2012 Adams Arms Ozark 3-Gun Match Information

[assaulter]

FWIW I just went to your website. I clicked on the registration link and it was available. No back door action here. Yeah that's right, I said it.

[assaulter]

Double tap.

Edited March 16, 2012 by assaulter

[MistyDesha]

That registration was denied, please wait until 8pm. Thanks.

[assaulter]

I didn't register, I'm just saying its there for everyone.

[Jesse Tischauser]

FWIW I just went to your website. I clicked on the registration link and it was available. No back door action here. Yeah that's right, I said it.

Lol!

[Big Bear]

I would like to thank everyone for being patient with us. Misty has worked tirelessly on this in my absence. I look forward to seeing everyone again this year.

To clarify;

There will be cash payouts on every stage. I haven't worked out all the details to be fair for everyone. When I have there will be an addendum to the rules to explain everything.

Scoring will be accomplished by two separate computers and programs simultaneously.

There will be a new division this year, with the hope and belief that it may draw new competitors. "Service Stock" will replace one of the current divisions. More to follow tonight.

Thanks again to everyone,

I look forward to seeing you at the range.

[Big Bear]

Here is the rule update for the new division. I'm open to suggestions but will post these as the rules for now.

6.3 Service Stock Division

* This division wascreated for the purpose of promoting the competition of 3-Gun toward newshooters with stock equipment.

6.3.1 Handgun – Service Stock Division

6.3.1.1 Internal modificationsare allowed providing they do not alter the original factory configuration ofthe handgun.

6.3.1.2 Firearms with custom orfactory installed magazine well funnels, electronic sights, optical sights,extended sights, compensators or barrel porting are NOT allowed in thisDivision.

6.3.1.3 Magazines used shall not utilize magazine extensions or be longer than that provided by the manufacturer.

6.3.1.4 Must be a center fire cartridge of 9x19 lugeror larger.

6.3.2 Rifle – Service Stock Division

6.3.2.1 Barrel length shall notbe changed for the duration of the match.

6.3.2.2 Internal modificationsare allowed providing the modifications do not alter the original factoryconfiguration of the rifle

6.3.2.3 Rifles may be equippedwith mechanical sights or 1x optics only. Only one sighting system may be used.Back-up Iron Sights (BUIS) may be on the gun but must remain folded. In theevent the electronic sight goes down the RO must be notified before the stagestarts. At this time the electronic sight must be removed for the remainder ofthe match and the BUIS can be used. Fixed front sight must be on the rifle asoriginally designed.

6.3.2.4 Rifle supportingdevices (i.e. bipods, etc.) are not allowed in this Division.

6.3.2.5 Comps are not allowed. Flash hiders may be used but must be originalmanufacturer equipment, ie birdcage, three prong, ect.

6.3.2.6 Rifle will be .223Remington (5.56 NATO) or larger cartridge size.

6.3.2.7 Free float forearms arenot allowed. Original design configuration is encouraged.

6.3.3 Shotgun – Service Stock Division

6.3.3.1 Only pump shotguns areallowed in Service Stock Division. Barrel length may not be changed for theduration of the match.

6.3.3.2 Internal modificationsare allowed providing the modifications do not alter the original factoryconfiguration of the shotgun.

6.3.3.3 No electronic oroptical sights are allowed on shotguns in this Division.

6.3.3.4 No shotgun supportingdevices (i.e. bipods, etc.) are allowed in this Division.

6.3.3.5 No compensators orporting on barrels allowed in this Division.

6.3.3.6 Shotguns maystart a stage with a maximum of nine (9) rounds in the gun but magazinecapacity will not be limited. Nine round maximum is tube loaded to nine withempty chamber or tube loaded to eight with loaded chamber.

6.3.3.7 No shotgun speedloaders are allowed in this Division.

[Lead-Head]

Service Stock sounds pretty cool. Production divison for 3-gun. Peaks my interest and makes this match even more interesting.

Would be a good entry divison for new shooters.

Edited March 16, 2012 by Lead-Head

[usp45ss]

So is the "service stock" division going to replace limited?

I would caution against no free float forends or comps. It seems a lot of guys are now running both comps and free float forends on duty and tactical guns. A quick visit to any of my local ranges shows most guys have a railed forend of some kind on their rifle. Most are free floating. A quick review of AR15.com picture threads (not that this is representative of the general shooting public) shows the popularity of comps in one form or another. A lot of them have some kind of Surefire, Battlecomp, etc. That one will be very difficult to police as well. Remember the old AWB days. A lot of places had "comps" that looked a whole lot like an a2 flash hider.

As far as handgun, my factory STI Eagle didn't come with a magwell but it had a 140mm mag. I could have ordered it with a 170mm mag if I wanted. Per your rules, that looks fine.

I commend you trying to bring in new shooters, but I only see vague yet more restrictive rules as a hindrance.

I know I shot my first 3 gun match ever with the only AR that I owned at the time. It was a Rock River with a free floating YHM railed forend and an Eotech. I even took my a2 off the gun and put a $30 Miculek comp on there.

[Big Bear]

So is the "service stock" division going to replace limited?

I would caution against no free float forends or comps. It seems a lot of guys are now running both comps and free float forends on duty and tactical guns. A quick visit to any of my local ranges shows most guys have a railed forend of some kind on their rifle. Most are free floating. A quick review of AR15.com picture threads (not that this is representative of the general shooting public) shows the popularity of comps in one form or another. A lot of them have some kind of Surefire, Battlecomp, etc. That one will be very difficult to police as well. Remember the old AWB days. A lot of places had "comps" that looked a whole lot like an a2 flash hider.

As far as handgun, my factory STI Eagle didn't come with a magwell but it had a 140mm mag. I could have ordered it with a 170mm mag if I wanted. Per your rules, that looks fine.

I commend you trying to bring in new shooters, but I only see vague yet more restrictive rules as a hindrance.

I know I shot my first 3 gun match ever with the only AR that I owned at the time. It was a Rock River with a free floating YHM railed forend and an Eotech. I even took my a2 off the gun and put a $30 Miculek comp on there.

All very good thoughts. I may have to look at making them more specific. Heres the low down. I have been asked every year, "how competitive would I be if I brought out my DPMS AR, G17, and 870?". I tell them as honest as I can, "skill will outweigh equipment, but if you really want to be competitive you may want to consider..............." So this year I decided to make a Stock class and replace Tactical Irons. TI had 11 shooters last year and half of them would fit into this division. So as I want to eliminate the equipment race in this division I may have to revise the rules to eliminate 140-170 mags. Maybe stating "NO PROTRUDING MAGS". What say you??

[Big Bear]

So is the "service stock" division going to replace limited?

I would caution against no free float forends or comps. It seems a lot of guys are now running both comps and free float forends on duty and tactical guns. A quick visit to any of my local ranges shows most guys have a railed forend of some kind on their rifle. Most are free floating. A quick review of AR15.com picture threads (not that this is representative of the general shooting public) shows the popularity of comps in one form or another. A lot of them have some kind of Surefire, Battlecomp, etc. That one will be very difficult to police as well. Remember the old AWB days. A lot of places had "comps" that looked a whole lot like an a2 flash hider.

As far as handgun, my factory STI Eagle didn't come with a magwell but it had a 140mm mag. I could have ordered it with a 170mm mag if I wanted. Per your rules, that looks fine.

I commend you trying to bring in new shooters, but I only see vague yet more restrictive rules as a hindrance.

I know I shot my first 3 gun match ever with the only AR that I owned at the time. It was a Rock River with a free floating YHM railed forend and an Eotech. I even took my a2 off the gun and put a $30 Miculek comp on there.

All very good thoughts. I may have to look at making them more specific. Heres the low down. I have been asked every year, "how competitive would I be if I brought out my DPMS AR, G17, and 870?". I tell them as honest as I can, "skill will outweigh equipment, but if you really want to be competitive you may want to consider..............." So this year I decided to make a Stock class and replace Tactical Irons. TI had 11 shooters last year and half of them would fit into this division. So as I want to eliminate the equipment race in this division I may have to revise the rules to eliminate 140-170 mags. Maybe stating "NO PROTRUDING MAGS". What say you??

To help everyone understand my thought process. I was also thinking about inviting military teams that are using rack grade weapons from all services.

[J.Schmitt]

So is the "service stock" division going to replace limited?

I would caution against no free float forends or comps. It seems a lot of guys are now running both comps and free float forends on duty and tactical guns. A quick visit to any of my local ranges shows most guys have a railed forend of some kind on their rifle. Most are free floating. A quick review of AR15.com picture threads (not that this is representative of the general shooting public) shows the popularity of comps in one form or another. A lot of them have some kind of Surefire, Battlecomp, etc. That one will be very difficult to police as well. Remember the old AWB days. A lot of places had "comps" that looked a whole lot like an a2 flash hider.

As far as handgun, my factory STI Eagle didn't come with a magwell but it had a 140mm mag. I could have ordered it with a 170mm mag if I wanted. Per your rules, that looks fine.

I commend you trying to bring in new shooters, but I only see vague yet more restrictive rules as a hindrance.

I know I shot my first 3 gun match ever with the only AR that I owned at the time. It was a Rock River with a free floating YHM railed forend and an Eotech. I even took my a2 off the gun and put a $30 Miculek comp on there.

All very good thoughts. I may have to look at making them more specific. Heres the low down. I have been asked every year, "how competitive would I be if I brought out my DPMS AR, G17, and 870?". I tell them as honest as I can, "skill will outweigh equipment, but if you really want to be competitive you may want to consider..............." So this year I decided to make a Stock class and replace Tactical Irons. TI had 11 shooters last year and half of them would fit into this division. So as I want to eliminate the equipment race in this division I may have to revise the rules to eliminate 140-170 mags. Maybe stating "NO PROTRUDING MAGS". What say you??

To help everyone understand my thought process. I was also thinking about inviting military teams that are using rack grade weapons from all services.

I believe Limited had well over 20 shooters possibly close to 30. Heavy Metal was low with only about 10 shooters.

[J.Schmitt]

Are you honestly saying that while waiting all this time to sign up, and coming within hours of sign in you are going to throw out this major change in the rule system. I am very disappointed. Hours before sign up is not the time to make a sweeping change. Three months ago maybe, when I could have planned on another match to attend. Utter disappointment. Take someone like me and have them go buy a bunch of new equipment to compete in a new division. I'm not set up for that. Replace a free float with a junk system, buy new parts for a pump gun when I already have a working Benelli M1, Buy new mags for my production CZ pistol. I am steaming here.

Jay

[usp45ss]

All very good thoughts. I may have to look at making them more specific. Heres the low down. I have been asked every year, "how competitive would I be if I brought out my DPMS AR, G17, and 870?". I tell them as honest as I can, "skill will outweigh equipment, but if you really want to be competitive you may want to consider..............." So this year I decided to make a Stock class and replace Tactical Irons. TI had 11 shooters last year and half of them would fit into this division. So as I want to eliminate the equipment race in this division I may have to revise the rules to eliminate 140-170 mags. Maybe stating "NO PROTRUDING MAGS". What say you??

That's a start.

We had 30 shooters in irons last year. Not sure about 2010. I think you got 11 from way back in 2009. Not sure about the rules back in 2009, but I'd probably place that bump on allowing 1x optics.

I'm all for getting some service guys to shoot the match. I'm not all up on the service weapons as I used to be but don't some m4's use free float forends? Don't DMR rifles have them?

[assaulter]

Maybe a separate "Amatuer" division would be better. Don't replace anything, but lump all the new(er) shooters into this class at their request. Allow irons, optics, 1x's, pumps, autos. Kind of a run what you brung within reason. Anyone signing up that is known to have competed at other major matches could be outed at the prized table and shamed! I'm just thinking outloud here. Replacing irons seems a bit much.

[Big Bear]

Ok, I'm reasonable, I'll save that change and decide where and how to implement later. For now the 2011 rules and divisions will stand. And no worries I won't eliminate any divisions this year. But I do plan to add this division. It's for the betterment and growth of the sport and will draw several new shooters.

[Birdman821]

Are you honestly saying that while waiting all this time to sign up, and coming within hours of sign in you are going to throw out this major change in the rule system. I am very disappointed. Hours before sign up is not the time to make a sweeping change. Three months ago maybe, when I could have planned on another match to attend. Utter disappointment. Take someone like me and have them go buy a bunch of new equipment to compete in a new division. I'm not set up for that. Replace a free float with a junk system, buy new parts for a pump gun when I already have a working Benelli M1, Buy new mags for my production CZ pistol. I am steaming here.

Jay

i'm with Jay on this one! I just registered online and then came in here to read what was going on, only to find that my division (the division I am registered for) is no longer happening??? Why in the world would you replace Tac Irons with another class!?!? Wasn't it the 2nd largest class to Tac Optics last year? If you're trying to get new shooters out to the match, just add it as another division. There is no reason to replace one with another, since it would only add a little more paperwork to make the addition, while replacing them causes everyone to go out and buy new gear. And with Ozark being apart of 3GN, doesn't there have to be a Tac Irons class?

Sorry for the rant, but I think this is a very poor decision. That being said, I have no doubt that you guys will do the right thing for everyone!

[Outsydlooknin75]

Some factory pump guns are coming with ported barrels.

Sent from my PG06100 using Tapatalk

[J.Schmitt]

Ok, I'm reasonable, I'll save that change and decide where and how to implement later. For now the 2011 rules and divisions will stand. And no worries I won't eliminate any divisions this year. But I do plan to add this division. It's for the betterment and growth of the sport and will draw several new shooters.

Kirk, I think this is a wise choice. It has been stated on this forum many times. New shooters will come and shoot the match with what they have. They will have fun. They will be back. I shot my first match, "The DPMS Tri Gun", with a Non free float AR, a Benelli pump with no extension, no caddies, and a Beretta handgun with my duty belt, level 3 holster and covered mags. It was the best ever. I CAME BACK FOR MORE. I upgraded over the years.

I believe all new shooters will upgrade their equipment constantly. It is in the DNA of those like minded individuals. I see it at the local level every match. I would imagine this is an agreed upon "theory".

And just like adding optics to the Limited class, a few "ringers" will step into this standard class an the guy with the least skill will still be at the bottom. No one can make someone else feel adequate with their performance. It has to come from inside. I see it with cops showing up at USPSA matches and getting it handed to them by the old man in suspenders with a cane. They can't cope with it and don't come back, or they go out and learn and get good.

Now I can almost stomach shooting a Pump in limited if I didn't like my shotgun so much. If it were the only change I would have made due. I love the Ozarks match. I look forward to it. Hell, I've been chomping at the bit all day to sign up.

Jay

[RiggerJJ]

So is the "service stock" division going to replace limited?

I would caution against no free float forends or comps. It seems a lot of guys are now running both comps and free float forends on duty and tactical guns. A quick visit to any of my local ranges shows most guys have a railed forend of some kind on their rifle. Most are free floating. A quick review of AR15.com picture threads (not that this is representative of the general shooting public) shows the popularity of comps in one form or another. A lot of them have some kind of Surefire, Battlecomp, etc. That one will be very difficult to police as well. Remember the old AWB days. A lot of places had "comps" that looked a whole lot like an a2 flash hider.

As far as handgun, my factory STI Eagle didn't come with a magwell but it had a 140mm mag. I could have ordered it with a 170mm mag if I wanted. Per your rules, that looks fine.

I commend you trying to bring in new shooters, but I only see vague yet more restrictive rules as a hindrance.

I know I shot my first 3 gun match ever with the only AR that I owned at the time. It was a Rock River with a free floating YHM railed forend and an Eotech. I even took my a2 off the gun and put a $30 Miculek comp on there.

All very good thoughts. I may have to look at making them more specific. Heres the low down. I have been asked every year, "how competitive would I be if I brought out my DPMS AR, G17, and 870?". I tell them as honest as I can, "skill will outweigh equipment, but if you really want to be competitive you may want to consider..............." So this year I decided to make a Stock class and replace Tactical Irons. TI had 11 shooters last year and half of them would fit into this division. So as I want to eliminate the equipment race in this division I may have to revise the rules to eliminate 140-170 mags. Maybe stating "NO PROTRUDING MAGS". What say you??

To help everyone understand my thought process. I was also thinking about inviting military teams that are using rack grade weapons from all services.

I believe Limited had well over 20 shooters possibly close to 30. Heavy Metal was low with only about 10 shooters.

I just counted on the score sheets from last year, there were;

too many shooters Tac Scope to count...

30 shooters in Tac Irons

24 Shooters in Open

12 Shooters in HeMan Iron

8 Shooters in heavy tac

I'm with Jay on this one too Kirk, Don't change the rules at this point. What you could do that may work is let those guys shoot their rack-grade equipment in their own little mini-division. Just see how it goes, ya know? Then the hard-cores in Tac Irons don't get put out to dry...

Or you could just eliminate heavy tac... it was the smallest...

jj

[MistyDesha]

Sorry, I glossed over this post until now. A sponsored shooter may register the same way as a paid shooter. On the website there are three buttons, one for paid shooter, sponsored shooter, and range officer.

If a shooter is going to use a sponsored slot, do they need to go through the same online process or is there another route you want them to go?

[Lead-Head]

Oh man. I was thinking that TI would still be a recognized divison. I am not for replacing TI with a new divison. Particularly when I am seeing more TI shooters at local matches than any other divison lately.

TI had a good showing at most major matches last year that I shot.

[Big Bear]

And that's why we have this forum, to help guys like me with the important stuff. :-)

As stated, the 2011 rules will apply and be change to reflect that on the website. Thanks for the feedback.

[MistyDesha]

Have gotten some feedback that the return shooter code is not working, the code is AAO2012, for Adams Arms Ozark 2012. I think some are putting in a zero where the O should be. Rest assured the code will still be honored.

[cold]

What is the junior entry fee? If there is one? Trying to figure out how much to send etc.