Classification Upgrades From Memphis

[professor]

Match Results from the Memphis Charity Classic will result in a few shooters moving up in class.

Starting at the top, Mike [Dr. Dremel] Carmoney moves from M to GM. Not only did he complete the match as Master class winner, but he did it in 96.64% of the winning score posted by Matt Griffin. That alone should move him up. To seal the deal, Mike scored a 100% on Fluffy's Revenge #1. Those two scores added into his classifier record should raise his average from 93.17% to 97.29%, also a GM score. :cheers:

The Memphis Class A winner is Jess Christensen, with 88.05%. That's a Master Class score.

The Memphis Class B winner is a Junior shooter, Sam Carmoney. He's not only Mike's son but he shot the match at 82.10%, which is an A Class score.

The Memphis Class C winner is Bruce Scott, with 72.08%. That's a B Class score.

The Memphis Class D winner is Benny Murrah, with 59.70%. That's a C Class score.

When the dust settles in Sedro Woolley, will all 5 of these Class Winners move up a notch? We'll see.

[professor]

Here's the relevant section of the rulebook, on moving up in class as a function of finish in a Major Tournament.

"Your performance in larger matches and tournaments may also be used to help

establish classification. Placement in a major event with a score above your

assigned class percentage may result in your being promoted to a higher class,

even if your current average is lower. Winning first or second in class at an Area

Championship or Major Tournament AND shooting into the next higher class

may result in promotion (except to Grand Master); winning High Overall in an

Area Championship may promote you to Grand Master class. In addition, if you

score 95% or higher at a USPSA national championship, you will be immediately

moved to Grand Master class for that division."

Those finishing second in their class, and shooting into the next higher class are:

Chris Gober, A class shooter scoring Master level at 86.19%.

Craig Buckland, B class shooter scoring A Class level at 80.80%.

Edward Bowling, C class shooter scoring B Class level at 68.56%.

Tyler Galde, Junior and D class shooter scoring C Class level at 58.93%

:cheers: to all four shooters who may be moved up a Class, according to the rules.

[ChrisC]

if my calculations are correct ill be moved into B class as well with a 60.44 average.

I was impressed with the level of competition.. either revo division is full of sandbaggers or we had a tough match with good shooters

Edited November 9, 2010 by ChrisC

[ak47traxx]

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one moving up.

[professor]

if my calculations are correct ill be moved into B class as well with a 60.44 average.

I was impressed with the level of competition.. either revo division is full of sandbaggers or we had a tough match with good shooters

Congratulations to you, too.

[KyroWebs]

Go Mike! I hope you finally get the bump

[John Z Sr]

Congrats to all that moved, lets see if the powers that be agree, lets not forget Mr. Lentz at Nationals

[Carmoney]

Hard to say how it will all pencil out.

Too early to tell for sure. Some of the mentioned shooters (me included!) may have other classifiers that will post at the same time as the Memphis classifiers and possibly neutralize some of the impact.

So no congratulations or beer-chugging emoticons just yet, please.

[Bwana Six-Gun]

if my calculations are correct ill be moved into B class as well with a 60.44 average.

I was impressed with the level of competition.. either revo division is full of sandbaggers or we had a tough match with good shooters

We had a tough match full of good shooters.

Kudo's too those that finished high.

I sucked.

[Carmoney]

After careful calculation, I have managed to determine the luckiest shooter at the Memphis match........any guesses who that might be, Stanley??

Edited November 10, 2010 by Carmoney

[snertley]

Tyler has been sandbagging since last year in my eyes. He has been tanking the classifiers like we all do. Hopefully a congrats is do to more than a few shooters. I will drink more beer anyway, like results ever stopped me. By the way, Tyler schooled me on a couple of stages at area 3 and the MCC!

Edited November 10, 2010 by snertley

[professor]

After careful calculation, I have managed to determine the luckiest shooter at the Memphis match........any guesses who that might be, Stanley??

My luck was merely the result of the BRILLIANT marketing strategy of Mr. Sam Keen.

When they started handing out those raffle tickets, did you know that Sam would be interspersing shooters in their order-of-finish with randomly chosen picks?

I know it was a heck of a surprise when my ticket was called, and I got to be the second person to go to the prize table. [i'll post a picture of the gun when I get it.]

No longer will slow, old, half-blind revolver shooters [did I mention somewhat overweight? ] participate in this major tournament just for the comradery and love of the sport. The lowliest among us had a shot at #2 to the prize table, as well as #4, #6, #8, etc.

So next year, God-willing, I'll be back in Memphis clutching my little red ticket in hand, waiting with bated breath for the random drawing numbers to be called, secure in the knowledge that any prize off the table except for the First MIGHT be mine.

And everyone will be at that table no worse than their standing in shooting the match.

That has GOT to be incentive for a lot of shooters who would otherwise figure they don't have much of a chance to win anything.

And sharing wings and beer at Hooters Saturday night with Matt and Rich, who finished the match #1 and #2, was the capping to a GREAT day. :cheers:

[Carmoney]

The whole question of prize distribution is always a tricky one, isn't it?

I'm still trying to decide how I feel about the way the prizes were done at Memphis.

[Carmoney]

That has GOT to be incentive for a lot of shooters who would otherwise figure they don't have much of a chance to win anything.

I've been thinking about this.....and it occurs to me that while it is important to create incentive for the "average Joe" shooters, it's also important to maintain an incentive for those who have worked hard to reach the upper levels, y'know? For every person who is excited to receive a prize gun through a random process, there is a shooter high up on the list who can't help but feel a little disappointed.

I personally believe that the major prizes, or at least the majority of major prizes, should be reserved for those who performed the best in the competition.

But....as someone who has competed for 23 years, and also helped organize a few bigger matches along the way, I understand both sides of the issue, and I fully realize there is no easy answer.

[nashvillebill]

I think it's a good compromise. Anyone who is going to shooting matches to try and win a gun is not using there time wisely. If I chained myself to my work bench the same number of hours I spend preparing for and attending a match I could buy a much nicer gun than I have seen given away at any match I have been to. I see it as a perk,an extra, a show of appreciation from the match organizers. Competitors will come to good matches to see how they stack up against their peers, regardless of a prize table.

[Bubber]

My prize is the recognition of a good performance. I like going through the annoucnement at the ceremoney and annouce what place I have achieved. I ussually win a gun at the IRC but as Bill notes It would have been cheaper for me to use the money for the trip , lodging, and entry fee to buy the gun with some left over. Just my thoughts. MCC was a good compromise. Later rdd

[Bones]

I went to see Cliff.

Craig

[10mmdave]

I did not attend this match (really wish I could have but $$$ only go so far)

But I hope those that paid to attend did know that the prize distribution changed

from the past year.

The shoot is billed as a Revo only match with prizes only going to the Revo shooters,

giving out half the prizes by a lottery system makes the shoot become more of a fun

shoot than an actual competition (imnsho)

My math may be wrong, but looking at the stats, you had 67/68 shooters,

that means the 32nd/33rd placed shooter got to pick LAST ! or close to it.

I have to agree with Mike on this one, what incentive does it give the “upper level”

shooters to attend this match ?

Are not prizes supposed to reward a shooter for excellence, not for just showing up ?

Take high value prizes out of the mix, make it a plaque only shoot with 1st thru 3rd-5th,

or whatever place you want in all classes and donate all the cash to the cause.

If vendors wants to donate high value item’s to the match then raffle them off to the shooters.

Lower the entry price accordingly, the plaque and the good deed you all did should be

reward enough.

I am sorry this came up, I’m sure the folks that ran the shoot thought “hey..I have a great idea”

but maybe in hind sight they think a little different (but then again, maybe not).

You all still did a great thing for a great cause, we shouldn’t forget that part.

Congrats to all that participated, I’m sure the folks at the LeBohneur Children's Hospital

are gratful for the money donated.

[moverfive]

Without going into my opinions on the topic of random draw tables - Sam did announce in the original match announcement as to how the prize table would be handled.

Because Sam isn't available at the moment to comment - I will repeat some of the highlights I took away in our original conversations when this match began. Sam's long term vision for this match was to create a legitimate opportunity for everyone to compete with a revolver in a match similar to a nationals. Meaning when USPSA's nationals combines revolver with limited, many talented revolver shooters (or the potential thereof) will shoot limited obviously. Therefore, he wanted the MCC to provide that opportunity for everyone to compete with a revolver in order to see/show the level of talent out there in the division......and thus have a de facto revolver nationals, similar to what single stack has.

Again, that was his long-term vision when he created this match. However, the purpose of this match today is to provide a fun and competitive revolver match in order to raise money for a deserving charity....and continue to grow it in order to meet Sam's long-term vision.

As for the prize table and how it was distributed.....all I can tell you that we do everything possible to ensure every dime goes to LeBohneur, and the prize table is no exception. That is why we didn't even have enough for everyone to walk away with something - the prize table was all based on sponsors and donations, and I think many know how tough that area is these days. Should the distribution format have been based 100% on performance - throw your comments on that topic to Sam directly and he can modify if necessary next year. I think that his idea for the alternating random draw format was an attempt to allow everyone a shot at what was available on the prize table.

I just wanted to make those comments as this match is different from any match I have been associated with - we are trying to make a large profit off the shooters! :-) So the volume and quality of the prize table really is a distant second to creating a fun, challenging match so we can make a large donation to a deserving charity. And if things continue to go well, revolver division will also have a premier match where ALL revolver shooters can compete against each other.

[moverfive]

.....something else I wanted to throw out there that makes this match so different from others: so many of the RO's working the match didn't even shoot. They drove for hours just to RO (some getting up 2AM - 3AM to drive in by 7AM) and then driving home that same evening as soon as the match was over.

How many matches have you ever heard where so many RO's drove 6 - 7 hours in a single day JUST TO RO?

And then you combine that fact with how many folks came from all points of the country to shoot the match. There is definitely a great opportunity for this match to become something even more special.

[Bass Ackwardz]

As one of the little people that wish they could shoot a whole lot better, I feel I have to say that winning a new shooters bag off the prize table was a really great end to an even better weekend. The match was great and I met phenomenal people. Those are the things I care about when deciding to shoot a match. Now that being said, I have no illusions of winning big prizes as a C class shooter. I shoot for fun. But every once in a while its nice to get a little something back for all the money I spend traveling to the match, hotel, food, and match fees. Without the little guys, there wouldnt be matches for all the master and grand master revolver shooters to shoot. I agree with being rewarded for skill and performance, it needs to happen. But to keep all the lower classed guys coming, they usually need just the chance to win something big every once in a great while. As usual, this is my .02 on the matter and like everything else, take it how you like.

Bass

[professor]

... Sam's long term vision for this match was to create a legitimate opportunity for everyone to compete with a revolver in a match similar to a nationals. Meaning when USPSA's nationals combines revolver with limited, many talented revolver shooters (or the potential thereof) will shoot limited obviously. Therefore, he wanted the MCC to provide that opportunity for everyone to compete with a revolver in order to see/show the level of talent out there in the division......and thus have a de facto revolver nationals, similar to what single stack has.

Again, that was his long-term vision when he created this match. However, the purpose of this match today is to provide a fun and competitive revolver match in order to raise money for a deserving charity....and continue to grow it in order to meet Sam's long-term vision.

As for the prize table and how it was distributed.....all I can tell you that we do everything possible to ensure every dime goes to LeBohneur, and the prize table is no exception. That is why we didn't even have enough for everyone to walk away with something - the prize table was all based on sponsors and donations, and I think many know how tough that area is these days. Should the distribution format have been based 100% on performance - throw your comments on that topic to Sam directly and he can modify if necessary next year. I think that his idea for the alternating random draw format was an attempt to allow everyone a shot at what was available on the prize table.

I just wanted to make those comments as this match is different from any match I have been associated with - we are trying to make a large profit off the shooters! :-) So the volume and quality of the prize table really is a distant second to creating a fun, challenging match so we can make a large donation to a deserving charity. And if things continue to go well, revolver division will also have a premier match where ALL revolver shooters can compete against each other.

I planned on attending this match (1) to support the Revolver division, (2) to shoot with a whole bunch of other revolver shooters, (3) to support Sam's idea of morphing this match into a legitimate National Revolver Championship on a par with the Single Stack Nationals, (4) to support a worthy, and appreciative, charity. Since I usually finish in the middle of the pack, the idea of getting to the prize table is way down the list of incentives... to the point that I didn't pay attention as to how the prizes were to be distributed this year. It was a total surprise to learn first hand of the random drawings.

Furthermore, I've got no illusion that the current administration of USPSA is interested in putting on a standalone revolver nationals like the Single Stack. We are apparently the 'illegitimate kid' division to them, not even worthy of the support of the association in sponsoring a Revolver team at International Competitions.

Well, this year the Memphis Charity Classic drew three times the number of revolver shooters who participated in the official Nationals. Last year, Memphis drew better than twice as many as the Nats. And the 2010 attendance of M and GM shooters has been almost the same at both matches [Nats - 12, Memphis - 11]. So the Memphis match is drawing an extraordinary number of A through U shooters... nearly SIX TIMES as many at Memphis vs Nationals for 2010. [57 vs 11].

Let's face it. If the revolver division is going to grow to the point of representing a significant division, it will do so by developing and encouraging new shooters and accomplished shooters who would normally compete in other divisions at the Nationals. That happens at events like Memphis, because you have a strong contingent of top shooters, and a multitude of lower classification shooters who get to compete with them shoulder to shoulder.

And using the prize distribution scheme to encourage attendance by the A through D class shooters is the way to build up attendance, and leads to increasing people in the upper ranks.

my .02

[Lentz]

At least the Memphis match had a prize table. Area 7 did not have one.

[John Z Sr]

I went to see Cliff.

Craig

Good answer !!!! We need a chapter of the OTIS fan club up North, you want to take the helm Bones?

[10mmdave]

At least the Memphis match had a prize table. Area 7 did not have one.

Area 7 was advertised as a plaque only match, you knew what you were getting into from the begining.

As posted on the web site for this match, and on the pdf application form;

"The “Memphis Charity Challenge” will benefit the Le Bonheur Children's Hospital. All proceeds from the

match will go directly to Le Bonheur Children's Hospital. (After match Production costs).

This will be a Prize table match, walked in order of finish.

We will be recognizing 1 division: Revolver as per the USPSA rules for Revolver division.

Trophies will be given out for : Overall Match winner, Class winners, High Lady, High Jr., High Sr.,

High SSR., High “Speed loader”. Law, Mil."

I'm sure every dime goes to the cause and I applaud all those self-less souls that worked and spent their

hard earned money to make this match what it is.

But I have to wonder...when the lower classed folks get better, will they still like the random prize selection

I'm out on this subject, I don't want to continue to taint the great job that all involved have done.

Please, in the future, make sure all the players know what they're getting into before they show up.