Zerwas Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 I know this has been covered in numerous other threads. I just thought it would be nice if people could look at one thread instead of 20 different threads if they want to discuss accuracy and the S&W M&P 9 long slide pistols. I changed out the sites to a Dawson fixed rear target wide notch and a Dawson front fiber optic .215 X .100. I went out to the range today to shoot the best possible groups out of my 9L. I have the stock barrel in the pistol. I am using the Black Bullet International 130gr offering with Solo 1000 powder. I am shooting 131-132PF. This first target was quick singles at 17 yards (about a .50-.60 split), as soon as the sites settled down, the trigger was pressed again. I was fairly happy with these results. The next target was a 50 yard target with the pistol bench rested. This is where I wish this pistol was a bit more accurate. Not like we'd be shooting 50 yard shots in USPSA a lot, but when you do you want to have confidence that your pistol can do it. I sent 15 rounds down range at this distance and I guess overall I was ok with the results. I did throw a D hit however that I did not call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 (edited) The next target was a 50 yard target with the pistol bench rested. This is where I wish this pistol was a bit more accurate. Not like we'd be shooting 50 yard shots in USPSA a lot, but when you do you want to have confidence that your pistol can do it. I sent 15 rounds down range at this distance and I guess overall I was ok with the results. I did throw a D hit however that I did not call. For me, I don't think I'd be okay with those results. One thing is that at that distance you really need to have something more specific to aim at. You can fudge it at closer distances, but not at 50. I'd try it again with something you can really hold on and see what happens. Here's 25yds from my Pro in bad lighting, resting my hands and wrists on a rolled up towel, no support on the gun itself, shooting Atlanta Arms 147gr JHP Team Glock load (new cases). I think the lighting was the cause of much of the vertical spread and a narrow blade in a wide rear is most likely the cause of a lot of the left to right spread. I'm sure it would open up twice as much at 50yds, but that would still be a 3" group give or take. Edited November 6, 2009 by G-ManBart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfie Posted November 6, 2009 Share Posted November 6, 2009 I know this has been covered in numerous other threads. I just thought it would be nice if people could look at one thread instead of 20 different threads if they want to discuss accuracy and the S&W M&P 9 long slide pistols. I changed out the sites to a Dawson fixed rear target wide notch and a Dawson front fiber optic .215 X .100. I went out to the range today to shoot the best possible groups out of my 9L. I have the stock barrel in the pistol. I am using the Black Bullet International 130gr offering with Solo 1000 powder. I am shooting 131-132PF. This first target was quick singles at 17 yards (about a .50-.60 split), as soon as the sites settled down, the trigger was pressed again. I was fairly happy with these results. The next target was a 50 yard target with the pistol bench rested. This is where I wish this pistol was a bit more accurate. Not like we'd be shooting 50 yard shots in USPSA a lot, but when you do you want to have confidence that your pistol can do it. I sent 15 rounds down range at this distance and I guess overall I was ok with the results. I did throw a D hit however that I did not call. Why did you go with the .215 tall sight? I'm curious to know b/c I was looking at buying some Dawson sights today and I wouldn't have considered that tall of a sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerwas Posted November 7, 2009 Author Share Posted November 7, 2009 (edited) Why did you go with the .215 tall sight? I'm curious to know b/c I was looking at buying some Dawson sights today and I wouldn't have considered that tall of a sight. I had too. With a .180 front site, I was shooting about 3.5" high at 25 yards. The .215 front site zeroed me. I was thinking a .180 site would be right, but boy was I wrong! Edited November 7, 2009 by Zerwas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerwas Posted November 7, 2009 Author Share Posted November 7, 2009 The next target was a 50 yard target with the pistol bench rested. This is where I wish this pistol was a bit more accurate. Not like we'd be shooting 50 yard shots in USPSA a lot, but when you do you want to have confidence that your pistol can do it. I sent 15 rounds down range at this distance and I guess overall I was ok with the results. I did throw a D hit however that I did not call. For me, I don't think I'd be okay with those results. One thing is that at that distance you really need to have something more specific to aim at. You can fudge it at closer distances, but not at 50. I'd try it again with something you can really hold on and see what happens. Here's 25yds from my Pro in bad lighting, resting my hands and wrists on a rolled up towel, no support on the gun itself, shooting Atlanta Arms 147gr JHP Team Glock load (new cases). I think the lighting was the cause of much of the vertical spread and a narrow blade in a wide rear is most likely the cause of a lot of the left to right spread. I'm sure it would open up twice as much at 50yds, but that would still be a 3" group give or take. Yeah, truth be told I wasn't really happy with the results at 50. Your experience with the AA stuff has me wondering about using some 147jhp's with the solo or something else? I have all winter to perfect a load for this pistol. For now, I'm ok with the BBI as long as we don't have too many 50 yard shots. Anybody else have experience with a particular pet load for your long slide M&P you'd like to share? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarge Posted November 7, 2009 Share Posted November 7, 2009 My Pro will shoot 3 or 4 inch groups at 25 yards. Correction, I can manage 3 or 4 inch groups with my pro. But I can only do it with 147's. 124's for me were easily paper plate sized groups at 25 yards. I currently load 147 precision moly's with 3.8 solo1000 at 1.13 oal for right around 132+ pf. They seem slightly less accurate than the 147 montana golds with TG but not by enough to offset the cost savings in my opinion. I have learned that smoke is an issue with the moly's though. Even though many say they smoke very little with solo1000 I find them to be pretty smokey especially when compared to nearly smoke free loads of MG's and TG. Good luck and try small quantities before ordering huge amounts of anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted November 7, 2009 Share Posted November 7, 2009 Yeah, truth be told I wasn't really happy with the results at 50. Your experience with the AA stuff has me wondering about using some 147jhp's with the solo or something else? I have all winter to perfect a load for this pistol. For now, I'm ok with the BBI as long as we don't have too many 50 yard shots. I'm set with both Solo 1000 and N320. If I could find Zero 147s, I'd order them, but since they're hard to find I'm going to order some MG 147s. I actually used a $100 gift certificat from Precision Delta to order up 2K of their 147s, but no idea on when they'll be available (they were honest and said this up front). R, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Burwell Posted November 7, 2009 Share Posted November 7, 2009 I am thinking you load needs tweaking, maybe trying the 147s will help out or turning the power up on the 130s. Shooting a MG147 over solo1000 my 50yd off hand target looks a little better than your benched one, and I can't shoot groups for crap, so I know my gun is capable of better than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerwas Posted November 7, 2009 Author Share Posted November 7, 2009 Right now I load to 1.162 OAL. I wonder if making it shorter 1.10 or so would make a difference? I'll have to try it and let ya'll know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-ManBart Posted November 7, 2009 Share Posted November 7, 2009 Right now I load to 1.162 OAL. I wonder if making it shorter 1.10 or so would make a difference? I'll have to try it and let ya'll know... I haven't seen shorter OAL help accuracy very often. It increases the jump to the rifling, which isn't a good thing....but stranger things have happened when it comes to accuracy. I'd suspect it's either your gun isn't a fan of the mid-weight bullets, molies or a combination of the two. R, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffWard Posted November 7, 2009 Share Posted November 7, 2009 I haven't benchrested my Pro in a while... I do know I can nail poppers at 50yds comfortably, if I do my part. I trust the gun's ability much more than mine... LOL Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerwas Posted November 18, 2009 Author Share Posted November 18, 2009 (edited) Just a little update...I bumped up my load from 3.75 to 3.82 then to 3.9 and finally to 4.0gr. I am now at 134pf with 4.0gr of Solo 1000 and the 130gr BBI and I am happy with the accuracy I was able to achieve with this pistol/ammo combination. It is plenty accurate enough for the USPSA game. I know it's teasing, but I will post a picture of a target I shot yesterday....Head shots only at 5, 10, 15, 20 and 25 yards. All 2 rounds per at each range. I tried upper to tag the upper A zone with each round. To add to the difficulty level, I stapled a white piece of paper to the B/C line so if anything went south of the A zone, I'd know about it. The picture of the target will say it all... To be posted soon. Edited November 18, 2009 by Zerwas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S391 Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 I am thinking you load needs tweaking, maybe trying the 147s will help out or turning the power up on the 130s. I'm new enough to reloading that I'm trying to understand why that would increase the accuracy? What would this do besides make it go faster? (Honest question) Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffWard Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 I am thinking you load needs tweaking, maybe trying the 147s will help out or turning the power up on the 130s. I'm new enough to reloading that I'm trying to understand why that would increase the accuracy? What would this do besides make it go faster? (Honest question) Thanks. Some 9mm's like higher velocities to better stabilize the bullets, like throwing football hard or soft. Some barrels do fine with heavy/slow. Some are better with light/fast bullets. One of the guys we shoot with shoots a Beretta 92. He was shooting 147s at a 130 PF, and they were tumbling. The accuracy was crap. He switched to 115gr bullets at the same PF, much faster, and the groups shrank in half, and the tumbling stopped. This is 20 rounds from my M&P from 20 feet, off-hand. I pulled one... Mine likes the 147 gr bullets, just under 900 fps. About 129 PF. Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Burwell Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 I am thinking you load needs tweaking, maybe trying the 147s will help out or turning the power up on the 130s. I'm new enough to reloading that I'm trying to understand why that would increase the accuracy? What would this do besides make it go faster? (Honest question) Thanks. Two reasons, one more pwoder behind it will cause the bullet to "obturiate" or expand to get into teh rifling better, it will also come out at a higher velocity with a higher RPM which could help stablize the bullet better. This is not to say a hotter load will be more accurate, but I have found a lot of these powder puff loads people are trying to shoot in minor, just are not enough to stablize the bullets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffWard Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 I am thinking you load needs tweaking, maybe trying the 147s will help out or turning the power up on the 130s. I'm new enough to reloading that I'm trying to understand why that would increase the accuracy? What would this do besides make it go faster? (Honest question) Thanks. Two reasons, one more pwoder behind it will cause the bullet to "obturiate" or expand to get into teh rifling better, it will also come out at a higher velocity with a higher RPM which could help stablize the bullet better. This is not to say a hotter load will be more accurate, but I have found a lot of these powder puff loads people are trying to shoot in minor, just are not enough to stablize the bullets. Beat ya by 2 minutes, Dan. Oh yeah... that "obturiate" thing too.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Burwell Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Beat ya by 2 minutes, Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerwas Posted November 20, 2009 Author Share Posted November 20, 2009 As promised, here is the latest target with the formula I listed in the previous entry. 2 shots each at 5, 10, 15, 20 and 25 yards. The 2 shots in the B zone were the 2 shots at 25 yards, and the shade was messing with my site picture. Pretty happy with these results. I put the Leupold target at the B-C zone to identify any shots that went low. This target had been shot up several times before, so to make it easy I just stapled the Leupold target on it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billfer Posted November 20, 2009 Share Posted November 20, 2009 Were you bench-rested or shooting off hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zerwas Posted November 20, 2009 Author Share Posted November 20, 2009 Unsupported, off hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbosik Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 u must have good eyes and good trigger control to offhand that well.,@25 i cant even see the a zone on the head! good shooting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S391 Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 This is 20 rounds from my M&P from 20 feet, off-hand. I pulled one... Mine likes the 147 gr bullets, just under 900 fps. About 129 PF. Jeff Thanks Jeff, I have some 147 gr bullets loaded that are about identical to yours in terms of velocity and PF. I'm hoping to get to the range over the holidays for some serious time testing loads to see what shoots best for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tk2 Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Got a new M&P Pro and shot it today for the first time. Shot it from a bench with sandbag rests from 25 yds. With my 147 gr. lead bullet reloads using solo 1000 I was getting 1.5" to 2" groups. I'm pretty happy with those results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TG9Pro Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 My Pro likes the heavier 147 gr for accuracy. 124gr are pretty decent as well. Sorry no pics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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