Help track the vintage/history of a new (to me) 1911

[splitime]

Picked up a used 1911 from a collectors inventory. It passed from a collector through a second party and I'm left with basically no history/information about it.

All they knew was that it is Auto Ordnance (yes... I know their reputation, so I shot it before buying) and had trigger work done.

Picture attached as link wasn't cooperating.

So far I've observed that it has variations from a 'factory' Auto Ordnance 1911A1 (possibly competition) as follows:

Slide serations/markings removed (OR aftermarket slide)

Wilson Combat sights

Trubor (I believe thats the barrel format?) barrel with intergral comp and sight built into comp

Composite trigger

Lightened trigger

Lightened grip safety

Beautiful deep gloss blue job

I'll get more detailed pictures tonight, but ask any questions and I will do my best to recall information while away from the firearm.

Edited May 13, 2013 by splitime

[Biloxi23]

That looks like an old "RACE" gun from the early days. I have one based on a stainless Gold Cup from 1984. It is chambered in .45 ACP. I was not involved in USPSA/IPSC then so I am not sure when they began to change from .45 to .38Super. They are cool guns, but probably will no fare well against modern Open division race guns in .38 Super/Super Comp/.38 TJ and 9mm Major.

[Guest]

Nice looking old school comp'ed .45.

The trigger looks to be a graphite Chip McCormick, I have those on a couple of my old guns. I'd be suprised if that is a trubore barrel. Looks like a full length cone comp with two ports. It was a popular format and many gunsmiths made their own original design or copied others. Having the sight on the comp was common to increase the sight radius. Instead of having fogged c-more lens from the blast ejecta people sometimes had their front sight get wider from the carbon build-up with this arrangement...so the front part of the sight next to the compensator chambers would sometimes be narrowed to avoid this. Take it out and shoot it. Definately not competative in today's environment, but then again you would get major kudos for the cool factor! Might be fun to run steel challenge with it.

Try some 180 grain bullets with somethng like WST at major, that should bring a smile to your face!

Edited May 14, 2013 by Bamboo

[Powder Finger]

I'd be suprised if that is a trubore barrel. Looks like a full length cone comp with two ports. It was a popular format and many gunsmiths made their own original design or copied others.

.

+1 the long cone comps went right up to the barrel lugs and looked to be one peice

Edited May 14, 2013 by Powder Finger

[splitime]

I thankfully can already state it's a nice shooter. I will snap more pictures when I get a chance to clean it for the first time.

Thanks for thoughts about it, figured it fell into the Old race gun family some where.

[benny hill]

Used to shoot one in the late 80's like it. Want to make it BAD, then rechamber to 460 roland with 20# spring. 185 jhp @ 1600.

[splitime]

Thinking about when I was looking at the barrel last night, I think the cone comp sounds about right. I didn't fully break it down, but with the slide off the barrel did have a step in it before the lugs. And I believe the I saw a small gap/line between the barrel/crown area and the inside edge of the comp.

I should see if it'll fit my 5" holster, I forget if the end is enclosed or not and then bring it to a local club match for fun. Should get some amusing looks.

Primarily bought to introduce myself to .45 variants of the 1911, have been really enjoying my 9mm Spartan. So it'll get regular range/fun use.

Thanks again for breaking it down some with me.

Benny, please avoid putting bad ideas into my head

Edited May 14, 2013 by splitime

[lumpygravy]

Used to shoot one in the late 80's like it. Want to make it BAD - ASS, then rechamber to 460 roland with 20# spring. 185 jhp @ 1600.

@Benny: There, fixed it for you....

Benny, please avoid putting bad ideas into my head

@OP: Do it and take some night time video....

[splitime]

On a side note... what would people have paid for a dead on and so far runs like a top old Race gun like this?

I consider it my introduction to .45 1911s and thus will be mine for forever, but I'm curious as to what people would think was paid.

A little bit of "The Price is Right" in the 1911 sub forum

I also promise to "reveal" the price even if it sounds like I overpaid.

Edited May 16, 2013 by splitime

[Guest]

Not sure what that might be worth today but if you want to know about what it might have cost back in the day I can tell you that the last .45 open gun I had built by a good west coast shop in ’87 cost about $1800 including all the parts, which was a lot of money to me back then. It has sunken bomars, shortened and lighten slide, hand checkering, cut trigger guard, custom mag release, custom full profile comp, vediki trigger w/hand worked 2 lb trigger group, S&A mag well, polished slide sides, nice deep bluing with cocobolo grips built on a springfield frame and slide. A nice set-up in the day and a good shooter, too.

Gotta remember that these guns were made way before the advent of off the shelf drop in 2 lb. triggers, close tolerance firing pins and other small parts, mag buttons, guide rods and all the other stuff that we can buy off the shelf today without any sweat…plus CNC machines only existed in our dreams and the cover of Popular Mechanics mag. The old Bridgeport series I, a small engine lathe, a good set of files and stones, and a foredom was where it was at. If the shop was really cutting edge the Bridgeport had a DRO. But, all the work was done by talented hands.

Here is a post from a while back about a “Classics” or “Retro” match you might find interesting. Has a great picture of an old Nastoff gun, too.

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=114232&hl=%2Bretro+%2Bmatch#entry1296434

It would be fun to do something like this but then again I am kind of spoiled by the wimpy 165 power factor, infrequent reloads, and red-dots!

BTW – the original poster of that is a most excellent shooter and a hell of a good guy. We used to shoot together a bit when I lived in California.

[splitime]

@Bamboo - I like the way you put the era this gun is from in context. I consider myself quite new to the competition side of shooting, heck I've only been to a few outlaw events and mostly just shoot for shooting/practice/competing against myself sake. That said, there is something with this one that clicked for me.

I also can confirm it is a cone comp, end of comp is just a hair before the lugs and i can see just the faintest mark of silver solder. Someone did clean work.

Also figured out how to disassemble the guiderod setup, just needed a paperclip bent and dropped into the catch/block hole.

I think I'll work the trigger pull down on it, as little creep/reset that there is, I'd like a lighter pull. It is currently right at 4lbs, but almost 0 creep/reset.

I also found out the vintage of the gun. April 18th, 1989 it came off the line in West Hurley as a plain goverment model 1911a1 from Auto Ordnance (I know... all I can find is dislike for their quality/reliability etc...). I doubt there is much left of the original firearm though, mostly just a frame with what I believe is a hand fit non-original slide. Either that or the Auto Ordnances came really really nice and tight from the factory.

Just to put it out there, paid $590 with box/2 magazines and the extra grips. I think I did very well and the guy was happy because I didn't pick the all chrome one (another nice old race gun) that he had picked up as a package purchase with this one.

[gunnut315]

You might check the rear sight to see if is marked Behlert. I had Austin build me a bowling pin gun in 79 has the same type comp with a 2 piece guide rod. Had Swenson safety and slide release with about 1.75 lbs trigger with grip safety pined. Cost about 1500 back then

[splitime]

Will not be that one.

Rear sight is Wilson Combat non-adjustable. Unsure on safety, trigger is right at 4lbs and grip safety is disabled, but moves.

Taking it out for some pistol tree fun with friends tomorrow.

[gunnut315]

I had a red dot put on mine now. Have not shot it much lately but still fun to take out once in a while

[splitime]

Thanks for sending me down the proper path of confirming things a step at a time. Fairly sure now that the issue was the chrono to close (or some other outside factor).

Ran 10 rounds through it and did a pre-measure/post-measurement. The most setback I saw was .007.