longbeard Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Hey all, I'm new to loading .40 and am using a Lee carbide set loading to 1.180 on for an STI Edge. I had a few bullets that jammed the gun. These are older SNS cast/lubed 180 LFP The OAL was fine, but upon further inspection they wouldn't pass the drop test. Looking at the scuff marks on the bullet it appears they are just a little crooked. I've talked to people and read all kinds of posts, and I'm going to go shorter to 1.160 and open up the bell a little bit. Anyone have a measurement on a belling that works for them? I realize it's kind of a feel thing, but if you have a number I'd be interested to know. Any other insights appreciated as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wgj3 Posted November 2, 2015 Share Posted November 2, 2015 Making sure that you keep the projectile as aligned/centered on the case mouth as possible until in enters the seating die will help also. Bell/expand just enough that the bullet will sit on top when placed there carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigedp51 Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 For cast bullets I highly recomend a Lyman type "M" expander, this type expander opens the mouth more and creates a "step" for the bullet to start straight and not tip during seating. The Lyman patent for the type "M" die expired and many of the die manufactures are now using the same type expander. The illistrations below are from the Redding website. I even use a Lyman type "M" die for expanding the necks of my AR15 ammo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longbeard Posted November 3, 2015 Author Share Posted November 3, 2015 Thanks, I've never used one. Sounds like this might be a reason to buy one and try it out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigedp51 Posted November 3, 2015 Share Posted November 3, 2015 Thanks, I've never used one. Sounds like this might be a reason to buy one and try it out! In the last year I bought a Redding carbide die for .44 magnum and a RCBS .357 carbide die and was surprized both dies had the type "M" expander. And in another forum I read that some compeditive shooters were using the type "M" die for their AR15s and M14/M1a to help reduce neck runout when expanding the necks and seating bullets and it seams to work with my rifles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earthshine402 Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 The Mr. Bullet Feeder expander also creates a similar step in the brass - i switched over to these in 9 and 40 and like them b/c it allows you to nicely place the bullet in there and it will not be crooked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noylj Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 In most cases, crooked bullets come from NOT using a properly sized expander die (or, in many cases, no expander at all and only flaring the case mouth). Run your case through your expander die. The case ID below the case mouth flare should be 0.001-0.002" less than actual bullet diameter. So, if loading a 0.401" bullet, the expander should leave the case ID at 0.399-0.400". Any smaller, and the bullet has to expand the case. In other cases, the seating stem is a poor fit and not only can't align the bullet, but can actually push the bullet off-center. If using Lee dies, send Lee some bullets and ask for a seating stem that only contacts the bullet on the ogive, and as low on the ogive as possible. Next, there are those who worry so much about the "don't use too much case flare as it will wear out the case" that they use too little flare and the bullet is just about balanced on top of the case and easily tilts going in the die. I see more bad ammo produced from too little flare than from too much flare. I use so much flare loading HBWCs in the S&W M52 .38 Spl that the case mouth will barely enter the seating die and I have NOT lost a single case that can be attributed to excess flaring. The reason is that the excess flare allows the wadcutter to be seated further into the case and it has much less tendency to tip--I can't bet a seating stem to only contact the bullet ogive, since there is none. Before I was getting about 1-2 case mouth splits every 100 rounds and I am still getting about 1 case mouth split every 100 rounds (yes, I don't really remember any case mouth splits in the last few years, but I can put that down to being used to them). If you go with an M-die, also be sure the expansion is correct and put some Lok-Tite on the thread of the expander so it doesn't loosen in operation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longbeard Posted November 15, 2015 Author Share Posted November 15, 2015 Thanks for the thorough reply. I am currently experimenting with using hot glue to create a seating stem plug for the bullet profile and an M die. It is much improved and I'm close to calling the issue solved. I will check the measurements regarding expansion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mongo404 Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 So how did the hot glue in the seating die work out for you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longbeard Posted December 11, 2015 Author Share Posted December 11, 2015 It worked out pretty well, and I'd definitely recommend it because it is so easy to do. I wonder though, if it would really help on the Lee die where the narrow stem doesn't really come down far enough on the ogive. Anyone ever try it with a Lee die? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mongo404 Posted December 11, 2015 Share Posted December 11, 2015 I guess I should have added that I also started using a Mr Bullet feeder and that seemed to help quite a bit starting the bullet straight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longbeard Posted December 11, 2015 Author Share Posted December 11, 2015 I guess I should have added that I also started using a Mr Bullet feeder and that seemed to help quite a bit starting the bullet straight. Well that's one $400 way to fix a problem! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mongo404 Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 It wasnt a total fix but it sure did help. Plus a bullet feeder had always been on the want list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earthshine402 Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 I guess I should have added that I also started using a Mr Bullet feeder and that seemed to help quite a bit starting the bullet straight. Well that's one $400 way to fix a problem! The expander is only about $35 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mongo404 Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Where's the fun it that??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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