M&P & Apex Comp kit Review, Video, hatcam and more

[Aristotle]

So I gave up my ultimate game cheating Open gun and made my return to Production division this weekend with my new M&P pro. Thus far, I think I have less than 500 rounds through the gun, and I'd have to say it wasn't an easy return nor transition after shooting 1911's exclusively for the past almost 3 years. I've had a CZ or two, a Glock and I shoot my carry guns, but nothing near the time or effort I would put towards an actual game gun.

After only a few weeks of getting ramped up for dry fire practice... my hands hurt. I don't know what it is. I'm shooting minor power factor, but there's just so much different hand manipulation when shooting a plastic gun. And the ergo's of the gun, although I felt feels really good in my hands, where nothing like my SVI, which I have grown accustomed to. The 2011 felt so natural in my hand, I could fall a sleep with it.

I did or maybe still have a tendacy to pull shots to the left, and low. I found out that, although the small grip felt GREAT in my hands, it didn't point the gun naturally to POA. So contrary to what my hands said, I had to chose the grip that reliably put shots to my POA, and after much experimenting, the grip that did that for me 80% of the time, was the medium grip. Another thing I had experimented with, was grip tape. I never really liked grip tape, because it did tear up my hands a bit, especially with the heavy dry fire I plan on doing. And after some experimenting, I am going to shoot the gun sans grip tape, and sans stippling. The ergo's are so good, I don't think I need them. I'm also not getting the best draw grabs right now since the gun is new to me, and the grip tape makes it harder to adjust your grip. So for now, I'll do without any grip enhancing techniques. I shot the entire match almost in the rain, and I didn't have any issues with it slipping with the stock stippling.

I also had to alter my trigger placement on the trigger itself. There is a worlds difference between a single action, and a striker fired pistol. And the hundreds of hours of practice was not easy to revert. So with every shot, I felt like I had to really focus and remember and literately program myself to remember a number of things like, grip pressure, trigger placement and even arm lock out. The ergo's are also dramatically different. With my Open gun, I used the tip of my trigger finger. With the M&P, I shoot it like I would my revolver, and place the trigger right on the first knuckle with a more "rolling" trigger squeeze. It was definitely different, especially when I had to "hit the gas" with my transition and splits.

It was also foreign to me, having to draw from a kydex holster, and reaching back, especially for the 3 and 4th mag, way behind my hip bone.

Nothing is intuitive yet, I struggled with shooting the gun, and counting to 10 coordinating a COF, but I think I'll stick with it and see where it takes me. I needed to review my fundamentals and really get back down to brass tacks so I could advance as a shooter, and I think shooting production will do that for me.

Stay tuned...

Edited September 27, 2010 by Aristotle

[Aristotle]

As far as gear was concerned, I do have a trick to pass on, maybe it's old news, maybe not. But what I learned is with regards to CR speed pouches, if you wanted to make the M&P mags work, you can use the "CZ" CR speed inserts, and file it down to accept and work with the M&P magazines. I can't give you exact measurements, but it does work.

I also swapped all of my magazine base pads for compact base pads, and they worked out great.

And as far as holsters go, I didn't really like the Bladetech holster. So I modified my Uncle Mikes 1911 holster to fit my M&P and I really like it. The kydex the use on the Uncle Mikes is a harder, and feels a lot faster to me than the kydex they use on the Bladetech holsters. All I did was move one of the tension screws up, and used spacers (cut down ink pens) to expand the holster a bit, and it worked out great. I'll snap some pictures in a bit...

[DWFAN]

Good stuff Ari..

You can also use a washer or the soft side of some velcro on the STI standard spacer for the CR Speed pouches to work with M&P.

[Aristotle]

Here are some pictures of the modifications I made to my holster, as well as the CR speed inserts.

Hi DW,

I've tried the spacer and nut method, that's what I use for my SSTK mags, but with the M&P, there will be a little bit of slop side to side, which is why I like the CZ spacers, it has that little bit on the side to keep the magazine stable.

[mwx40x40]

Here are some pictures of the modifications I made to my holster, as well as the CR speed inserts.

Hi DW,

I've tried the spacer and nut method, that's what I use for my SSTK mags, but with the M&P, there will be a little bit of slop side to side, which is why I like the CZ spacers, it has that little bit on the side to keep the magazine stable.

I friend of mine made a very similar mod to an UM holster for 1911 to accept an EAA 9mm. It works very well.

[mjoy64]

I liked the way the small insert felt in my hands but it tended to position my finger to far forward and I tended to get more into the trigger than I wanted. The medium insert seemed to more naturally let me get the position I wanted for pulling the trigger.

Good luck!

[Cold Absolute Zero]

I really enjoy shooting production. I feel that the minor scoring and limited capacity really gives a fun test of accuracy and stage planning.

What are your thoughts on the APEX comp trigger kit? How great is the difference or improvement in the weight/ pre-travel / reset / feel / etc from stock? Did you have any trouble with the grip angle index? I've read on other threads that they are very similar if not identical (1911 vs. M&P)

CAZ

[Aristotle]

What are your thoughts on the APEX comp trigger kit? How great is the difference or improvement in the weight/ pre-travel / reset / feel / etc from stock? Did you have any trouble with the grip angle index? I've read on other threads that they are very similar if not identical (1911 vs. M&P)

CAZ

The kit provides a considerable difference from stock. The weight of trigger pull went from a 6.5lb pull to a 2.7lb trigger pull weight. For the price paid, and the work involved, it's a considerable benefit to enhanced trigger pull. Reset is rather light, but doesn't bother me in the least as I don't ride the reset anyhow.

In regards to the grip angle, I'd say it's a pretty natural having shot a 1911 type gun for the past few years. But what is different is the ergonomics and grip and it's affect on my finger placement on the trigger. In order to get a straight trigger pull, I am having to place more of my finger inside the trigger.

The one thing I'd have to say is rather odd is getting over sweeping the thumb safety, but again, it's more of a retraining issue.

I'm excited to get into production and I think it's a lot of fun myself. I'm looking forward to getting acquainted with the gun so the manipulations are a lot more intuitive. Right now, I feel like I am spending a lot of time, constantly walking myself through everything from grip to trigger pull, and less about stage break down and execution and speed.

[Cold Absolute Zero]

The kit provides a considerable difference from stock. The weight of trigger pull went from a 6.5lb pull to a 2.7lb trigger pull weight. For the price paid, and the work involved, it's a considerable benefit to enhanced trigger pull. Reset is rather light, but doesn't bother me in the least as I don't ride the reset anyhow.

In regards to the grip angle, I'd say it's a pretty natural having shot a 1911 type gun for the past few years. But what is different is the ergonomics and grip and it's affect on my finger placement on the trigger. In order to get a straight trigger pull, I am having to place more of my finger inside the trigger.

The one thing I'd have to say is rather odd is getting over sweeping the thumb safety, but again, it's more of a retraining issue.

I'm excited to get into production and I think it's a lot of fun myself. I'm looking forward to getting acquainted with the gun so the manipulations are a lot more intuitive. Right now, I feel like I am spending a lot of time, constantly walking myself through everything from grip to trigger pull, and less about stage break down and execution and speed.

Thanks for the review, I really appreciate it. I've shot Glocks exclusively for the last 4 years but the M&P platform definitely has my interest peaked. I really like how well the CT lasers integrate with the pistol, how the grip angle is much more consistent with many other platforms on the market (easing transitions between pistols) and I like the concept of their manual safety (though I've never tried it). I'm glad to hear all the good reviews on the performance of the APEX parts from actual shooters.

On the sweeping the thumb safety topic. Have you tried the M&P models with the thumb safeties? Are they similar enough in feel and placement to mimic the 1911 safety you are use to? BTW I enjoyed your production video, looked like some good COFs, I couldn't tell that you were fighting the gun

CAZ