Gas Prices

[driver8M3]

vlad: excellent points...i like the way you think. i wanted to try to convey some of them myself, but didnt have the energy.

on who is responsible for such high prices, please dont ever overlook the gov't. check this out: here in maryland, some time ago wawa and sheetz were competing heavily for your gas $$$ (so that you'll buy other items from them too) by offering the lowest prices around. well, its seems that didnt sit too well with some of the other gas stations in the area. so what do you think those other stations did? lower their prices? not very likely...think again. they went to the politicians. now, what do you think the politicians did? did they tell those other stations "tough luck, if wawa and sheetz can sell for those prices, that's good news for the citizens, and perhaps you should lower your prices to compete." of course not...those words have probably never passed the lips a politician (well, maybe a few), so the politicians of the great socialist republic of maryland decided to institute a price floor for gasoline...below which it is illegal to sell gas in maryland. true story. there are also govt imposed price floors for other items as well (milk, sugar, etc.)...all benefit a few at the expense of the rest of us.

[George]

Good points yes, Vlad. But rather empirical in nature and not very in tune with the realities most businesses and the folks in those businesses face. Maybe an act of god will change the situation by destroying an existing industry and allow it to be built back up in a greener way from the insurance money if it pays ;-/ But in most folks lives the option to start again is not chosen by a desire to change trade balances and oil trading futures for the good of all.

We all make our choices based a little more on day to day exigencies than the long term way that is best for all in every thing we do. I do chose to recycle wherever possible and drive a small utility PU that get's reasonable mileage, but I cannot control the need for the multiple leased/rented 8-10mpg diesel trucks my business demands on a daily basis to deliver heavy equipment to wherever our customers demand it. There are a lot of things that really can't be changed without changing the fabric of society and that society type is not unique to the USA. It is unique to all societies that have relative prosperity no matter where they are on this planet. Ask anyone running any business, anywhere!

Preaching from that pulpit while engaging in a sport based on high volume recreational shooting is a dichotomy of major proportion to the pronounced tenets involved in said preaching about conservation of resources and using less of everything to create change for the better. I sure ain't gonna' be taking the bus to my local range to practice with my 3 gun gear. I will not be moving closer to it either. Maybe we should all give up the shooting sports unless we can walk to our range and homebrew our own components (shipping wastes fuel) ;-)

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Regards,

Edited December 29, 2005 by George

[Rob Boudrie]

It seems kind of unfair to complain about the gas companies charging what the market will bear unless you're prepared to charge a "fair markup" rather than "what the market will bear" when it's time to sell your house.

[Flexmoney]

And Flex, dont you dare. I'll get Big Oil, and the Trilateral Commision to stop selling you ANY gas.

No worries. I've been looking into making my own bio-diesel anyway.

And, I can always go siphon a few gallons from all the soccer-mom SUV's that line the neighborhood. They won't even notice five gallons or so missing from the big-gulp gas tanks.

[Vlad]

I've been looking into making my own bio-diesel anyway.

I'm not sure how you meant that but I REALLY dont want to know any of the details.

[blackdragon]

Vlad,

We came. We saw we kicked it's A%&!

Ivan

[Vlad]

Preaching from that pulpit while engaging in a sport based on high volume recreational shooting is a dichotomy of major proportion to the pronounced tenets involved in said preaching about conservation of resources and using less of everything to create change for the better. I sure ain't gonna' be taking the bus to my local range to practice with my 3 gun gear. I will not be moving closer to it either. Maybe we should all give up the shooting sports unless we can walk to our range and homebrew our own components (shipping wastes fuel) ;-)

Ah .. but I'm not the one complaining. I have my hobbies, and I have my work, and I decide how much I'm willing to spend. Yeah, I pack my car with range gear and don't take the bus, but it is my choice to engage in this voluntary recreational activity.

You are right, no individual can fix the problem by himself or herself. But society is made of individuals. Frankly I welcome high gas prices. I really do, and I'm not crazy. Hear me out.

As I pointed out gas is cheaper then bottled water. As long as that is the case NOTHING will change. If (and this is a a big if) the Peak Oil guys are right then I rather see prices go up early to force change before shortages become an issue. Look at the shale oil issue. We knew how to extract it for a hundred years but until oil hit $55 it wasnt worth building an infrastructure. Now it is and people are doing it. We are getting pretty close to knowing all the answer on how to migrate to a hydrogen based economy but you are not going to get people to buy hydrogen cars when there are no hydrogen station, and you are not going to get anyone to build a hydrogen station when there are no cars for it. The only way we can make that kind of change is if price pressures make the the whole thing worth it.

Personally, I rather see the price pressures now, when we still have oil, not later when we are running out and fighting small wars for control of oil fields around the world.

[George]

My self, I would rather see the humungous oil profits made every year go into creating a better fuel based economy instead of buying creature comforts for the ruling OPEC sheiks. I doubt seriously that Chevron is dumping all of it's extra cash into bio-fuel and power-cell research ;-)

I know that the priceof gas doesn't have to be so high, but that it is because it sells at that price so it ain't gonna' ever drop again or the oil company CEO's wouldn't be earning their keep in the manner their constituency demands they do. I also know that a certain percentage of us will do what we can to help things get better, but that most of us will just hassle on in whatever direction can be afforded on the paltry family income.

Yes, buying a more fuel efficient car would be the best thing to do, but for every person doing that, there are 5-10 idiots ratting around in old gas guzzling beaters with no intention of doing anything but running them into the ground and getting their hands on another one to repeat the process.

The real problem with society is that the freedoms we have allow major proportions of idiots to do whatever the heck they want no matter what the consequences to our society and our planet as a whole. Freedom is too precious to give up in most minds, but most folks are not capable of, or interested in making intelligent choices based on what is best for us a quarter century from now compared to just getting along as well as they can on a day to day basis. Too many folks in this world barely look beyond the next can of beer and the car window they toss the empty can out of.

The interesting thing to remember here is that for every person in this world trying to do the right thing for our future, there are dozens of people negating those efforts by pouring crankcase oil down stormdrains and clearcutting rainforest for slash and burn agriculture to feed their starving families today. It will take reweaving huge social fabrics before any of the shortsighted individuals negating your paltry efforts to save the planet are stopped from doing their daily damage.

The really amazing thing here is that we still have enough concern for our perceived freedoms that we constantly let chances to salvage our future slip through our hands because we refuse to curtail ongoing destructive practices when doing so would impinge those freedom loving ideals we hold so dear in any manner.

Yes, it is quite the dilemma we face in the long run ;-)