The FTDR

[ashman627]

I was the CSO for Stages 1 and 2 in bay 1. I assessed the FTDR in question.

Here is a little bit of my background in IDPA. I helped start the 1st club here in Texas in 96, Quickly followed by becoming a Certified S.O. I started Match Directing in 97 putting on 3 matches every month for the last 10 years. I am an S.O. instructor. I have been the M.D. for a couple of Regional Matches. I have been to the last 10 IDPA National and have S.O.ed at 9 of them and been a CSO at 7 of them. I am also the Area Coordinator for Texas, New Mexico and Louisiana.

If you have been to the Nationals anytime in the last 9 years I have run you through at least one course of fire and some years 3 COFs. Y'all know what kind of an S.O. and CSO I am. I try to help each shooter when I can. I'm consistent with all my calls and ALWAYS ALWAYS give the shooter the "benefit of the doubt".

The reason for all that info is just to let people know where I'm coming from and my experience as an S.O. I have the same problem everyone else does with the subjectivity of the "round dumping" rule. As many shooters as I have run through Cofs over the years I have highly suspected "RDing" on numerous occasions. But, because there has always been a doubt in my mind I have never called it. I have always adhered to the whole "shooter gets the benefit of the doubt" thing.

I never thought in a million years that I would be forced to assess a FTDR for RDing. Then to my complete shock and dismay an international squad at the IDPA Nationals this year removed all "benefit of the doubt" that I thought I'd always have in regards to RDing.

Every shooter in this squad that was shooting SSP and ESP had the exact same game plan. They were blatantly and consistently Rding in the same place at the same target to get an advantageous reload. I gave them “the benefit of the doubt” because:

1. That’s how I S.O.

2. They are an International Squad

3. It was their first time at the Nationals

4. The language barrier.

I bear a lot of the responsibility for letting it go on too long. At one point I had had enough but was unsure as to how to handle it because of all the above reasons. I had the MD come into the bay to see if he had any reservations about me issuing a FTDR. As he and I walked back into the bay one of my assistant S.O.s had taken over running shooters in my absence. (Btw, great job Mike, Cindy and Kitty!!!) The next shooter was a young lady. She predictably did the exact same thing as the others in front of the MD. I looked at him and he looked at me and said that was about the most blatant Rding he had ever seen. He and I had a quick conversation about how to handle it. We decided to give her an FTDR because we both had seen it and were in complete agreement that it was Rding.

I told him that not only was I going to give her the FTDR. I was also going to put the whole squad on notice. I gathered them all up and told them “we have a problem here” and proceeded to read them the riot act. I told them that what they were doing was against the rules and couldn’t happen anymore at this match or any other IDPA match. It is unfortunate that this happened. It is also unfortunate that this young lady paid the price for the rest of her team. This incident put a real damper on my whole crews day but we did the right thing for the sport.

I apologize for the long post. I just wanted to set the record straight. Hope everyone had fun and hope to see y'all again next year.

Sounds good to me Mike.I think you handled it just fine.

[Loves2Shoot]

I'll stand by my statement and start quoting ANTI IPSC stuff is you want:

From page 1 and 4 of the rule book "The main goal is to test the skill and ability of the individual, not equiptment or gamesmanship." Ok what is that referring to if not IPSC. Pretty silly statement really, since no the equiptment is incapable of winning a contest without direction from the shooter, and no brilliant plan has ever won a match or stage unless it was well executed by a shooter.

Again from page 1 "Competition only" equiptment is not permitted in this sport." We again what is this type of equiptment if not IPSC gear? I know there is equiptment I would consider IPDA only eqiptment, ie. a 511 vest

Page 5 - What do points II and V refer to if not IPSC?

Page 6 - S1 B A Ok why state the 180 rule does not exist? That can't be because IPSC has a 180 rule can it?

Page 9 - Rules C 4 and C5

Ok, for me it was clear that there were enough things in the rulebook when I read it to come to the conclusion they wree trying to make a sport that is "not IPSC." That is just the way it first struck me when I read the rulebook.

That being said, I have enjoyed the few IDPA matches I have particiapted in and even won a couple State Championships this year.

There is also something in the rule book that I think EVERY stage designer should keep in the front of their mind,

"ANYTHING that can be done to eliminate judegment calls on the part of the safety officers is encouraged."

and

"...allowing poor course designs to flourish will lead to the demise of IDPA quicker than any other factor."

and

"assessment of procedural penalties because the shooter failed to understand the course of fire should be very rare."

If those simple things were followed, a FTDR would not even be needed IMO.

All it takes is to read the rulebook and it is quite obvious that it was a sport made NOT to be IPSC, which is fine.

Completely unfounded statement. So that someone else reading this topic is not confused with the above statement, here's a statement directly from the rulebook:

The International Defensive Pistol Association (IDPA) is the governing

body of a shooting sport that simulates self-defense scenarios and real

life encounters. It was founded in 1996 as a response to the desires of

shooters worldwide. The organization now boasts membership of more

than 11,000, including members in 19 foreign countries.

One of the unique facets of this sport is that it is geared toward the new

or average shooter, yet is fun, challenging and rewarding for the

experienced shooter. The founders developed the sport so that practical

gear and practical guns may be used competitively. An interested person

can spend a minimal amount on equipment and still be competitive.

The main goal is to test the skill and ability of the individual, not

equipment or gamesmanship. “Competition only” equipment is not

permitted in this sport.

[Flexmoney]

This horse has been beat. We are getting into the this vs. that stuff...

CLOSED.