Lock rings not "working"

[njl]

This seems to be a recurring problem on my RL550B. I'll be loading away, and eventually find that the Dillon sizing die with Dillon lock ring has come loose and backed out. I just realized this as I was gauging some ammo I loaded for upcoming matches (the first of which is this weekend).

So, I've got a couple hundred rounds of .45acp, some of which gauge, some of which stop about 0.125" from fully falling into the Dillon gauge. They can be forced in and forced out...and the same goes for my Glock barrels. The ones that don't gauge won't fall all the way in/out of the chambers, but can apparently be fully chambered by the recoil spring and easily extracted by pulling the slide open.

I'm a little worried about using these in a match, and will probably try getting to the range before the match to try out a few mags of them to make sure they run.

I tried calling Dillon support (several times), but the line's been busy. One of my thoughts was, could I reset the sizing die and run these through it again with the decapper removed? I suspect the answer is no. After failing to get through on the phone, I started doing that with one, and there was enough resistance as soon as the case hit the die, that I figured the carbide ring must be undersize relative to a finished cartridge and not suitable to try running a finished cartridge through. I decided not to try forcing it and stopped. I guess this is the sort of thing a Lee FCD can fix...but I don't have one for .45acp.

The really weird thing is, according to my Speer #14 manual and my calipers, I can't find any section of the offending cartridges that's out of spec. i.e. there's no obvious bulges, and no part of the brass appears to measure wider than spec.

I know that Dillon's gauges (at least in .45acp) are ultra conservative. I'm on my second one. I sent the first back because most of my ammo wouldn't gauge, and when I tried factory ammo in it, that wouldn't gauge either. I don't think the second one is much looser than the first.

I suppose another possibility is the brass is fine and the bullets are hitting the rifling. I guess I'll go load one extra long and see exactly how long these (PD 185gr JHP) can be and still chamber.

[Sarge]

The gauge won't tell you if they are too long. Only the chamber and mags can do that. I would lean towards the brass not being sized all the way down even though they are all within spec.

I have found the occasional "tighter than I would like in the chamber" round and they all cycled fine in practice. But I hate to tell you not to worry about them and then have one lock your gun up in a match. So you are on your own there.

As for the dies. Once you get your load set and you are going to stay with it put some blue thread locker on the dies and rings.

[njl]

The sizing die seems to be the most frequent one to come loose, and is the hardest to deal with fixing after the rounds are loaded. Is there any reason not to just do that (blue loctite) on the sizing dies for each caliber, figuring I'll never need to adjust that one?

[Racer377]

Consider upgrading to the Hornady rings. No loctite required and they will not budge once set, and they're easy to adjust when you want.

[Sarge]

Blue loctite is fine for the vibration these dies get. It will come loose if needed.

I wonder if even some teflon tape or something along those lines would keep the dies tight longer.

I don't loctite mine but I have gotten in the habit of checking them every time I go to the loading room to use the press.

[phearkno1]

Before you try loctite. Get your sizing die where you want it, run a case into the sizing die and with the ram still up tighten down the lock ring then with a wrench. The pressure from the ram being up will help you get it tighter.

Edited January 2, 2013 by phearkno1

[Sarge]

They still work loose. Mine probably shakes loose every 5000 rounds or so if I don't keep an eye on it..

[njl]

Before you try loctite. Get your sizing die where you want it, run a case into the sizing die and with the ram still up tighten down the lock ring then with a wrench. The pressure from the ram being up will help you get it tighter.

All the dies are supposed to have the lock ring tightened with the ram up and a case in the die. I always do it that way. The sizer still comes loose.

[njl]

The gauge won't tell you if they are too long. Only the chamber and mags can do that. I would lean towards the brass not being sized all the way down even though they are all within spec.

I was pretty sure that was the case, but dropped a bullet through the gauge to make sure it was so.

I have found the occasional "tighter than I would like in the chamber" round and they all cycled fine in practice. But I hate to tell you not to worry about them and then have one lock your gun up in a match. So you are on your own there.

I made a quick trip to the range. At home, I'd loaded up a mag full of just the worst of them (that I've seen)...all ones that stuck out of the gauge about 1/8". All of them and several more mags from that batch fed through my G21 and G30 just fine.

[njl]

Ok...so I took apart all my .45s to test these bullets in the barrels. My Springfield 1911 is the pickiest. It needs the PD 185gr JHP seated to 1.160" for the bullet to not hit the rifling. That's virtually all the bearing surface of the bullet inside the case. The Glocks only need them seated to 1.200" to not hit the rifling.

So...I have several hundred rounds loaded to 1.210" and a Glock match this weekend in which I plan to shoot the 21 and 30, preferably with this ammo. I'm tempted to run these rounds back through stations 3 and 4 to shorten them to 1.200" and consider them "Glock-only ammo". I'd been loading them to that OAL initially, but found that a couple of my G21 mags wouldn't feed the G30 reliably unless I went longer (1.210") on the OAL. It hadn't occurred to me to chamber-check the slightly longer OAL. When I have more time, I guess I should load some to 1.160", chrono them, and see if the Glocks (and 1911) will feed them.

This really belongs in the .45 reloading section now...I think I'll repost this part of it there.

[Boxerglocker]

Before you try loctite. Get your sizing die where you want it, run a case into the sizing die and with the ram still up tighten down the lock ring then with a wrench. The pressure from the ram being up will help you get it tighter.

All the dies are supposed to have the lock ring tightened with the ram up and a case in the die. I always do it that way. The sizer still comes loose.

Need to eat more Wheaties then, LOL. Seriously alot of guys have the same issue and in most cases they under torque the lock rings. I have torqued literally thousands upon thousands of 7/8 - 18 aviation spark plugs on aluminum head piston cylinders in my aviation career. The standard torque on those is 35 foot lbs. Just for grins I decided to check the torque on my XL650 dies by feel and then using a digital torque wrench for the actual breakaway torque. 23-26 foot lbs was I got. I literally haven't removed my 9mm dies since the time I installed them. I use inspectors torque putty on them just as a visual should they break loose, never have.

If your using the crappy Dillon die wrench throw it away, get a short stubby 7-8 inch open end/box combo wrench and don't be afraid to give it a little muscle.

Edited January 4, 2013 by Boxerglocker