brian45acp Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 (edited) On my 1050 the tool head seems to tilt on the down stroke as the brass enters the dies. Is there any trick to eliminate that? It's not real bad and I noticed I have to exactly adjust the expander die and staging rod etc or if those are bottoming out too much the right side of the tool head lifts because of it. I guess I'm used to my 650 or 550 where the tool Head doesn't move. The 1050 design I guess contributes to the tool head movement but perhaps it's normal. Also when the resize die is supposed to just touch the shell plate are you guys setting it that way with no brass in the station? If I set the die with no brass in any station once all stations are full the die no longer touches the shell plate. I could adjust the dies with all stations full and then never remove brass from the stations but if for some reason I had to clear all stations I couldn't cycle the handle because the dies now would press onto the shell plate being that they were set with stations full and the handle wouldn't make full stroke. I hope that all made sense Thanks Edited June 28, 2015 by brian45acp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjacobs Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Did your press not come pre set or are you setting up for a new caliber? My tool head doesnt tilt, at least not enough to notice. Is your tool head bolt tight? I run my handle down fully then run the sizing die down until it touches lightly and call it a day. This is with an empty shell plate. As far as the swage station setup that just takes some trial and error in order to get it exact. Set the backup portion of the die first then set the swage rod, little by little. There is a tool you can buy or you can just use a different press to seat the primer and get a feel for it. I just use my Forster Co-Ax to seat primers until I like the feel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted June 29, 2015 Author Share Posted June 29, 2015 (edited) I am using the GSI tool head so I had to set it myself. I have loaded about 8k on it already but I just keep fine tuning along the way. The bolt was loose and that did cause some of the movement. Still there is so much happening that I cant imagine the tool had not moving some. Some days I think of unbolting the bullet feeder and going back to stock but it is quite nice not having to grab for bullets. If I set my dies to touch the tool head with out the brass in the stations it lifts away about 1/8 inch with the stations full. I think I have the swage station set properly. It seems to be the culprit to the tool head moving. If its not set just right and I over do it then you can feel the handle on the down stroke not come to a solid stop. From that point I back the swage rod off a little and then it seems perfect. Im wondering just how worth it these bullet feeders are. I swear it has been a nightmare to set up and tweak. I think at this point everything is dialed in but I just cant decide which is best for setting the first and last stations which are supposed to contact the shell plate. Seems best to leave the stations full then make final adjustments. But in doing that if ever the stations are empty the first and last stages would be over adjusted and need to be backed off until all stages are loaded up again otherwise they press into the shell plate and you cant fully cycle the handle down. Edited June 29, 2015 by brian45acp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted June 29, 2015 Author Share Posted June 29, 2015 (edited) I am still hopeful there is something needing adjustment. I dont see how the GSI tool head could possibly tilt and the Dillon one wont. Both are sold and 1 piece. It always is the right hand side which looks to move upward at the down stroke like its the first 3-4 stations doing it. I really think its the swage station. The expander die is so hard to set right. I cant spin it with the brass inside so its hard to feel when the pin hits the bottom of the brass. Edited June 29, 2015 by brian45acp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggerJJ Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 Use case lube... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted June 29, 2015 Author Share Posted June 29, 2015 I do use case lube. I am right in the middle of having it all apart and starting over. I loosened everything and so far so good it has stopped moving around. I think evyerthing needs to be tightened as the last step. Adjusting one thing at a time and locking it down seems to piss it off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted June 29, 2015 Author Share Posted June 29, 2015 (edited) Oh well no luck. It kicks out good ammo but I can't keep it from rocking back and forth. There is some play in the machine itself. im going to try and go back to all Dillon parts and ditch the gsi.It seems there just is a little amount of play in the main shaft that the tool head bolts to. If you cycle the handle part way then grab the tool head it can be moved back and forth a bit. The movement is from the main shaft and the linkages from the handle etc. The powder hopper has a little movement back and forth as well. My OAL is quite consistend with only about 3 thousandths variance so there isnt much more I can expect. I still dont know if its best to set the dies with the stations full or not. Seems it would be and when I am done loading I dont typically clear the stations anyway so they are always full when I start again. Edited June 29, 2015 by brian45acp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wayne Posted June 29, 2015 Share Posted June 29, 2015 The GSI toolhead should not matter. On the deprime/size die the manual says to just touch the die to the shellplate. But for whatever reason, I backed the die out a business card thickness when all stations are full. That was back in '07. Both of my 1050's are set that way, 9mm and .38. I don't advocate going against the manual :^) Swager- I use a sharpie pen to color the inside of the empty primer pocket. Slowly adjust the swage rod up with subsequent passes coloring in the empty pocket until the swager depth suits you. Don't bottom out the primer pocket. Should be no toolhead tilt at all. Hope this helps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted June 29, 2015 Author Share Posted June 29, 2015 (edited) Yes that helps. I looked at this more and your right the tool head shouldnt have anything to do with this. So I guess there is just a little slop in the machine but I doesnt seem to impact anything. If you look closely on the down stroke with all stations full the tool head rocks a bit. With the tool head down a few clicks if you hold the tool head and push it back and forth it does move so that slop is what I must be notching. This also makes the powder hopper wiggle I think. I'm just used to 550 and 650 where dies are fixed and don't move but even those the tool head moves a bit. My ammo is all within 5 thousandths OAL so it must not matter. Any trick to the expander die setting? I called dillon they said use a wrench to turn the die while the brass is in the due until it stops the back off a bit Edited June 29, 2015 by brian45acp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wayne Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 Like you say it will wiggle a little as you advance the handle and the index rods enter their alignment holes. I suspect the wiggle comes from different linkages and mechanisms under the machine moving through their positions. That wiggle might be why my powder measures are so accurate, I take it for whatever the reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 (edited) I called a friend with a 1050 and his does the same thing. If you cycle the handle a few clicks down then stop and grab the tool head it can shake back and forth a bit. That movement can be seen again at the very end of the down stroke as the entire tool head and main shaft tip to one side. I still am not sure its normal but I will do a video today and see what you guys think. I took apart the tool head and dies and started fresh. My ammo is coming out very accurate with in 3 thousandths OAL for each round so everything must be fine. Edited June 30, 2015 by brian45acp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 Its hard to get a good vid but I think you can see what I am talking about. I dont think its normal and the tool head cant really be part of the issue. Its the main shaft moving and you can hear it clicking as it hits the inside of the frame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted June 30, 2015 Author Share Posted June 30, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeerBaron Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 From the vid it looks like one of your dies needs to be backed off a touch. Rather than the machine hitting its end stop its touching a die first and that last but of extra pressure is causing the flex/tilting. Something is touching the shell plate too early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 I have looked at that and even backed out the swager/expander die and still it does this. For certain there is an issue here that is beyond something I can adjust. The Dillon crew is taking care of me I am going to see what they figure out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 My brass even has an uneven bell to it. I changed the tool heads and same result with the tilting and it seems now I noticed the brass since I have to hand place the bullet. OK, I got some really good video this time. The one with the GSI tool head you can really see because its a square tool head and larger so its a bit easier for your eye to pick this up. The second is the Dillon head all Dillon dies dialed in and you can still see it. There are 2 things here that really show the tilt. First the resize die adjusted to touch the shell plate is no longer touching when the stations are full meaning that the tool head is rocking down toward the back let corner and lifting on the front right corner. The really odd part of this is the bell and powder drop station is belling the brass on one side and not the other. I have a pic that I included and I also tried to show this in the video but the pic really shows this. I havent noticed this before but with the Dillon tool head its really obvious now that I have to hand place the bullet on the brass. If the bell is only on half the mouth of the brass the only way that could happen is from the machine tilting to one side right at the bottom of the down stroke. If you watch the powder drop the tilting really exaggerates its movement and you see the hopper lean to the left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggerJJ Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 maybe your decapping pin is bottoming out??? remove it and see what happens... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 It can't bottom out. There is a hole through the shell plate that the primer falls through. That and I was using the LEE U die ft omega which has a collet recap pin which old slip. The dillon recap pin would just snap if it bottomed out. This one really has me confused. It really isn't something that can be adjusted. There is quite a bit of movement in the main shaft and linkages. I'm pretty sure it needs to be sent in. I am no commercial loader and dont have any auto drive either. I'm worried about the 1 year warranty on this machine. I only had it 6 months but what if in the future I have an issue? I'm sort of missing my 650 right now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjacobs Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) You shouldnt be using your powder die to bell the case. The expansion for bullet seating is done on the swage station. Belling is not needed on a 1050 due to this. I run a Mr. Bullet Feeder and I use NO BELLING, just the expansion from the swage backup die and have zero issues(I can advance the shell plate fast enough that I would toss a ton of powder out of the case, but the bullet stays put). My guess is you are bottom out your powder funnel activator inside the powder thrower and this is causing the tool head to rock around. Again, just a guess. I would personally strip this tool head completely bare and see what it does with no dies, nothing, on the tool head. Oh and remove the ratchet. While I dont think its causing your issue, it could be. Edited July 1, 2015 by rjacobs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiggerJJ Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 I use the UDie as well, so I understand... From what I remember the Dillon decap pin is fat at the base and could bottom out in the primer hole... Was just trying to think outside the box... jj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted July 2, 2015 Author Share Posted July 2, 2015 (edited) The powder drop station is for bell. Apparently other then the 650 the powder station expands and bells all in one but the 1050 is a 2 step. If you dont need any bell thats fine but it certainly is for applying bell to the case. That station would bell the case and likely split it if over adjusted but its not. I was trying to set nearly no bell as well but was confused since half the case had too much bell and the other half almost none. This is when I noticed something else was way off to be causing this. Its impossible to create a situation on the press which would cause half a belled case if it were not for the tool head titling to one side. All the positive reviews on the 1050 dont reflect what I am seeing here at all. This machine has so much movement compared to my 650 or 550 that for $1700 and being commercial grade it only leaves me thinking there is something just not right. I really doubt this is typical and just not noticed by others. With no stations full there is no tilt at all but there is also no forces or pressure acting on it so that doesnt really prove much. Its titling to the back left corner meaning its lifting on the front right. There is only the resize die and expander die to adjust in the front right and those adjustments didnt help me. It was like the resize station was all the pressure needed to create the tilt and I am certain the die wasnt hitting the shell plate. As a matter of fact it was adjust to just touch the plate when stations empty but once full it moved about 1/16 away from the plate because of the titling upward. My 650 and 550 never did this. I adjusted to touch the plate and it did even if stations were full. I sent it out today. Sucks $25 shipping and $32 insurance. I didnt want to risk no insurance because should it lost or damaged I am screwed for the total cost. I sure hope they figure it out. Dillon Rep has been awesome and their customer service is amazing so I am hopeful it all turns out well. Riggerjj: Just a tip I found on the collet system the U die uses. My decap pin was moving after just a few rounds so I tried to tighten it up and still it moved a little. I scoured it in the opposite direction of travel from it sliding up as to create score lines across it then I applied loctite 620 which is a retaining compound for dove tail sights that Dawson precision suggests. It really holds it in there and even though I didnt get to use it much now that my press is gone it seemed to do the trick. I know my buddy tried that U die and couldnt get it to stop slipping up. Edited July 2, 2015 by brian45acp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian45acp Posted July 7, 2015 Author Share Posted July 7, 2015 (edited) Well another awesome customer service experience by Dillon and the Dillon Rep here from the forum. They received my 1050 today and already diagnosed and fixed it. Apparently I was the idiot whom over adjusted the push rod for the priming system which is that rod located in the tool head. I had adjusted it much too deep and it was over stressing all the parts. They fixed the slight damage to the primer pin punch and inspected all the other associated parts to be sure no other damage was present and are sending it back this week. I offered to pay them but it was on the house and I learned another lesson. I cant believe it was something stupid and no matter how much I looked at the press and adjusted stuff it never occurred to me that was the issue. The engineer at Dillon had seen this once before so I guess we all learned from it and know next time someone has the same issue. I have to give Dillon and the rep here major praise for what they have done for me. To this date I have had a 550, 650, and now a 1050. I dont know why anyone else uses any other brand of progressive press. Edited July 7, 2015 by brian45acp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wayne Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Well, that's good news! Good folks at Dillon to be sure! Glad you shared the outcome with us. JW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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