Action Pistol/bianchi Production Division?

[BigDave]

Pretty simple. If Production type guns were recognized as a seperate division, would you shoot the match? By Production I'm talking about USPSA Production/IDPA SSP double-action/Safe Action guns. Same gun and gear you show up with to the local USPSA or IDPA events.

[SRT Driver]

Yes, I'll punish myself again.

AP is a great sport to test your limits and fundamentals with a Production gun.

[EricW]

Make that a Hell Yes.

I'm serious considering hosting a Bianchi-type match locally just for fun. All I need to do is concoct a mover and we're there equipment-wise. What kind of stinks is that nobody seems to shoot Bianchi or NRA AP west of the Mississipi.

I really learned a lot shooting D-1's at 25 and 50 yards. Can't wait to get back in the saddle.

[BigDave]

If you get a hold of a NRA Action Pistol Rule Book they list the other COF's that fall under the big umbrella of AP.

As frustrating of a game as it is, I love it so. It is very simple, but extremely unforgiving. I've probably learned more about shooting AP than just about anything. Everone I've asked to a match (Rhino, JimStc, Twix, Skeeter, etc.) have all commented that they enjoyed themselves and have been back multiple times.

BTW - great scores can be put up with simple equipment. SRT posted a 463 on the Barricade with a G34. Another friend of mine scored 460 on the plates and a 1799 overall with a G34.

You don't need an Open gun to shoot this game.

[Flexmoney]

I voted YES...'cause, I shoot with a Glock anyway. Anderson has been shooting with his XD.

What about the true double-action first shot guys? Would you let a shooter cock the hammer for the first shot? Of the stage? Of the string?

I don't know that I would need/want a seperate Divison though? Why not just make me build the gun to fit in stock division and be competitive? I am fairly certain I can put together a Glock that will shoot tight groups and have a good trigger. (I am not really familar with the rules/divisons, hope that is legal).

[SRT Driver]

What about the true double-action first shot guys? Would you let a shooter cock the hammer for the first shot? Of the stage? Of the string?

Flex,

The rule book says:

10.1.11 - a competitor must begin each string of fire with his handgun in a safe condition, specified as:

b - Double-action autos must have the hammer fully down and not in the half cock position.

c - Auto pistols must have the hammer fully down or fully cocked with the tumb safety on safe, never on half cock. Double action autos may not be fully cocked if their safety mechanism drops the hammer when actuated.

So, as long as you start the string with the hammer down and then manually cock it or if the thumb safety does not drop the hammer, it can be cocked for the first shot as long as the safety is engaged.

[BigDave]

My thought behind recognizing Production as a division of and by themselves is two-fold. First, attract a bigger audience. There are a lot of people who already shoot other pistol competitions with such equipment (IDPA, USPSA), so no need for a new gun (not that there's anything wrong with that) for this game. Second - I want Production to stand on its own. It isn't that I think that good scores cannot be shot with a Glock, CZ or S&W 59XX, I've seen it done and I know they can. But, the tendency in Metallic Sight, like Open, is for 1911, 9x calliber. If I can get people in the door with the Production stuff they already own and shoot, and then they go towards Open or Metallic sight, fine. At least they are in the door and pulling the trigger.

Action Pistol, IMO, suffers from a vulgar lack of marketing and understanding. Its great that the event gets coverage on the likes of American Shooter and in American Handgunner. But, all you ever hear about and see is people like Doug, Bruce, Mickey and John and their hyper-tricked out, specialized Open guns. I want people to understand that you can come shoot this sport, and put up great scores, with stuff you already own. The other thing I would want to tap into more heavily is the USPSA crowd. AP will do nothing but improve your USPSA game.

[Flexmoney]

Yeah I am torn.

In one camp, adding a pure Prodcution division/category might be a good marketing move for now.

In the other camp, make the guns develope to fit the challenge. I know that every time the US Military switched guns...the die-hard shooters at the big accuraccy rifle matches would stick with the old, proven, platform. Then, eventually, the new guns would get hammered and tweaked until they worked as good or better than the old standard (heck, that was the case with the early, rattle-trap, boat-anchor 1911's).

[SRT Driver]

I know that every time the US Military switched guns...the die-hard shooters at the big accuraccy rifle matches would stick with the old, proven, platform. Then, eventually, the new guns would get hammered and tweaked until they worked as good or better than the old standard (heck, that was the case with the early, rattle-trap, boat-anchor 1911's).

The AR 15 (M16) was in service for almost 20 years before it was recognized as a service rifle in highpower.

Then bullets that would shoot at 600 were developed in the early 90's. The rest is history.

[Nik Habicht]

AP will do nothing but improve your USPSA game.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Every serious USPSA shooter needs to read this sentence over and over until they commit to going to an Action Pistol Match......

......I share Dave's conviction that AP taught me more about shooting than any other disciplie or practice.

[Greg in VA]

Well, shooting a off the shelf 586 with the 8 3/8" barrel, and finishing in the the top 5 at the Cup, I say a production division would be just great. Practice and timing is the key to the cup. I would like the think that the guns would be checked a little closer than they are now, so you are competing against true production guns!

Greg in Va

[gmshtr]

My requests last year to have a TRUE production division fell on deaf ears, but IF there was a USPSA Prod/IDPA SSP or SSR division, I would love to shoot it.

Now for the BUTS! BUT, if the NRA were to screw up a separate Production division as badly as they screwed up Open Modified, then I wouldn't bother. It's becoming more and more obvious to me that Open will always be the division that gets the attention. (See my rant in "Other Shooting Sports")

Hopefully, they'll introduce it next year. It would still be EXTREMELY difficult (damn near impossible) to beat an 8" Revolver with a Glock 17 or Beretta 92, but it would still be fun to try!

Phil