Extractor Clocking...

[Ron Ankeny]

The gun was originally set up for Super with an Aftec, but the 'smith also ran a bunch of his rimless through the gun and it ran flawlessly. I suspected the tension was way too stiff and that's what caused the failures to go into battery and that's also why it ran with rimless. When I take the tension off of the Aftec by bending it in a vise (Aftec told me to try this) then I get stovepipe jams because the hook slips over the rim. Sure sounds like the Aftec is a rimless doesn't it?

Anyhow, to solve the problem I dropped in a regular extractor and now I have the clocking issue. I'll need to call Aftec and see what they think.

BTW, remember my whine in the hate forum about shooting the chronograph? Chuck has a good deal on the CED in a package deal that includes the soft case. After the way things have gone this week, I also ordered replacement sky screens, lol.

[Dan Sierpina]

The gun was originally set up for Super with an Aftec, but the 'smith also ran a bunch of his rimless through the gun and it ran flawlessly. I suspected the tension was way too stiff and that's what caused the failures to go into battery and that's also why it ran with rimless. When I take the tension off of the Aftec by bending it in a vise (Aftec told me to try this) then I get stovepipe jams because the hook slips over the rim. Sure sounds like the Aftec is a rimless doesn't it?

Anyhow, to solve the problem I dropped in a regular extractor and now I have the clocking issue. I'll need to call Aftec and see what they think.

BTW, remember my whine in the hate forum about shooting the chronograph? Chuck has a good deal on the CED in a package deal that includes the soft case. After the way things have gone this week, I also ordered replacement sky screens, lol.

Ron,

The detail of the failure of going into battery is a symptom of too much extractor tension, and would make sense that rimless brass would overcome that. You mentioned that extraction is all over the place, do you mean ejection by any chance? As long as the brass is out of the gun, what difference does it make to have it land in a small pile? The unfortunate thing with your problem, is that diagnosis without the pistol and ammo in hand, is indeed difficult. But, the extractor seems to be the area in need of attention.

By the way, I've only used chrono's with screens......and I do have extras

One more question Ron. Is this the gun you got back just last week?

Edited March 9, 2006 by Dan Sierpina

[Ron Ankeny]

Yes, I mean ejection. I don't want the spent cases beating a hole through my scope (I have seen that happen), nor do I want them bouncing off my knuckle until I swell up and bleed like a stuck pig. Anything in between is just peachy. I don't think that's too much to ask.

FWIW, in my experience, any open blaster that ejects all over the place in a random pattern will eventually puke right in the middle of the biggest match of the season.

[J.L. Hardy]

Ron, at one time a well known gunsmith (Ted Yost, I believe) produced some extractors that actually had a set screw that was installed across the rear of the extractor and secured it to eliminate the movement. This set screw was drilled and tapped from 9 o'clock to 3 o'clock at the rear and you used a allen wrench coming in from 9 o'clock to tighten it down. I believe this could be performed on any standard extractor. It could not be performed on a aftec because the aftec would then not be able to pivot. You could probably find someone locally to drill and tap a small hole for the set screw to do this.

[Dan Sierpina]

Ron,

I guess I wasn't very clear on the ejection. I agree that the brass should be in close proximity of each other, not 10 feet to the right, then dribble out of the port I've seen shooters that seemed to want brass to land in a 6 inch circle 15 inches from their foot, so they don't have to walk a few steps to pick it up

Going by the photo of your knuckle, it does look like the brass is bouncing off the scope mount and down. You should see marks from the brass if it's hitting the scope or mount.

How low is the port cut? What kind of scope mount is it? Brand of slide? Does the rim of the brass bind front to back when inserted under the extractor by hand?

Next gun, have blued, you said it worked till it got that evil chrome on it

[Ron Ankeny]

Dan:

Yes, some brass comes off the scope and hits my knuckle. But my trigger finger is horribly bent from arthritis and the knuckle actually sits above the bottom of the ejection port so some brass does come out low enough to smack me.

I talked the problem over with Derek at Millenium and he has an excellent idea. Switch over to Super Comp, load up a 100 rounds, then send him the gun and he will get it to run unless the specs on the slide are way out of whack. Sounds like an expensive proposition for sure.

Maybe instead I'll buy a bunch of Super Comp brass, load up 100 rounds, purchase an Aftec for Super Comp, then send the whole can of worms back to my gunsmith. I can go buy a Glock and some dirt cheap ammo and shoot Production while I wait for the gun.

[Dan Sierpina]

Ron,

Good luck with that blaster. I hope whoever gets it to work right, tells you what was off with it, rather than tell you "it works now, use supercomp brass, loaded on the dark of the moon, after waving chicken bones at the 1050"

Dan

[DougCarden]

Ron, I assume that you have checked the breech face for any rubs or marks? If it ran fine before, I wonder if the breechface has been built up too much with the chrome? Have you polished the bejeezus out of it? If it is uneven then it would exhibit extraction problems....Just trying to be helpful Good luck, My open steel gun took two years and 3.5 gunsmiths to make it run!

DougC

[Matt Cheely]

My open steel gun took two years and 3.5 gunsmiths to make it run!

What did you do the that poor last gunsmith to make him a .5

[Radical Precision Designs]

Ron, I assume that you have checked the breech face for any rubs or marks? If it ran fine before, I wonder if the breechface has been built up too much with the chrome? Have you polished the bejeezus out of it? If it is uneven then it would exhibit extraction problems....Just trying to be helpful Good luck, My open steel gun took two years and 3.5 gunsmiths to make it run!

DougC

Actually I assumed it was not an issue where chrome "extra build up" would be a problem. That would be pushing the extreme of possibilities where the platers are concerned. While some parts have been known to be made somewhat "bigger" by extra plating, normally that doesn't really apply to normal every day hard chrome plating. These effects most likely would be noticed where you plate the frame and also the "pins" that go in it in a good quality frame properly sized, as the cumulative effect of both parts would come into play in parts that are very closely matched. Such is seldom the case relating to breech-faces.

On the other hand, there is an issue that does apply to hard chrome plating or even blue refinishing. The question really is: who prepared the slide for re-ifnishing, and how was it done? After continuous problems with various refinishers and their normal preparations routines, I no longer allow them to prep the parts for re-finishing in any of my guns. I insist on doing it myself and then allowing the refinisher to apply the hard chrome or blue without any other preparation other than degreasing and cleaning. Why is this? Well, when most slides and frames are prepared for re-finishing they are normally started by bead or sand blasting after chemically removing the prior finish (including blueing). This blasting is done everywhere inside and out to guarrantee a good adhesion of the new finish. Then the sides of the slide or frame may get some polishing for a satin or bright finish, and then they go into the plating/blueing solution. So far so good. But, what's wrong with this picture??? Well, think of this: the breech face was made rough by this blasting, along with the rails of both the slide and the frame, and the disconnector tunnel, sear wall chambers, barrel mating surfaces and any areas that would require smooth movement or friction between them. And this was compounded with the chrome as the hard chrome has a hardness harder than a file at a typical 80 rockwell. Ideally you would want the refinisher to re-polish those areas after the blasting and before the refinishing to guarrantee the proper fitting and functioning of the parts afterwards. Wouldn't you think? I guess that is why you call it "evil chrome". There is no evil chrome, just evil re-finishers.

By the way, using a suitable sized washita or ceramic stone in those rough areas followed by some wheel polishing will cure that "evil" chrome, but unfortunately will also leave the areas exposed to rusting and in need of continuous rust preventing maintenance. Cheers!!!