zzt
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Posts posted by zzt
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The 100gr SuperVel ammo makes 137 PF in my 16.1" Leadstar barrel. It won't function in my 2011 Open gun with 6V recoil spring. My 124gr, 134 PF 9mm minor load (5" barrel) makes 168 PF in the 16.1" barrel. Both are flat shooting.
Flat shooting for USPSA requires speed. The 100gr @ 1377fps has almost no dot movement and a laser-like trajectory. Sighted at 25 yards, you are on at 50 with less than 1/4" high in between, and 1/4" low at 59. Same for the 124gr @ 1359fps. No more that 1/4" high or low between 25 and 61 yards.
My dot does not move with a 147gr @ 985fps (out of 5" barrel), No idea of the fps out of a 16.1", but it is higher. I can put 20 rounds into a 2" circle at 25 yards as fast as I can pull the trigger. Recoil in a 5.5 lb. gun is significant. Trajectory in no where near as flat as the two previous loads.
Less velocity with any of these loads means more dot movement, but softer recoil.
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On a lark I chrono'd my 9mm minor ammo today. 124gr Plated over 4.4gr AA2 @ 1.135" OAL. 134 PF out of a 5" 2011, and 168 PF out of my 16" PCC barrel.
I'm not as daring as @shred so I'm not shooting my 184 PF major ammo out of my PCC. 10.8gr AA7 under a 115 JHP. It goes and average of 1600fps out of a 5" barrel. I can't imagine what that would be out of a 16" barrel.
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Some thoughts: first, if you use SWMP or AA7 for 9 major, the case is not filled to the top. Nothing slings out when the shell plate turns. Second: there are TWO advantages to 38SC. One is it is a straight walled case. NICE. The other is case capacity. HUGE. You can fit any powder you want and a small fridge in there. You CAN get it to shoot soft AND flat at the same time. You can come close with 9 major, but you have to settle for one or the other, or some of each.
All of the matches I shoot are lost brass matches. Some actually are. The rest are for me, because my back will not stand up to the constant bending. So, 17 cents for 38SC to be used once and left, vs. 5.5 cents for fully processed, once fired, same HS 9mm brass also left on the ground. $1190 vs. $385 per year. The $805 delta is significant enough for me to stick with 9mm. If someone were to give me 20k 38SC brass, I rechamber one of my 9mm guns and shoot 38SC.
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6 hours ago, motosapiens said:
I wrote to PD about it but haven’t heard back. fwiw we have sot 8-10k of these same bullets previously without issues, so this appears to just be a bad batch.
Hope so. I just received 4900 115 JHP V2s. Just started to load them. So far, no gunk.
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Coco, there are some strange opinions here. You are 75 and don't want to do the brass chicken dance after every match. I didn't either. That's why I went 9 major. Once you rebarrel, you will never shoot 38SC again, unless you have a little left over.
Buy a one piece barrel/comp from Brazos and have a good smith fit it to your existing slide. It will last longer than you and you'll never have to re-Loctite a comp. As far as 9mm being hard on the gun, I see no evidence of that. My major load was 10.8gr SWMP under a 115 JHP for 175 PF. I have no idea how many I've shot, but it is a lot. Just recently I ran out and substituted AA7. I had none left from last year, so I hurriedly loaded some up with 10.8gr. After two matches I'm wondering why the dot is jumping so much. I chrono's and found the 115 JHPs were going 1600fps, 184 PF. No damage to the gun at all. I'll be pulling the remainder and loading softer.
I buy fully processed, once fired, roll sixed, resized, swaged, polished same HS brass for 5.5 cents each. I generally buy 6k at a time. I was down to 5k primers and had the opportunity to buy 5k new Win+P HS brass primed with lead free primers for 14.4 cents each delivered. My SDs for 10 and 20 round strings are always less the 6. There is absolutely no reason to use mixed HS, range pickup brass for major. I'll admit I do just that for 132 PF minor and 100 PF sub-minor.
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Yeah, HAPs are notorious for that. I used to clean them out with the equivalent of a dental pick. Later I found it did not affect accuracy, so I quit. The Zero clones of that bullet do not have the problem. Nor do Everglades or PD.
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I don't buy the price argument against painting. Steel Target paint has gone up in price, but $65 per case/12 is not exorbitant. We go through an average of 3 cans per stage for a 70 gun shoot. The club I shoot most often at charges $20 for the first gun and $10 for the second. They have enough money to buy new targets, make new bays, improve the grounds, host the State match and still have enough left over to award $3000 in cash prizes at the end of the season.
BTW, if you shake it well, Steel Target paint works when it is 22 deg.
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If you want to ream or throat nitrided barrels you need a carbide reamer. They are expensive. You can rent them. I'm told you can do it with a tool steel reamer, but it will be dull when finished.
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Every club I shoot SCSA steel challenge at paints between EVERY shooter. None allow a two gun shooter to shoot back to back (LI). Nobody gripes. Even on squads of 5 shooters/ten guns everything gets painted and things move along.
Non-SCSA matches like falling steel, outlaw and the like rarely paint at all. Best case they paint for the next squad.
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6 hours ago, je85 said:
I wanted to experiment with some 115gr but the needed powder to make PF is higher then I’d like. If we had a 160pf requirement I’d definitely give them a try.
I use 115 JHPs under 10.8gr AA7 Powder at 1.161" OAL. Case is mostly full, but powder doesn't spill out when the shell plate turns.
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I've completely given up on Aftec types. Now I use only EGW HD extractors. They run 100% and last seemingly forever. I will not that for 9mm I have them custom milled so the are 9mm specific, not 9/40.
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8 hours ago, Thomas918 said:
Where are you getting your JHP?
Precision Delta.
7 hours ago, shred said:Most coated bullets these days aren't hard-cast (or not very), which is not a bad thing.
Rogers PC coated bullets are 21 Brinell. Most are between 15 and 18, still hard. Even Berry's uses 15 Brinell lead for their plated bullets.
I agree with you on the Precision coated. Slick and more accurate than most. I use them in 40 and 45. Unfortunately, they are gone and I only have 2k left.
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You are going to have to experiment. A lot of gas will be shooting up from those ports. That will bleed off velocity. With too slow a powder you may drive the muzzle down. I'd start in the middle of the range using a 124 JHP over a middle load of AutoComp. See what that does to the muzzle, and what the PF is. Adjust powder charge up or down to fine tune. If you are making too much gas with AutoComp, drop down to AA2. It is a little faster. My 132 PF load is 124 JHP over 4.5gr AA2. It shoots soft and flat. I only have two poppels. You have seven. So you won't reach 132 with my load.
Before I went to a slower powder for more gas than AutoComp, I'd try 115gr JHPs.
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14 hours ago, beastmode_05 said:
i guess that was more along the line of what i'm really trying to figure out what are the disadvantage and advantages to coated vs plated
All coated bullets smell when fired. HiTech is the worst. Coated bullets start life as hard cast lead bullets. Diameters vary. Coating thickness varies. Some brands are infamous for leading the barrel. They are less accurate than good plated of jacketed. If you shoot them at steel they break up into larger chunks than plated or jacketed, and they fly father.
Good cast lead/coated bullets are expensive. Same with plated. The majority of the makers of really good coated and plated bullets went out of business. If you are going to be paying 9 or 10 cents each for bullets, why not use all JHPs. They don't foul comps and poppels. They don't lead your bore. They don't smoke. They don't smell. They are super accurate.
I buy JHPs in bulk for 9.5 cents each, delivered. Berry's plated on sale, or inexpensive coated are going to be between 9 and 10 cents after tax and shipping. Why bother?
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14 hours ago, beastmode_05 said:
i looked at JEM a while ago i didnt know they werent offering the short blocks thats good to know. im just not a huge fan of the brazos slide cuts
You can have Bob use a bald slide for the short block and make your own lightening cuts.
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3 minutes ago, donnyglock said:
Unfortunately full builds are taking 100% of the time.
Not a bad place to be.
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2 hours ago, donnyglock said:
Never been a fan of JEM stuff.
Do you make short blocks?
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1 hour ago, beastmode_05 said:
its not worth the investment get a GEM or Brazos shortblock and put it together the shortblock gives you a fitted frame/slide/barrel which are the parts that need REAL fitting
I do not believe JEM Guns currently makes short blocks. I sent a barrel to him so he could make me a short block. His short block requires additional fitting. Additionally, his marching, especially inside the dust cover leaves something to be desired.
I have worked with three Brazos Open short blocks. One was all STI parts. The next two were Brazos slide and frame with his Barsto Open barrel. Absolutely zero fitting required with either.
Side note: Brazos now machined his frames for Cheely's e2 grip. If you want a plastic grip, you will have to fight mightily to get it on. The frame will likely require modification.
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3 hours ago, IHAVEGAS said:
It would be interesting to select rounds 0.005 above and below target and see if you could tell any difference. I assume that something would be seen on the chrono but I don't know that a change to either feel or accuracy would be noticeable.
I suspect it would only show up in SDs. I did shoot a bunch of the minor ammo loaded with the Lee at an outlaw action/steel match. Some of them were bound to be +/- .005". I did not notice anything. I was concentrating on the targets. I'll measure some more and shoot them to see if they feel any different. I'm not sure that will tell anything. There are going to be pressure differences in all the same OAL ammo, because of the relatively large variation in case capacity.
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16 hours ago, Joel_x said:
I only have the one stem for BSD. It’s tapered to “align” the bullet before seating. I have tried with and without the spring in the BSD.
If you have too much bell in the case mouth after expanding, it will cause problems.
In any case, I'd suggest switching to a Mr. Bulletfeeder two step expander/funnel and changing the stem on your seating die. That will eliminate the need to 'align' the bullet before seating. No 'bell' is required with the MBF expander.
You may also consider going to a Hornady seating die. It aligns the bullet no matter what stem you use.
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8 hours ago, dmshozer1 said:
Maybe I should try working out during the week?
I would say it is essential. No matter how hard I work, I cannot gain, I only cannot lose. Very frustrating.
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1 hour ago, Joel_x said:
seating and crimping are 2 different dies…. Seating stem contours well over the precision deltas. I even polished it last year to make sure it wasn’t sticking on bullet or something.
Seating stem 'contours well' over PDs doesn't mean anything. If the PDs are as dimensionally accurate as you say, switch to a flat stem. See what happens. What is your crimp die?
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5 hours ago, Joel_x said:
I would love to see a video of someone making sub .001” dev ammo and measure them as they come off the press for 50 round with mixed brass as some state.
Okay. I just went down and measured a random sample of 20 of my 9 major rounds. Every one was between 1,162" and 1.163". I load on a Hornady LnL with a case feeder and a bullet feeder. I seat with a Hornady seater and crimp with a Lee FCD. I use 115 HAP or Zero JHP bullets. I do use fully processed, once fired, same HS brass for major. I load with the sizing/decapping die removed. I would never accept a +/- .005" deviation.
I load minor with mixed range pick up brass that has been roll sized and processed. I don't sort anything. The only brass I chuck is stepped brass, and then only if I catch it at the first station. On the Hornady with Berry's plated, not more than .001 OAL difference. With RMR plated seconds, I get as much as .002" variation.
Loading on a squishy Lee 6-pac pro with RMR JHPs, I mostly get a .001" variation when I operate the press correctly. I get more if I don't get the stroke right. There is no hard bottom at the end of the stroke. I'll get 2 or 3% up to .004" under and the same for .005 over. The press is new, so I'm still working on getting the setup perfect.
Again, it has to be you or something in your setup. PD v2 JHPs are decent bullets, so I don't think they are the problem. You might try changing your seating die stem. I once had an OAL problem and changing the stem to a different profile cured it. I'm out of the Zeros now, and HAPs are not available at anything approaching reasonable pricing. I just received 4900 PD 115 v2 JHPs. We'll see how that goes. They have a rounded profile, instead of the truncated cone profile of the HAPs and Zeros.
Another thought, if you are crimping with a seater/crimp die, make sure the seater stem is way out of the picture. I use an FCD for crimping all calibers, so that isn't a problem.
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23 minutes ago, Joe4d said:
you must not own rim fires..
its not the breaking of the pin, but dry firing will very much peen the side of the chamber and it doesnt take much..
I agree with the bag thing,, when carbines were allowed they shoulda just made a few edits and made trigger guard covering case, the same as a trigger guard covering holster..I own several rimfires and shoot RFPO and RFRO in SCSA. You don't hammer down for rimfires. I was referring to PCC shooters afraid of breaking the firing pin.
Barrel reaming
in 9mm/38 Caliber
Posted
If you are just throating, stop when the flutes hit the front chamber wall. Easy to tell when. If actually chambering, use go and no-go plugs.