.45 GAP Reloading report

[Carlos]

I did it and it works!! There is some good news and some bad: read below.

While I do not own a gun chambered in .45 GAP, I do own a 625 that I may someday shoot in USPSA if I can get around to ordering a holster & mooclip holders. I was curious about the discussion of .45 GAP in the 625 so I "stole" 14 pieces of GAP brass from the local GSSF match - I say stole because the match is a "lost brass match" & I got some VERY stern looks from other GSSF competitors & one of them even complained of a "GAP brass thief" at Waldorf (guilty as charged) and went so far as to publish a faked photo on GlockTalk.com 's GSSF forum! The things I do in the name of science.

After escaping with the 14 pieces of "hot" GAP brass, I found data on www.hodgdon.com for loading GAP with Titegroup. The data calls for the use of the electroplated GoldDot bullet from Speer. Electroplated GoldDots are spendy & I already had some WestCoast Bullet 200 grain roundnose TMJ bullets so I substituted those for the electroplated Speers. Start point was (I blieve) 4.1 grns of Titegroup & it went up from there; start pressure is supposed to be 18,300 PSI - well inside .45ACP limits (as was the MAX load). Even the start load just exceeds USPSA major of 825 FPS for a 200 grn bullet. To safely exceed that, I loaded 4.3 grns of Titegroup. This was less than max but is supposed to be over major. The OAL was (I believe) a minimum of 1.080". I went longer to 1.095" as there is more than ample room & I wanted to keep pressures safe. Lee resizing dies & oneshot caselube were used.

Now some bad news: the Lee factory crimp die would not adjust far enough down to touch the GAP case. However, the carbide ring still siz-crimped the case & I was using it in a revolver where setback would not be a problem (but bullet pull might be).

Loaded these up on moonclips & more bad news: they were loosely held & could fall off the clip if dropped. Turns out the extractor groove on an ACP case is about .395", while the grrove on the GAP is about .386". I think they could still work though.

As for shooting, only 14 rounds does not leave one with much of an impression other than "quite nice". Seemed to kick less than a 200 grain Montana load I had on hand.

Velocity? I can't say as the chrono was used indoors & only 2 of the 14 rounds registered (2 is not a significant number of rounds to tell us what velocity was). However, both read close to 900 FPS which is what the Hodgdon.com data predicts. No pressure signs, no bullet pull, & velocity seemed OK. Needs further testing as 14 is not enough for a real test but I can say that initial results are promising. Regards, C.

[Bear1142]

Carlos,

See, this is what happens when you send a lawyer to do a JBT's job. You should have put on your black ninja outfit to preserve your OP-SEC. Then you'd have your plausible deniability intact when the photos were published. Call me next time you have a Black-Op mission.

Erik (not my real name)

[B.J. Norris]

After that I just had to go look at GT.

[Carlos]

BJ & Bear - back me up on this - that photo on GlockTalk was faked! My wrists are HALF that size!

As for the JBTs well, I can't comment on a certain 4 letter bureau anymore since "they" is now "us", having joined the Department w/ the DHS reorg. Funny thing is, I have not yet been issued either my jackboots OR my ninja-outfit! Government efficiency my ass. Regards, C (not my real name either).

PS Eric - thanks for the offer on one free trial Blackops; maybe I'll stick to lawyering instead of strange adventures in reloading. C U at the Blast.

[jcmios]

I load the 45GAP on my Dillon 650 with Lee dies including the FCD. The FCD will adjust down far enough to crimp the case with room to spare. Dillon now also sells a drop tube adapter for the 45GAP for both the 650 and 1050. I have loaded over 2000 rounds and all function 100% in the gun and measure within specs on the calipers.

I load using AA#5 though only Hodgdon powders have official listed data. Lost of info can be found at WWW.45GAP.COM.

Jim

[stockton]

Started shooting .45 GAP in my Smith Revo last month. Using Dillon 650 with Lee deluxe pistol dies (the setup with the FCD). The FCD WILL go low enough to crimp proper with a LITTLE room to spare. The tough die is the decapper/resizer die. That will BARELY go deep enough to get a good, full length resize.

I have identified SIX, count 'em...SIX advantages to GAP loads for the 625.

I am shooting IDPA right now, so all I need is 125pf. I like HEAVY, slow bullets in .45, so I am trying to settle into a 230gr load clocking around 600fps. I have used a Precision 230gr RN loaded with 2.5 (NOT a typo...that's 2.5!) grains of Clays. I am still getting about 620fps in my 625. I am going to ty out 2.4 and 2.3 loads as well. With such a low pressure round, and moonclips, my brass should last forever! (advantage 1) Also, my 8lbs of powder will go a LOT farther!!! Advantage #2, thank you.

Was using Fed primers, but Win seem to ignite just as easy. Apparently, small primers go bang a LOT easier than large. I am planning to shorten my strain screw a bit to lighten things up (already down to 6lbs, with 100% reliability). I am hoping to get down to 5lb pull. That would be advantage #3.

I LOVE the reloads with the GAP brass. Being considerably shorter, it drops out and flicks in MUCH easier than ACP. I am going to borrow a reamer to take the chambers .002 over and I am told the cases will then just fall out, no need to use the ejector rod! Woo hoo! Advantage #4!

I was trying to get a .45 ACP load I liked, but really wanted to use Clays. (My IDPA CDP 165pf load is 3.8 gr Clays under Precision 230 RN.) However, while going down to 3.0 gr of Clays got me to 571fps avg in the ACP case, the Std Dev was too high for my taste. What was happening, was I was just getting too low on the pressure curve for Clays. Real sooty.

I did get a Titegroup load of 3.1 grs that worked nicely in ACP and made pf consistent at about 595fps, but the Clays in the GAP brass yielded noticeably softer recoil even at higher the 620fps velocity! Advantage #5!!! With the other big advantage of faster reloads, it was a no brainer.

Now, the GAP brass is a little more loose in the moonclips, but I have had NO problems with the loaded rounds falling out. They load into the clips quite a bit easier, which I would consider advantage #6.

FYI, 3.0gr of Clays on the Precision 230 RN, yielded a 162pf. But I am not certain where the pressure is sitting, so I am not certain I would want to make a major PF load in the GAP with Clays.

[dajarrel]

I am going to borrow a reamer to take the chambers .002 over and I am told the cases will then just fall out, no need to use the ejector rod!  Woo hoo!  Advantage #4!

STockton,

I could be wrong here but I don't believe you will gain any advantage by boring your charge holes out .002". What will happen is that the brass will "fire-form" to whatever size hole it is in. A shooting buddy of mine accidentally put a moon clip of .40 S&W in his 625. They all fired but every one of them had been expanded to the size of the charge hole.

It could make your sizing die a pain to use.

I would suggest you look at one that has already been reamed to ensure that is what you want.

FWIW

dj

[stockton]

The trick is the LOW pressure of the round. A .40 works at higher pressures and will fire form. The ACP and GAP just don'r operate at that high of pressures to expand very much.

And, the guy I am borrowing the reamer from is an EXCELLENT local gunsmith and picked up the trick (and the reamer) from Miculek! If its good enough for Jerry, its good enough for me!

If Jerry's out there, mayber he can confirm this trick...

[dajarrel]

I understand it is a lower pressure, I guess I would have never figured it not expanding. Does the brass have alot of soot on if from gases coming back?

Hey,

whatever works, use it!!!!

dj

[sensei]

Started shooting .45 GAP in my Smith Revo last month. Using Dillon 650 with Lee deluxe pistol dies (the setup with the FCD). The FCD WILL go low enough to crimp proper with a LITTLE room to spare. The tough die is the decapper/resizer die. That will BARELY go deep enough to get a good, full length resize.

I have identified SIX, count 'em...SIX advantages to GAP loads for the 625.

I am shooting IDPA right now, so all I need is 125pf. I like HEAVY, slow bullets in .45, so I am trying to settle into a 230gr load clocking around 600fps. I have used a Precision 230gr RN loaded with 2.5 (NOT a typo...that's 2.5!) grains of Clays. I am still getting about 620fps in my 625. I am going to ty out 2.4 and 2.3 loads as well. With such a low pressure round, and moonclips, my brass should last forever! (advantage 1) Also, my 8lbs of powder will go a LOT farther!!! Advantage #2, thank you.

Was using Fed primers, but Win seem to ignite just as easy. Apparently, small primers go bang a LOT easier than large. I am planning to shorten my strain screw a bit to lighten things up (already down to 6lbs, with 100% reliability). I am hoping to get down to 5lb pull. That would be advantage #3.

I LOVE the reloads with the GAP brass. Being considerably shorter, it drops out and flicks in MUCH easier than ACP. I am going to borrow a reamer to take the chambers .002 over and I am told the cases will then just fall out, no need to use the ejector rod! Woo hoo! Advantage #4!

I was trying to get a .45 ACP load I liked, but really wanted to use Clays. (My IDPA CDP 165pf load is 3.8 gr Clays under Precision 230 RN.) However, while going down to 3.0 gr of Clays got me to 571fps avg in the ACP case, the Std Dev was too high for my taste. What was happening, was I was just getting too low on the pressure curve for Clays. Real sooty.

I did get a Titegroup load of 3.1 grs that worked nicely in ACP and made pf consistent at about 595fps, but the Clays in the GAP brass yielded noticeably softer recoil even at higher the 620fps velocity! Advantage #5!!! With the other big advantage of faster reloads, it was a no brainer.

Now, the GAP brass is a little more loose in the moonclips, but I have had NO problems with the loaded rounds falling out. They load into the clips quite a bit easier, which I would consider advantage #6.

FYI, 3.0gr of Clays on the Precision 230 RN, yielded a 162pf. But I am not certain where the pressure is sitting, so I am not certain I would want to make a major PF load in the GAP with Clays.

Very good, .....

Thank you for your report,

One question:

Have you tried different brands of brass cases ? .... cause i've heard some of them are too loose in the moonclips, ....

There is a brand of cases better than another ? (Speer, Starline, Remington, Pmc, ......)

[sensei]

No particular Brand preference ?

This question it is to don't take a bunch of wrong kind of .45 GAP brass cases.

[dauntedfuture]

I think that you will need to make 165 PF for IDPA in ESR if your shooting moon clips.

Edited November 11, 2011 by dauntedfuture

[GlockCanMan]

I have been setting up and working with the 45gap also. My local club won't allow me to use the GAP brass. It is not considered legal and against IDPA rules. TK Custom makes moon clips just for this cartridge. They do work a lot better than the standard .45acp moon clips.

When I get the gun back I will be using it mainly for ICORE and USPSA, and possibly some steel shooting.

I have had my 5" 625 cylinder chamfered and am in the process of of polishing up the cylinder walls, but was not aware of people actually reaming out the walls. I will have to research this more.