Safety Margin for n310

[AriM]

hey what are your opinions on VV n310.....is the margin too small to make this a safe powder in an unsupported (or should I say a chamber which lacks FULL case support) chamber?? the difference between safe and over MAX is a few tenths of a grain....that kind of scares the crap out of me, but I would really like to try this powder.....can someone give me some data and safety margins for n310, using a 200 SWC (black bullet) in .45AUTO

thanks!!!

Edited December 25, 2009 by AriM

[DougCarden]

Ari,

VV310 is a linear progression powder, unlike, let's say CLAYS. They have roughly the same burn rate. The Bad thing about CLAYS is that when you approach the high end and where you need to stop it doesnt let you know soon enough. It goes along and then the spike hits, period. I learned this with 200gr bullets and Clays in .40 major.

310, on the other hand, doesn't spike like CLAYS, and you can start to see pressure signs well before you need to back off.

I sure wouldnt worry too much about the .45 case with 310. I know a good load for the 200swc and 310 is 4.5-4.7gr 310 at 1.250 or so. It is soft and a tack driver. Wilson used to test his .45s with that load as well. I don't know if that is still the case, but it is a good load if you need one to start.

Have fun, and 310 is my favorited powder!

DougC

[bubbadoc]

VV N310 is an absolutely great powder for the 45. Like Doug mentions, the old Wilson load is supposedly 4.5 gr of 310 behind a 200 gr Lasercast bullet. I tend to load even a little lighter (4.3-4.4) for an even lighter accurate plinker round for the whole family.

Take it easy and work up to the max load applies to any round/ gun combo. I think in the end though you will find 310, along with all of the VV powders to be very good and forgiving.

[AriM]

Yeah I was reading TGO's loading data....and he uses 310 in almost all of his guns...from 9 to 45.....at first I thought it was an expensive powder.....$98 for 4 pounds....but then I did the math....I may be able to get a different powder for less (American Select is $96 for 8 pounds)......but after you do the math....and compare charge weights for equal velocities....the VV310 still works out to about 1.2 cents a load....the American Select is WAY cheaper, but you need 5.7 grains to make Major....and even then, we are talking about less than half a cent difference per round.....it's easy to get caught up in the big numbers, and fail to see the small....I wish I would have tried a can of 310 on this hazmat order....now I have to burn through another 10,000 primers and 8 pounds of American Select, before I order again.....DOH!!!!!!

Really anxious to try 310....I hear it's super consistent, and meters very well....can anyone tell me what it's size and shape are?? I would really like to find a small ball powder that meters well, that is reasonable in price, makes MAJOR and has a high safety margin....

asking too much?

I gave up on 231 b/c you can never get it....

[TISCHLJ]

I was able to purchase a large quantity of 310 a few years ago on the way cheap.

I've used it for a long time, always successfully in .45 and .40 major.

This should get you close . . .

4.5 grains with 200gr Montana Gold JFP at 1.215 OAL for .45acp w fed LP- non ramped barrel.

4.5 grains with 180gr Montana Gold JHP at 1.210 OAL for .40 w WSR

Same from 1911 5 inch barrels

Size of this powder is small, and it meters well. I'm using a Dillon 650.

A super clean burn contributes to a pistol that stays clean.

I did not have good success with the black bullet and this powder. This powder burns hot, and I suppose combined with the moly coat on the bullet caused smoking and horrendous barrel residue . . . .

Hope this helps

[Duane Thomas]

I don't like N310 for heavy bullet (i.e. 147-grain) loads in 9mm. And I say that as someone who used to run that combo. I know that a lot of people get away with that. Then there are the people who....don't. I am much happier running N320 in 147-grain 9mm. OTOH in the low pressure .45 ACP, N310 is a great powder, and it's hard to imagine a softer shooting Major load than a hard cast 200-grain LSWC with N310.

[jmorris]

N310 & plated 147’s make the best minor 9mm load I have found. I also use it along with 45 GAP brass and 230’s for major revolver loads.

[Duane Thomas]

Like I said, I used to run 147/N310 myself. I got away from it when Bruce Gray told me he'd blown a casings in a custom 1911 with a fully supported match chamber using the same load, and specifically recommended N320 as a superior alternative. His quote, if memory serves, went something along the lines of, "I doubt you'll be able to tell the difference in recoil, and you'll have a hell of a lot more safety margin pressure-wise," or words to that effect.

N310 is an awesome .45 ACP powder. N310 is a not-so-awesome 9mm Parabellum powder. Just MHO, YMMV, and all the other usual acronyms.

[AriM]

Like I said, I used to run 147/N310 myself. I got away from it when Bruce Gray told me he'd blown a casings in a custom 1911 with a fully supported match chamber using the same load, and specifically recommended N320 as a superior alternative. His quote, if memory serves, went something along the lines of, "I doubt you'll be able to tell the difference in recoil, and you'll have a hell of a lot more safety margin pressure-wise," or words to that effect.

N310 is an awesome .45 ACP powder. N310 is a not-so-awesome 9mm Parabellum powder. Just MHO, YMMV, and all the other usual acronyms.

that's kind of what scares me about 310.....the margin is so small...min and MAX is only a 0.7 grain spread....unless that powder meters very consistently....I dunno....I think I'll give it a go....worst that can happen is I lose an eye right? Hell i have 2 of them

[MoNsTeR]

It does meter very consistently. And the margin isn't small at all, 0.7gr is a HUGE amount of N310 when you consider the absolute amounts we're talking here, e.g. 4.5gr-ish for a 200gr 45 load. If 4.5 were a max load (and I doubt it is), the standard 10% reduction would give a starting load of 4.0 or so, a range only half a grain wide.

Also I would not expect a powder like N310 (or any VV powder, and probably all single-base powders) to go from seems-fine to kaboom in a tenth or two, rather you're going to see a progressive increase in pressure signs. Primer flow and flattening, then pierced primers and loose pockets, etc., then KB territory well above where any sane person would have stopped. This is assuming of course you have good neck tension, reasonably consistent brass, and are taking all other sensible precautions.

I have had pierced primers with N310, but only in .40. As someone said above, N310 is perfectly suited to .45 and I would not worry at all as long as you Do The Right Thing.

Edited December 28, 2009 by MoNsTeR