a "little" ammo problem

[ErikW]

This may be bad karma, but it's so unusual I'm gonna mention somebody else's match screwup...

First stage of the Factory Gun Nationals, we're getting our equipment sheets signed off, loading magazines, and giving 8 round samples for chronographing.

Things are going good until a shooter's Glock isn't cycling. Bang, rack, bang, rack. We can watch the slide move about a quarter-inch each shot. Once or twice it actually fully cycles. When she gets to the targets in front of us, we can see lengthwise bullet holes through the cardboard.

She was shooting 9x19 through a Glock 35 (.40 S&W).

It raised some interesting questions. What do you do at the chrono? What do you if she declared Major? Should the RO have stopped her for unsafe ammo? If she used 9mm magazines in a .40 Production gun, should she be moved into Open?

I think Amidon dropped her to Minor because .400 is the minimum and she fired 9mm. I'm assuming Chronoman accepted a new .40S&W ammo sample.

[sfinney]

I probably would have DQ'ed her for unsafe gunhandling...  or something! if you can't even figure out what caliber ammo to put in your pistol, should you even BE at the nationals?  

[THS]

No DQ.  No re-class to minor either.  

Clearly a case of mixed ammo in the range bag.  Get the correct caliber ammo and move on.  There is no tactical or competitive advantage to shooting 9mm out of a .40 barrel.  

My take WITHOUT reading the rule book, as I doubt you'll find it there.  

Vince, care to comment?

Tom

[ErikW]

shooter40, imagine this:

Your sponsor gives you a gun rug and says, "Here's the gun you're shooting." At the stage, your sponsor says, "Here's your mags, here's a couple boxes from our factory ammo sponsor. Good luck."

I think it happened something like that.

There was nothing unsafe about the gun handling. One could argue it was unsafe ammunition, which warrants a stop and score targets, and proof of safe ammo before continuing with another stage, but not a DQ.

Anyway, it's something to think about because I've heard of people loading .40s into their .45s at local matches, too.

[sfinney]

Hey, it was a joke, lighten up people.....  of course BY THE RULES it is not a DQ..... but I still hold suspect anyone who can't look at their ammo (or loaded mags) and not have a clue that the ammo is the wrong caliber... but then again, I'm pretty anal about my ammo, and who handles it. And I can argue that is an unsafe condition to fire ammo not the right caliber for your bore, but thats another story.

My only squib, and my only double charge have come from "friends" loading for me..... So I guess I look pretty hard at my ammo, especially borrowed ammo.  

[Vince Pinto]

Sorry to reply so late but I don't usually check this part of the forum.

Reading between the lines, it appears that the competitor made (or was the victim of) an honest mistake by having 9mm rounds in a 40 cal magazine and gun, for which a heavy price has already been paid (i.e. tap, rack, click, expletive deleted, repeat etc.), hence a Section 10.4 DQ is not appropriate.

Next, the ammunition was not unsafe - it was unsuitable. In any case, when there is an instance of "unsafe gun or ammunition", we effectively DG the gun or the ammunition, not the competitor, by ordering them to take corrective action under Rule 5.5.4.

Of course a re-shoot is out of the question because the problem was due to a "malfunction" of the competitor's equipment and little gray cells.

As I wasn't there, I doubt I'm in possession of all the information, however based on what I understand, my call mirrors the call made by THS.

We simply time and score the problem stage "as shot", the competitor fixes the problem, and we all move on.

[3quartertime]

This site is amazing!!!  A screw-up at a national match,  a joke,  a mild flaming and prophecy from the book.    

One post on a match problem turns into a mess then teaches us all.

This is the coolest!!!