old 9mm mags like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggy42 Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share Posted February 19, 2011 Iggy42> In the two magazine scenario's you listed you will have issues on both...... Stock Mag Body + Henning 140mm pad + stock spring + stock follower + factory .40 S&W = no nose dives (if mag lips are tuned properly) This setup will not work well because you are using the stock spring which isn't long enough to use with the 140mm base pad. You could try to make a grams 11 coil spring with the stock follower but it may not work because the top of the grams spring isn't setup to connect with the bottom of the stock follower correctly. The other thing to understand is that the factory follower is a lot taller (3 - 4 times taller) than the grams follower and this eats up space within the magazine. So with the stock follower there is no way that you are going to get 21 rounds in the magazine. You will be lucky to get 18 - 19 rounds in there when using the stock follower. Stock Mag Body + Henning 140mm pad + Grams Spring + Grams Follower + factory .40 S&W = nose dives Yes, this setup will be prone to nose dives because factory .40 ammo is too short. You need to run a longer OAL of 1.2 - 1.225. Here is the bitter pill to swallow...... IF you must run factory ammo and want reliable feeding then you can only run the stock .40 mags with the spacer plate in it to account for the shorter factory rounds. You will NOT be able to run longer after market base pads and will have to stick with using the factory base pad. This essentially limits your max round count to 15 with the stock mags. If you want to run longer base bads with the longer grams 11 coil spring and follower then you MUST run longer OAL ammo, and preferably undersize the whole case down to .415 by using the EGW U-Die and pushing the brass all the way through. If there was a high capactity mag base pad, spring and follower combo that worked with factory length ammo then we would all be using it wouldnt we? Unfortunately there isn't a reliable solution for this other than loading your own ammo to a longer OAL and undersizing the whole case befor loading the rounds. If you are expecting to use the EAA/Tanfo gun in Limited the ONLY way you are going to be competitive from a round count per mag perspective is to reload your own ammo. There is no getting around that fact. It is what it is. If that isn't a viable solution for you, then maybe this gun isn't what you should be shooting. Thank you I have been trying to get that answer for quite some time now. Granted I wish I would have read it yesterday morning since I won, via an auction, a new Limited. So since I am commited to this thing now can anyone recommend a reloader that does offer "long" loads? I know of Atlanta Arms and DC Ammo, but I have heard that the OAL on the "long" from Atlanta isn't quite long enough for Limiteds. I have not heard much about DC, other than people in general seem to be happy, but I do not know how well his loads run in EAA guns (165FMJ Montana Gold bullet with VV powder, small rifle primer, loaded in a once fired Case Pro'ed brass loaded to 1.200 OAL 175PF - taken from the DC Ammo area in the vendor tent) Anyone else I am missing that people have found to run well in EAA Limiteds until I can get a Dillon press (which in all honesty will be a while due to spacial and budget issues) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHA-LEE Posted February 20, 2011 Share Posted February 20, 2011 Iggy42> Honestly dude, if you are willing to pay for the ammo buy all of the individual components (Brass, Primer, Powder, and Bullet) and then work with a fellow local shooter to have them load your ammo. Anyone that has a Dillion 650 or 1050 press can easlily load a few thousand rounds in only a couple of hours. Ask around at the local matches for help with reloading. I would be shocked if you couldnt find someone local that would be willing to help you out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggy42 Posted February 20, 2011 Author Share Posted February 20, 2011 Iggy42> Honestly dude, if you are willing to pay for the ammo buy all of the individual components (Brass, Primer, Powder, and Bullet) and then work with a fellow local shooter to have them load your ammo. Anyone that has a Dillion 650 or 1050 press can easlily load a few thousand rounds in only a couple of hours. Ask around at the local matches for help with reloading. I would be shocked if you couldnt find someone local that would be willing to help you out. Yeah that is what I am working on (among other things) although kind of tough at the moment since its the "off-season" here and matches don't get going until March. I am trying to track down some people, but since I am new to all this haven't really gotten to know anyone yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maksim Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 So what is the best option for someone shooting limited 10? 40 S&W Stock mags and stock basepads (aluminum)? or buy the henning "reload" basepad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skydiver Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 So what is the best option for someone shooting limited 10? 40 S&W Stock mags and stock basepads (aluminum)? or buy the henning "reload" basepad? If no magwell, then stock basepads are good enough unless you shoot a lot indoors. If indoors, the plastic basepads crack after enough drops. If you are using a magwell, I recommend going with the H-141, although I'm actually running around with the H-520's. The H-141's a too long if I have more than three on my body. Shooting L-10, you basically have to be decked out like a production shooter and have at least 4 mag pouches, but have more leeway about putting mags in front of the hipbone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maksim Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 What about the H400 for the l10? 15 rounds is fine for capacity, especially here in NJ. Will those work with the magwell on a limited? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skydiver Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 They were too short for a quick reload at least with the Canyon Creek Magwell (and probably the Henning as well). Not enough sticking out past the magwell. (I never tried with the factory Limited magwell since I didn't own a limited at that time.) Also, if ever you have a stuck mag, there's very little to get a finger on to rip it out. (I know because I had a stuck mag during a plates match.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealio Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 The H400 works ok with the stock magwell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maksim Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 On par with the stock basepad that came with gun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealio Posted April 5, 2011 Share Posted April 5, 2011 On par with the stock basepad that came with gun? I don't use my stock Limited basepad because it has sharp edges and isn't very ergonomic. I use that H400 instead on my backup mag. I think the H400 basepad is a little shorter though, so you have to make sure the meat of your palm is on the pad when you seat it or your hand will hit the magwell. You can also grind/sand down the stock rubber'ish pads so they fit in the magwell. I did that for a while too. If you decide you want a stock Limited basepad I could sell you mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maksim Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Ordered the H550 5 pack... should work with stock springs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealio Posted April 14, 2011 Share Posted April 14, 2011 Ordered the H550 5 pack... should work with stock springs? which mags? New MecGar mags: yes any other: no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maksim Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 Stock Tanfoglio 40 caliber mags. my new mags have that notch/slider thingie in the middle for the follower to travel on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealio Posted April 15, 2011 Share Posted April 15, 2011 Stock Tanfoglio 40 caliber mags. my new mags have that notch/slider thingie in the middle for the follower to travel on. Well you will have to remove that "spacer" or the spring will get caught on it. Search for the many threads here on spacer removal, .40 mag feeding, etc.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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