Odd Hammer Follow

[austinkroe]

Ok so i haven't even shot the gun yet but this came up while I was installing a new trigger kit. I was just looking to set-up a new set so I could have a backup.

Here are the parts I installed:

Extreme Engineering Hammer and Sear

STI Gunsmith Blank Trigger

This is in an STI frame.

So, I adjusted the parts as per the Brazos website. I backed out the overtravel screw two turns past the breaking point and there is plenty of pretravel. The sear doesn't hit the halfcock notch on the way down. All the parts were new. I put plenty of pressure on the sear.

Here is what is happening:

The hammer fully follows if I put LIGHT pressure on the trigger and let the slide go. It also happens if I pull the trigger to dry fire and then loosely hold it there and I rack the slide hard.

However if I do this with the trigger firmly held back or not touched at all it does not happen.

I am scared to take it out and fire it because I am not sure if it is safe in its current condition. I played with it for about an hour and I just cannot figure it out. I cant get my other STI to do this so I figured something must be wrong. So either I am being paranoid and it wont double or there is something odd going on.

I figured you all might be able to tell me what the problem is.

Edited January 26, 2009 by austinkroe

[bkeeler]

Are hammer and sear hooks matched?

What is the trigger pull weight?

Sounds like the hammer and sear engagements are incorrect. Also could be sear spring pressure and your getting trigger bounce when the slide falls.

Some of the others will chime in but this is all I could think of.

BK

[Josh Biondi]

E.E. hammer has the hook really short cutted. So if you're not able to do a job like a "gunsmith job" on the trigger group its really hard to make it works fine.

Just start checking it following this procedure: stop the slide back with the slide stop on, hold the trigger so it cant move (be sure of this), release the slide stop and let the slide close hard.

If the hammer dont move you need bend ahead a little the half leaf of the sear spring. So you'll solve the trouble.

good luck!

[konkapot]

That all sounds kinda wierd....almost like there might be multiple things happening or not happening.

Definately don't shoot it.

Spend some time fartin' around with it, but ultimately you'll need to take it to a gunsmith, who will probably figure it out in no time.

FY42385

[Radical Precision Designs]

Ok so i haven't even shot the gun yet but this came up while I was installing a new trigger kit. I was just looking to set-up a new set so I could have a backup.

Here are the parts I installed:

Extreme Engineering Hammer and Sear

STI Gunsmith Blank Trigger

This is in an STI frame.

So, I adjusted the parts as per the Brazos website. I backed out the overtravel screw two turns past the breaking point and there is plenty of pretravel. The sear doesn't hit the halfcock notch on the way down. All the parts were new. I put plenty of pressure on the sear.

Here is what is happening:

The hammer fully follows if I put LIGHT pressure on the trigger and let the slide go. It also happens if I pull the trigger to dry fire and then loosely hold it there and I rack the slide hard.

However if I do this with the trigger firmly held back or not touched at all it does not happen.

I am scared to take it out and fire it because I am not sure if it is safe in its current condition. I played with it for about an hour and I just cannot figure it out. I cant get my other STI to do this so I figured something must be wrong. So either I am being paranoid and it wont double or there is something odd going on.

I figured you all might be able to tell me what the problem is.

I can not believe my eyes !!!!! Why the heck are you doing that ???

That is about one of the unsafest procedures ever posted here !!!

Try to go to the firing line and do what you described here and you will be sent home with a DQ.

Keep your finger OFF the trigger. You are providing your own "human trigger BOUNCE"

The fact that you can drop the slide hard without the hammer following with your finger off tells that your set-up is fine, AND free of trigger bounce by itself.

What you are doing is what I do to show customers how to make the hammer follow every time, no matter how well adjusted the system is.

Also, away from the firing line, with an empty gun, when there is actual hammer drop/follow from trigger bounce, this is a test I do to prove it: I put "side" pressure on the trigger while I drop the slide kind of to freeze the trigger in place, and in a well adjusted system the hammer never follows.

When you are firing, especially in a light trigger set-up you must be consistent and deliberate in your trigger pull.

"Limp fingering" ( :roflol: ) your trigger is dangerous.

Edited January 27, 2009 by Radical Precision Designs

[austinkroe]

Thanks for the advice RPD. I was doing it at home away from ammo with an empty gun. What happened was that I put in the parts and tested them out by dropping the slide not touching the trigger and touching it. Then all of the sudden I had a follow and I noticed that I didnt have the trigger pressed all the way back. I soon found that if I racked the slide holding the trigger just so that the hammer would follow every time. I have not even taken the gun to the line yet. I just wanted to make sure it was safe to take up. What I can tell from your post is that it is fine and that if I act like an idiot I can make most all 1911s follow.

[DougR]

It sounds to me that you have a marginal, (short), disconnector.

That is, when the slide is released, the disconnector is not being pushed down far enough by the slide to completely clear the sear.

This situation is likely exacerbated by a marginal sear to hammer full cock notch fit.

Particularly if the hammer has been reduced below a .020" height and the sear has not been stoned to match the vertical face of the hammer notch. This must be checked very carefully with a strong magnifier or 10x hand held scope. The face of the hammer notch must be truly at 90 degrees and the sear primary face is stoned to match the face, that is parallel with each other, along with a small sear secondary angle, the sear should not bounce out of contact.

All this with sear springs set at minimum pressures and light main springs. Which do not help.

How about the fit of the hammer and sear pivot pins? Most pins today are at least 1 thou smaller diameter than necessary.

I put C&S oversize pins in my pistols. They are actually right on the blue print specifications. .110" & .157"

I do not know what the pull weight of your trigger is. However light triggers under 3 lbs are the domain of expert 1911 pistol smiths.

Edited January 27, 2009 by DougR

[Radical Precision Designs]

Thanks for the advice RPD. I was doing it at home away from ammo with an empty gun. What happened was that I put in the parts and tested them out by dropping the slide not touching the trigger and touching it. Then all of the sudden I had a follow and I noticed that I didnt have the trigger pressed all the way back. I soon found that if I racked the slide holding the trigger just so that the hammer would follow every time. I have not even taken the gun to the line yet. I just wanted to make sure it was safe to take up. What I can tell from your post is that it is fine and that if I act like an idiot I can make most all 1911s follow.

:cheers:

You've been around the block a few times. I've got faith in you..

[Resjudicata]

Austin,

You are a tool. You do not deserve that gun. Have it ready for me to pick up immediately.

Chris

Ok so i haven't even shot the gun yet but this came up while I was installing a new trigger kit. I was just looking to set-up a new set so I could have a backup.

Here are the parts I installed:

Extreme Engineering Hammer and Sear

STI Gunsmith Blank Trigger

This is in an STI frame.

So, I adjusted the parts as per the Brazos website. I backed out the overtravel screw two turns past the breaking point and there is plenty of pretravel. The sear doesn't hit the halfcock notch on the way down. All the parts were new. I put plenty of pressure on the sear.

Here is what is happening:

The hammer fully follows if I put LIGHT pressure on the trigger and let the slide go. It also happens if I pull the trigger to dry fire and then loosely hold it there and I rack the slide hard.

However if I do this with the trigger firmly held back or not touched at all it does not happen.

I am scared to take it out and fire it because I am not sure if it is safe in its current condition. I played with it for about an hour and I just cannot figure it out. I cant get my other STI to do this so I figured something must be wrong. So either I am being paranoid and it wont double or there is something odd going on.

I figured you all might be able to tell me what the problem is.

[want2race]

Although I completely agree with RadicalP's comments...how much pretrave does the trigger have? Try dropping in your old trigger and repeat.

[austinkroe]

More pretravel than before. I went from an SV bow to an STI and I set the pretravel long. Although I do feel like the reset is shorter now. Any way to make the reset longer?