Garfield Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 Hi, Ok here it goes. To understand this you have to know that here in NL no civilian can own a gun of any kind, except under certain very specific conditions. In practice, a criminal can get hold of a gun within a few days, but law-awebiding citizens can own a gun after over year of almost weekly registered practice and several screening sessions. A few months ago an ex-marine and member of a shooting club killed some family members. Two days ago some idiot shot his ex-girlfriend dead, two other people and finally killed himself. He was also member of a shooting club. Now, don't get me wrong, these are really very tragic events, but that's not what I want to go into right now. The fact is that these two incidents were the only one where people who legally owned firarms have committed crimes with them for a very long time. I follow every news item about firearm related crime here in NL, and with the exception of the above two incidents they are all about ILLEGAL firearms. But, now some politicians smell easily earned votes, as they this morning started raving about shooting clubs and that measures must be taken. Quote: "Already too many slaughters have been committed by members of shooting clubs". Here in NL the public opinion towards guns is very sensitive, mostly because of uninformedness. I know, because I once had my prejudices as well. So I fear that there is a real risk that our already very limited possibilities will be limited even more in the very near future. The politicians that are in the news now are members of three different parties, two of which are the biggest in NL. I am angry at the shooters firstly because they killed people in the first place, secondly because they did so being a member of a very small group of people having certain precious rights and thus endangering the rights of the group as a whole. And finally I am angry at those badly informed politicians who just seem to be hunting for easily earned votes, without focussing on the real issues: crimes committed with ILLEGAL firearms. I really fear that I might have to emigrate out of this country some day. Thanks for listening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 I really fear that I might have to emigrate out of this country some day. If guns get banned in The Netherlands, I'm moving to friggin' Arizona! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 It's always a terribly small few idiots who ruin it for the hugely anonymous, responsible and innocent MANY. I can't stand it either. It happens around HERE with regularity. Dumb domestic abuse criminals killing their wives (or the whole family) or some low-life loser with a temper out on the street stabbing people (sometimes to death) with concealed knives... or shooting others (sometimes LEOs) with stolen or illegal (they're felons who shouldn't have guns) firearms. It's just all too common. In some earlier time, or more remote place, we would've despatched these losers quickly and thrown them into some remote ravine to be consumed by Nature's various scavengers. But no...! We put them in jail--which is on a tight leash budget-wise--and they get released the following day to go commit more crimes. It's sickening in the highest degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tightloop Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 We have become too civilized. Now we can't do anything constructive because of all the limitations imposed because we wanted everyone to get their way. The wayin nature is the big eat the little, the weak die or are killed by the strong, those that can't defend themselves die or get eaten...we should let get back to that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 If guns get banned in The Netherlands, I'm moving to friggin' Arizona! From what I just read, it sounds like they already are (effectively) banned, with your gov't allowing some of you to have them for games and such. If you can't own and carry them just because you feel like it, then they're pretty much banned! If you're serious, why wait for the last scrap to be taken away? Move now and the sooner you can exercise your inherent human rights without nearly as much fear of retribution from the gov't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiG Lady Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 <shameless flag-waving mode> For all our goofy global reputation and diverse corruptions, the United States has much to offer. Not the least of which is the decency of many of its people and the freedoms we have and are struggling to retain. Please feel welcome here should you choose to make that move. </shameless flag-waving mode> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRD Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 Well said, Lady. You are indeed welcome here, Garfield, as are all freedom-loving people. Leave that suffocating oppression behind and come to America, where we are only marginally oppressed...but at least the battle is still on over here. - Gabe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 If you're serious, why wait for the last scrap to be taken away? Move now and the sooner you can exercise your inherent human rights without nearly as much fear of retribution from the gov't. For all our goofy global reputation and diverse corruptions, the United States has much to offer. Not the least of which is the decency of many of its people and the freedoms we have and are struggling to retain. Please feel welcome here should you choose to make that move. Why does that sound GREAT!!!??? Thanks guys. Once I have my masters degree, I'll seriously check the possibilities. Of course, you must understand you WILL get another LAWYER over there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongHair1957 Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 Damn...knew that there was a catch! Maybe you could be a firearms rights attourney! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRD Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 Maybe you could be a firearms rights attourney! We could use a few more of those - Gabe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spook Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 LOL, sounds like a great job. Or I could just promise to get a decent job once I get there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DogmaDog Posted April 20, 2004 Share Posted April 20, 2004 "Laws that seek to prevent criminal acts by restricting the rights of the law abiding in no sense "fight crime". Rather, they are a sign of a society in full retreat from crime." paraphrased from "A Nation of Cowards" by Jeff Snyder DD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmitz Posted April 21, 2004 Share Posted April 21, 2004 I agree on DD's quote, but I'm too old to move and start all over again, established a firm etc. My guess is, staying over here in the Netherlands, that I will have to give up my rights to use arms for IPSC-shooting only. Garfield and Spook are still young, it's easier for them to leave. I don't know what's happening in/to my country and I don't understand the politicians anymore (just vote-hunting???) This tiny, small country I used to be a proud citizen of the Netherlands, but that's in the past!) For me there's just one more alternative (prepare a 356); racing a vintage Porsche 356 in f.i. the Ralley des Alpes or the Ralley des Ardennes, same kick as IPSC-shooting, but still: I'll miss IPSC and our local matches. DVC, Henny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted April 21, 2004 Share Posted April 21, 2004 You're never too old, Henny! Hey ... maybe you could move to Finland? Fairly close to you and it seems like they have (at least on a personal level) a bit more respect for gun ownership than less enlightened European countries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmitz Posted April 21, 2004 Share Posted April 21, 2004 Rhino, Great Powder VV, to close to Poetin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhino Posted April 21, 2004 Share Posted April 21, 2004 But just think ... you could learn to do PRACTICAL Biathlon by patrolling the border on your skis with with your Valmet slung on your back! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
schmitz Posted April 21, 2004 Share Posted April 21, 2004 Rhino, hahahaha, No Valmet for me I'm a S_V addict ! Holstered on my hip! When my g'ment bans guns, I'll visit this site always 'cause it brings joy! Bye for now! DVC, Henny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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